User avatar
DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2763
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:36 am

By next year, Leaf will be pretty close to the 3.

https://electrek.co/2018/01/04/nissan-l ... -charging/

Range, charging speed, TMS.

Now if only they roll out a van or a pickup.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

webb14leafs
Posts: 166
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 9:43 am
Delivery Date: 27 Mar 2017

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:16 am

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:By next year, Leaf will be pretty close to the 3.

https://electrek.co/2018/01/04/nissan-l ... -charging/

Range, charging speed, TMS.

Now if only they roll out a van or a pickup.


That's interesting. Thanks for sharing. I'll admit the Leaf isn't as attractive, but the hatchback gives it a lot more utility. If the 2019 is all the article says it is, it will be a tough choice. Dollar for Dollar, the T3 is probably still a better choice because of the charging network. That could change by next year though.

I wonder if the 35K price is just for the 60kWhr battery/22kW offload/100 kW charge rate variant, and 30K option will exist for 40kWhr battery/11kW offload/50kW charge rate variant. That would make sense? Seems like it's very important for Nissan to offer a ~ $30K option.

edatoakrun
Posts: 5016
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:19 am

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:By next year, Leaf will be pretty close to the 3.

https://electrek.co/2018/01/04/nissan-l ... -charging/

Range, charging speed, TMS...

Electek seems to be misinterpreting its source, which is this article:

How Nissan sees Leaf’s competition...

https://pushevs.com/2017/12/29/nissan-s ... mpetition/

The slide is claimed to be from Nissan, and certainly looks plausible.

The Table below are Pedro LIma's (pushevs') projections, and far less certain to be correct.

Neither car has been built yet, so we can only use what the manufacturers have claimed.

The "60 kWh" LEAF will probably have longer single-charge EPA combined range than the base battery model 3.

We'll have a better idea of how much longer when we find out the efficiency ratings and EPA range of the "40 kWh" LEAF, which has still not been reported. I expect the first window sticker photo to show up any day now.

DC charging speed for the two cars is likely to be very similar, but I doubt Nissan will have a higher capacity on board charger, as pushevs reports. And I hope Nissan does not encumber the LEAF with a liquid pack cooling system, which only Tesla packs require for safety.

As to price, The LEAF will be much less expensive than the 3, when comparably-equipped.

A fully -loaded "60 kWh" LEAF will probably have a higher sticker price than a stripper model 3, but expect Nissan to offer lower cost leases, and even that loaded LEAF will probably have lower TCO than the stripper model 3.
no condition is permanent

2011RedLeaf
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 8:49 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Oct 2012
Leaf Number: 3999

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:00 am

Based on the results of my previous uncooled Leaf battery; without liquid cooling, I will either wait 3 years for off lease with near-perfect battery, require an impressive durability warrantee, or buy a Bolt. I'm impressed with the ability of my Volt battery to daily charge/discharge full capacity for my 60 miles (1/4 gallon of gas) daily use; with no capacity loss.

User avatar
keydiver
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:04 pm
Delivery Date: 08 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 16484
Location: Hobe Sound, Florida
Contact: Website

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:28 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:Is this just ANOTHER example of Musk giving us what we need instead of what we want? ;)


I know a lot of people are criticizing Tesla for not meeting their production goals, but:
A) Tesla has NEVER met them before, so what's the big surprise here?
B) I think a lot of people feel like I do. If delaying shipments a month or 2 will get 10's of thousands more people the $7500 tax credit, I can wait. It seems like most people today expect instant gratification and have no patience. In the grand scheme of things, what is a few month delay in getting your Model 3? Sure, if your previous lease has run out, or your daily beater has died, you need another car now, but I think most people can wait without any real problem. I'm actually hoping that Tesla games the system and delays the 200,000th car until 04/01/2018. Extending the cutoff another 3 months could conceivably get another 50,000 to 100,000 people the full $7500 tax credit.

would you buy the Model 3 if the tax credit wasn't still available?


Yes, I think I would. Its the same story with all new, expensive technology. I'm getting so tired of the anti-Tesla arguement that "its a rich man's toy". Cars 100 years ago were a rich man's toy, but if no one steps up and buys them, the necessary quantity would never be produced to bring the price down to where today anyone can afford a car. What if no one bought the first color TV sets? The first IBM computers? VCR's? If people like me that have the disposable income don't step up and buy a Tesla, they would never become mainstream in my lifetime, IMO. And, its not just for the "green factor". The cars are just so much better to drive in so many ways, and being able to cleanly refuel every day in my own garage, from my own solar, is a nice bonus. (Knowing that I'm not choking the people behind me in a cloud of diesel suet gives me a clearer conscience too. Florida has no emissions testing, which is quite evident by the number of gross poluters in my county. Aren't they teaching the kids anything about cleaning up the environment in school anymore? Sorry for the OT rant.)
2012 Glacier Pearl SL - Delivered December 8, 2011
10kW Solar PV for recharging!
2006 Prius with Hymotion 5kWh PHEV upgrade
Tesla 70D | Titanium Metallic | Matte Obeche Wood Décor| All Glass Panoramic Roof
Tesla Model 3 Pre-Ordered!

Jedlacks
Posts: 165
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2014 12:10 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Mar 2018
Leaf Number: 303628
Location: Kennesaw, GA

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:28 am

With all that has been happening I have been wavering on upgrading now or upgrading later. That in itself is a silly notion, because there is always something better coming up. My current 15SV suits my needs, even at 41k miles and a GOM of 91 miles. I drive 26 miles to work in Atlanta, but I'll be moving to Miami in 3 months, where my one way jumps to 37. However, there is free L2 at the new office covered parking deck.

So, do I drive this until I need a new pack, or get the 18 Leaf, or get hampered with the long charging of the Bolt at any DCQC, or do I wait until '19? Add to this the idea of picking up a used '18 for a bargain...

These are good times to be in, and thanks to the early adopters for laying the ground work.
2018 SV
Deep Blue Pearl

SageBrush
Posts: 2062
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:00 pm

DNAinaGoodWay wrote:By next year, Leaf will be pretty close to the 3.
.

Hahahhahahahahhahaha
2013 Model 'S' with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
3/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles

User avatar
keydiver
Posts: 1079
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:04 pm
Delivery Date: 08 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 16484
Location: Hobe Sound, Florida
Contact: Website

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:26 pm

Jedlacks wrote: I drive 26 miles to work in Atlanta, but I'll be moving to Miami in 3 months, where my one way jumps to 37. However, there is free L2 at the new office covered parking deck.


The heat in Miami is going to hammer a 2018 non-TMS battery. I would just keep the Leaf you have now, and upgrade it later when/if necessary. This is especially true if Route 95 is most of your commute, where the high speeds will heat up the battery even more. FYI: People in the Miami/Ft Lauderdale have to be NASCAR certified. ;)
2012 Glacier Pearl SL - Delivered December 8, 2011
10kW Solar PV for recharging!
2006 Prius with Hymotion 5kWh PHEV upgrade
Tesla 70D | Titanium Metallic | Matte Obeche Wood Décor| All Glass Panoramic Roof
Tesla Model 3 Pre-Ordered!

Evoforce
Posts: 752
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:58 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Feb 2015
Location: Fountain Hills Arizona

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:19 am

SageBrush wrote:
DNAinaGoodWay wrote:By next year, Leaf will be pretty close to the 3.
.

Hahahhahahahahhahaha


+1 Hahahahahaaha!!!!!!
*2011 Leaf 1 bought 2/28/15 @ 28,000ish mi 10 bar (8 bars @ 11/25/15 @ 37,453 ) (New lizard @ 39,275 mi @ 1/20/2016) Now 52,166 mi.
*Tesla Model S 61,000 mi
*2011 Leaf 2 bought 4/28/15 @ 24,000ish mi 12 bar (new lizard Dec. 2014 @ 22,273 mi) Now 35,485 mi

cwerdna
Posts: 7684
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Why the LEAF Gen 2 and not the 220 miles Tesla Model 3?

Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:56 am

edatoakrun wrote:https://pushevs.com/2017/12/29/nissan-s ... mpetition/

The slide is claimed to be from Nissan, and certainly looks plausible.

The slide was the same one shown and a pic taken of at https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... ater&ifg=1. I was at the same EVent (at Nissan's Sunnyvale research office) as the person (Steve) who posted that pic. The slide was put up by Brian, a Nissan North America marketing guy who flew in from NNA HQ in TN.

I spoke to both Steve and Brian at that EVent which was in Sept 2017, right before the Cupertino EVent that weekend. It seems that since then, I've seen some slight variants of that slide shown by other Nissan corporate reps at other EVents elsewhere in the US.

Example: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... ater&ifg=1 posted in Oct 2017 which I believe was at another EVent in the Seattle area. The price adjustment/model grade slide from that EVent looked the same as the Sunnyvale EVent.

'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)
'06 Prius

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Return to “LEAF Gen 2 & Infiniti EV”