GetOffYourGas
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:08 am

minispeed wrote:All those are from my observations as a current BEV driver, but it's more important to offer non current BEV drivers what they want to transition than it is to please current owners. I strongly suspect that once BEVs get a foot hold in the market most cars will max out with a 40-50kWh or so battery.


I suspect you are close. The truly large batteries will be reserved for the expensive luxury-type vehicles, and the smaller/economical vehicles will have a more reasonable ~50kWh battery. But this can only happen after QCs become ubiquitous. In the mean time, particularly for the next-generation EVs, we need as large of a battery as possible. In most parts of the world, once you leave your garage you are one your own. You basically better be carrying enough energy on board to get you to your destination and/or back home.
~Brian

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EVDRIVER
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Thu Feb 25, 2016 8:50 am

GetOffYourGas wrote:
EVDRIVER wrote:
mtndrew1 wrote:Wow, look how efficient it was to omit the "h" in the "kWh!" Saved one keystroke, added a page and a half of back-and-forth. Good on ya.

.


Ignorance is bliss and so are typos, of course I would not defend one nor would I say "I know a lot" preceding the wrong terminology. Nothing wrong with making a mistake as long as it gets corrected in time. I think this is as humorous as the chance of an improved LEAF pack with 60mwh.


Since apparently this thread is about nit-picking terminology, I would have to disagree that a 60mwh (60 milliwatt-hour, or 0.00006kWh) battery is an "improved" LEAF pack ;)


That is the new warranty for minimum capacity over 10 years, 100K. Pretty good.

arnis
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:37 am

And for transition period (10-20 years?) SOME people will want a small generator** on-board that
runs on liquid fuel. Generator adds as much weight as 15-20kWh of additional battery capacity.
Going from 100-mile to 200-mile range it is reasonable to add battery. Going from 200-mile
up to 300-500 mile range it is not that reasonable to add battery any more as real rapid charging might
not be available for many owners. Tesla has the only real rapid charging network that can be reasonably*
used for unlimited long trips for some markets today.
In terms of pollution it doesn't really matter as the most important number is Earth average oil consumption.
And generator will not be used for short/medium trips (not in urban area).


*reasonable charging - ratio 4:1 or better at highway speed.
** I'm not talking something like Volt (4 cylinder) rather something like i3/i8, so 2-3 cylinders, light and small.
I'm really happy to see BMW makes progress with 3-cylinders. Unimaginable performance and economy.
That is most likely what BMW is going to hunt for as they are not even preparing for rapid*** charging network.
***check signature
Short range EVs <30kWh -- Medium range: 30-60kWh -- Long range: >60kWh
Charging: Trickle <3kW -- Normal 3-22kW -- Fast 50-100kW -- Supercharging >100kW

GetOffYourGas
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:17 am

EVDRIVER wrote:
GetOffYourGas wrote:
EVDRIVER wrote:
Ignorance is bliss and so are typos, of course I would not defend one nor would I say "I know a lot" preceding the wrong terminology. Nothing wrong with making a mistake as long as it gets corrected in time. I think this is as humorous as the chance of an improved LEAF pack with 60mwh.


Since apparently this thread is about nit-picking terminology, I would have to disagree that a 60mwh (60 milliwatt-hour, or 0.00006kWh) battery is an "improved" LEAF pack ;)


That is the new warranty for minimum capacity over 10 years, 100K. Pretty good.


Ah, I understand now. Hey, a specified minimum capacity in certainly an improvement over their reprogrammable "capacity bars".
~Brian

EV Fleet:
2011 Torqeedo Travel 1003 electric outboard on a 22' sailboat
2012 Leaf SV (traded for Bolt)
2015 C-Max Energi (302A package)
2017 Bolt Premier

pearlleaf510
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Fri Feb 26, 2016 2:23 am

once they figure out how to charge faster and safer like putting Gass fast ..dc2

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Fri Feb 26, 2016 10:21 am

Valdemar wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:mixing KW and kwh is not. simple as that.


With all due respect, I can't think of a discussion on this forum where I could not infer what poster meant even if s/he got units mixed up, it's usually clear from the context.


you think is ok to assume that everyone has your level of knowledge?? no wonder EV adoption has been so slow!
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
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DaveinOlyWA
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Fri Feb 26, 2016 10:28 am

I think we will be forced to wait and see. Things I will be waiting on the capacity warranty. I think that larger packs cannot be subjected to the "less than 70%" rule. But at the same time; the "all or nothing" rule realistically has to go as well. Degradation on a reverse sliding scale (the newer the pack, the higher the replacement cost above a certain level of degradation) provides benefits to both sides.

This will end up being much more expensive for people who want like new range most of the time but will also provide enough of a revenue stream to Nissan to make it attractive enough for them to do it not to mention this brings the dealer service center back into the picture.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 27,000 miles.363GID Ahr 79.13Hx95.17%kwh28.1QCs238,L2's 251
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drees
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Re: What expectation or concerns do we have of a Nissan 60kwh battery

Fri Feb 26, 2016 10:32 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:you think is ok to assume that everyone has your level of knowledge?? no wonder EV adoption has been so slow!

If that's your attitude, you should be sure to capitalize kWh and kW properly. Case matters when using SI units.

Anyway, this thread has been completely derailed, maybe I should split it up...
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