Nissan IDS concept shows Next Gen Leaf with 60kwh

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evnow

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http://www.hybridcars.com/ids-concept-foreshadows-60-kwh-2018-nissan-leaf/

Based on LG chem batteries, fits in Gen 1 Leaf, looks like.

http://www.autonews.com/article/20151027/OEM04/151029842/nissan-ids-concept-an-autonomous-driving-transformer

Better battery

Nissan has equipped the IDS Concept with a 60 kilowatt-hour lithium ion battery that is undergoing road tests and promises to dramatically boost range. The upcoming battery, which executives say is close to being production-ready, doubles the density of the latest 30 kilowatt-hour pack in the Leaf.

“A prototype vehicle with the 60 kilowatt-hour battery is already running around with a numbered license plate,” said Takao Asami, Nissan Alliance global vice president for research and advanced engineering. “From a technical point of view, the technology is already available. We still have to go through production engineering and product engineering phase.”

Engineers improved on that battery by switching to a manganese, nickel and cobalt chemistry for the cathode, from the current base of manganese-nickel. They also devised a better electrolyte, which improves the battery’s life span.

The new battery technology allows Nissan to pack 288 cells into the same space currently occupied by 192 cells.

Nissan gave the car wireless battery recharging.

Nissan-IDS_Concept-2015-wallpaper.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-TLo86K7Ck

Press Release


Tokyo Motor Show 2015: Nissan's vision for the future of EVs and autonomous driving

Oct. 28 – Tokyo – Today at the Tokyo Motor Show 2015, Nissan Motor Corporation unveiled a concept vehicle that embodies the company's vision of the future of autonomous driving and zero emission EVs: the Nissan IDS Concept.

Presenting at the show, Nissan president and CEO Carlos Ghosn said: "Nissan's forthcoming technologies will revolutionize the relationship between car and driver, and future mobility."

The Nissan IDS Concept

After leading the development and expansion of EV technology, Nissan once again stands at the forefront of automotive technology.

By integrating advanced vehicle control and safety technologies with cutting-edge artificial intelligence (AI), Nissan is among the leaders developing practical, real-world applications of autonomous drive technology.

In August 2013, Ghosn said that by 2020 Nissan plans to equip innovative autonomous drive technology on multiple vehicles. Progress is well on track to achieve this goal.

Inside the Nissan IDS Concept

Nissan Intelligent Driving is Nissan's concept of autonomous drive technology and represents what Nissan believes next-generation vehicles should be.

"Nissan Intelligent Driving improves a driver's ability to see, think and react. It compensates for human error, which causes more than 90 percent of all car accidents.

As a result, time spent behind the wheel is safer, cleaner, more efficient and more fun," continued Ghosn.

The 44th Tokyo Motor Show opens to the public on October 30, with Nissan showcasing a host of new concept cars technologies.
 
Looks awful. I hate this narrow slit window cars that people think somehow look good. Zero visibility doesn't make it look good to me.
 
edatoakrun said:
evnow said:
http://www.hybridcars.com/ids-concept-foreshadows-60-kwh-2018-nissan-leaf/
...

Source of that report, with more detail:

http://dailykanban.com/2015/10/2nd-gen-leaf-expected-2018-60kwh-nmc-battery-300-mile-range-autonomous-cfrp/
Original source is a good find. I'd be careful of hybridcars.com Jeff the author there and at gm-volt.com is very sensitive to any comments that don't praise his writing. I often see no comments on his stories, which I think is the way he likes it.
 
Here's Nissan's (I think) YouTube intro for the IDS : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-TLo86K7Ck

I can't imagine much of the interior making it into production but I like the body style - faint echos of the Skyline or GT-R maybe?
 
The cars that look aggressive are the in thing now. Others are called "ugly". Crouching big cat like stance with thin " eyes" win over people as if they want to go on a hunt.
 
I just watched the video. The car looks better in motion, but...am I the only one with no desire whatsoever for a steering wheel (and brake pedal?) that goes into hiding and takes three seconds to return? An awful lot can happen in three seconds.
 
edatoakrun said:
Source of that report, with more detail:

http://dailykanban.com/2015/10/2nd-gen-leaf-expected-2018-60kwh-nmc-battery-300-mile-range-autonomous-cfrp/
Thanks for the link. The photograph of a 60-kWh battery which looks just like the 24-kWh battery in my LEAF is what impressed me. With 288 cells in the new battery, I conclude the system voltage is unchanged and the modules now have an arrangement of three cells in parallel and two of these triples stacked in series (just like the Chevy Volt).

There was also a picture of a slide covering charging times which baffled me: It indicated the 30-kWh battery (I suppose in the MY2016) can be charged in 14 minutes from a 50-kW charger. Sorry, but a 50-kW charger can only deliver about 12 kWh in 14 minutes.

While I like the overall look of the concept, I'm struck that Nissan's designers appear to be taken by the Mirai's huge, triangular air intakes. Will all Japanese cars soon look like this?
 
The info shows time to charge for a 100km range . I think the new cell chemistry has reduced internal resistance which reduces charge time.
so its not a full charge they are referring to but a partial charge
 
kmp647 said:
The info shows time to charge for a 100km range . I think the new cell chemistry has reduced internal resistance which reduces charge time.
so its not a full charge they are referring to but a partial charge
Thanks, I missed that part. But I will note that the old battery could accept a full-rate charge at the bottom half of the SOC range, so it could charge the same amount in the same time at the lower end of the range.

But I agree that lower resistance is a good thing, particularly in the cold and as the battery degrades.
 
After seeing the IDS I am super psyched again for Nissan ! hoping that I can drive a Nissan EV gain one day. My I3 is fun but has some things that just are not done right. Its very clear after 1 year in the I3 (and 3 in a Leaf) that Nissan has a way better design and process from the engineers.
 
If this photo shows what I think it does, a 60 kWh pack in the foreground, and a 24 (or 30) kWh pack in the background:

http://dailykan-13be.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Leaf_material/60kWh%20battery_02.jpg

And if that is the actual configuration planned for the gen 2, not just a one-off for use in gen 1 LEAF test mules.

Then:

The 60 kWh pack appears likely to continue to use conductive (passive) thermal management, only consistent with long battery life if battery heating when charging at ~100 kW is limited by higher efficiency.

The two battery pack configurations looking very similar suggests much of the Gen 1 chassis design may be retained, whatever the designers decide to do with the Gen 2 appearance.

Not reported is whether a pack smaller than 60 kWh will be offered. I certainly hope Nissan offers a less-expensive and lighter 30 to 50 kWh pack option to those who buyers who don't want the 60 kWh range.

I imagine the number of buyers who choose 24 kWh packs over 30 kWh during the 2016 (and 2017?) Gen 1 MY runs will influence Nissan's decision on what kWh pack options it will offer.

BTW, looks like Reuters deserves credit for it's story of over a year ago, the first report of "60 kWh" I can recall, and getting many other details close to right.

...An all-electric Tesla rival is still planned for Nissan's premium Infiniti brand in 2018 with batteries as big as 60 kilowatt-hours (kWh), more than twice the energy capacity of the Leaf, which is due for replacement the previous year...
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/15/us-renault-sa-nissan-batteries-exclusive-idUSKBN0HA0CA20140915

Just how much role LG and NEC will have in Nissan's future battery supplies as reported there is still unclear, but I think Infiniti would be nuts to not proceed with the LE, now that it has access to a 60 kWh pack and drivetrain off-the shelf.
 
edatoakrun said:
If this photo shows what I think it does, a 60 kWh pack in the foreground, and a 24 (or 30) kWh pack in the background:

http://dailykan-13be.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Leaf_material/60kWh%20battery_02.jpg
The one in the background is absolutely the old design, so if the filename is correct, the one in the foreground is the 60-kWh version.

One difference which I see is that the new 60-kWh battery has ALL cells in the same orientation: horizontal. The old battery had some cells in a horizontal orientation and others in a vertical orientation.

I also think the module stacks in the 60 kWh battery are about 2" taller than the ones in the old pack. (So much for purchasing a 60-kWh battery for my MY2011 LEAF!)
 
RegGuheert said:
I also think the module stacks in the 60 kWh battery are about 2" taller than the ones in the old pack. (So much for purchasing a 60-kWh battery for my MY2011 LEAF!)
You can't make out in that photograph.

From the updated first post, see this quote.

The new battery technology allows Nissan to pack 288 cells into the same space currently occupied by 192 cells.

Infact, they say there are Leafs running around with this pack, which to me clearly says, it is backward compatible (mechanically, if not electrically).
 
LeftieBiker said:
I just watched the video. The car looks better in motion, but...am I the only one with no desire whatsoever for a steering wheel (and brake pedal?) that goes into hiding and takes three seconds to return? An awful lot can happen in three seconds.

Personally, I find it difficult to even use cruise control. If you have to be vigilant, what's the point ?

But, for a time when the auto pilot is good enough to trust your life with, it is a good idea. Basically, that would make the car a manual or auto pilot - unlike what Google has been saying, which is all auto with no option for manual driving (good for taxis).
 
evnow said:
RegGuheert said:
I also think the module stacks in the 60 kWh battery are about 2" taller than the ones in the old pack. (So much for purchasing a 60-kWh battery for my MY2011 LEAF!)
You can't make out in that photograph.
I think you can, at several points including the front flange just behind the connector and the side looking at the lower stacks.
evnow said:
From the updated first post, see this quote.

The new battery technology allows Nissan to pack 288 cells into the same space currently occupied by 192 cells.
That's what the writer of the article thinks he saw.
evnow said:
Infact, they say there are Leafs running around with this pack, which to me clearly says, it is backward compatible (mechanically, if not electrically).
Clearly this pack was designed to fit within an existing LEAF. It could be easily done by putting in a 2" shim at each mounting point to keep it from hitting the floorboards.
 
We already knew there were current Leafs running around with a new battery, although now we know the pack size. Those Leafs had noticeably less ground clearance, as if the packs hung an extra 2" or so below the car. I can't find the story now, but there was a discussion with Nissan about matching the range of gas cars. There was a picture of a test mule on stage, with something hanging below the car. Seeing the 60kWh battery now, I have to believe that's what we were seeing.

All that said, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Nissan will never offer a 60kWh pack for old Leafs. I could see them offering a 30kWh pack in the not-so-distant future, though I'm not holding my breath.
 
RegGuheert said:
edatoakrun said:
If this photo shows what I think it does, a 60 kWh pack in the foreground, and a 24 (or 30) kWh pack in the background:

http://dailykan-13be.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Leaf_material/60kWh%20battery_02.jpg
The one in the background is absolutely the old design, so if the filename is correct, the one in the foreground is the 60-kWh version.

...the module stacks in the 60 kWh battery are about 2" taller than the ones in the old pack. (So much for purchasing a 60-kWh battery for my MY2011 LEAF!)
IIRC, there is some extra space in the gen 1 pack bay, so the 60 kWh pack might fit, even if it is slightly larger, as it appears it might be.

Couldn't another configuration of the new cells allow a lower kWh (and dimensionally smaller-if required) replacement pack for 2011-15 LEAFs, If Nissan wants to produce one?

I'd probably prefer to buy a ~40 kWh pack for my 2011anyway, if it cost ~$6k, as opposed to ~$9k for a 60 kWh pack, for the same reasons I'd probably prefer a smaller pack on a gen 2 LEAF.

~40 kWh should get me to either Vacaville California or Ashland Oregon (and almost to Reno Nevada) from my home charge in my 2011, at prevailing road speeds.

I expect the gen 2 will have better efficiency and go farther, on the same kWh.
 
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