Charging capability with 3.6 kW on-board charger

I've just purchased my first EV: a 2017 Leaf S. It has the 3.6 kW on-board charger, and I intend to trickle charge it at home since my daily commute is under 20 miles RT. However, if my circumstances should change and I would want to install an EVSE at home or use a Level 2 charger at a public station, does my 3.6 kW on-board charger even have the capability for Level 2 charging? Or will I only ever be able to trickle charge it?

Two salesmen at the dealership had different answers, and I've found conflicting information online. Any straight answers you can give me will be so appreciated!

You can L2 charge every Leaf ever made; in fact, there isn't a L2 EVSE made that charges at a rate less than 3.6 kW.
I didn't even realize they still made 3.6 kW Leafs (S or otherwise).

@Stanton - Thank you for your quick and very simple answer! I can't figure why I'd found so much conflicting/unclear information elsewhere, but I appreciate your straightforward reply.

I like this chart on Clipper Creek for this .
https://www.clippercreek.com/charging-times-chart/

Stanton said:

You can L2 charge every Leaf every made; in fact, there isn't a L2 EVSE made that charges at a rate less than 3.6 kW/h.
I didn't even realize they still made 3.6 kW Leafs (S or otherwise).

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The 3.6kw charger is standard, the 6.6kw is optional, with quick charge port.

3.6kw = 3,600 watts. 3,600 watts / 120 volts = 30 amps. 30 amps is the most current that your Leaf will allow to be charged with at 120 volts. If you use an EVSE that provides less than this, such as the included trickle charger cable, I think it limits the current to 12 amps. 12 x 120 = 1,400 watts, or 1.4kw.

At 240 volts circuit the limit is: 3600 watts / 240 volts = 15 amps. Any EVSE with greater than 15 amps capacity will give you the full load of 3.6kw.

Another way to look at it is, range added to battery per hour of being attached, up to about 90% capacity, assuming 4.0 miles / kwhr:
3.6kw 6.6kw
L1 (120v trickle charge cable) will give you: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 5 5
L2 (240v EVSE at 12 amps) will give you - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 12 12
L2 (240v EVSE at 15 amps) will give you - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 15 15
L2 (240v EVSE at 20 amps) will give you - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 15 20
L2 (240v EVSE at 30 amps) will give you - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 15 25
L2 (240v EVSE at 50 amps) will give you - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 15 25

These numbers are just approximate so as to give you some perspective. The thing to remember is that you want to "Future Proof" any installation that is done by a hired electrician. If a Tesla or other faster rate of charge EV is in your future you may want to go with a 50 amps circuit and EVSE. If not, then what you have will work.

Hope this helps.

As for "trickle" (L-1) charging: all Leafs using the included Nissan charging cable (the charger is in the car) charge at the same 12 amp rate, so don't feel that you'll be charging slower at home than anyone else with a Leaf using 120 volts. Make sure the circuit used has nothing else except maybe a light bulb on it, and make sure the outlet and wiring are in excellent shape. Feel the 120 volt plug end on the charging cable (aka EVSE) while the car is charging, and make sure it isn't hotter than lukewarm.

The confusion about charging level capability arises from the fact that the "fast charge" or "QC" port is optional. The smaller port, though, is the one used for both L-1 and L-2 charging, and all leafs have those, as noted.

Stanton said:

You can L2 charge every Leaf every made; in fact, there isn't a L2 EVSE made that charges at a rate less than 3.6 kW/h.
I didn't even realize they still made 3.6 kW Leafs (S or otherwise).

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3.6 kW/h doesn't make sense. kW is already a rate.

See https://solarpowerrocks.com/solar-technology/what-the-hell-is-the-difference-between-a-kilowatt-kw-and-a-kilowatt-hour-kwh/.

kWh/h would make sense but the h's would cancel out, leaving you with kW.

Graffi's correct. See specs tab of http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/presskits/us-2017-nissan-leaf-press-kit.

Here's some math to help you:

120 volts multiplied by 12 amps equals 1,440W or 1.44kW. This is what you get from a normal 15 amp 120V circuit and EVSE. Note that 15 amps is when the breaker or fuse would trip so that's why you can only draw 12 amps from a 15 amp outlet.

240 volts multiplied by 12 amps equals 2.88kW This is what you would get if you had a 15 amp 220V circuit and EVSE. I don't think these are very common.

240V x 15A = 3.6kW. This is what you would get if you you have a 20 amp 220V circuit. Again the 15 amps is lower than the breaker limit of 20 amps. This is the most popular baseline EVSE you normally get and I do believe are usually put on 30 amp breakers although a 20 amp breaker would be better.

240V x 22.5A = 5.4kW This what about you'd be able to get off of a 30 amp circuit and EVSE, except your car is limited to 3.3kW (or 3.6kW??) so it's not going to charge this fast. Seems like most of the public charging stations around my town are at this amperage.

240V x 30A = 7.2kW This is about what you'd get off of a 40 amp circuit and EVSE. This is what you'd want if you had a Leaf with the 6.6kW charging package.

240V x 52.5A = 12.6kW This is about what you'd get from a 70 amp circuit, the maximum the J1772 connector could handle on a car and EVSE designed for it.

240 volts is a typical household voltage in the US, not 240.

240 * 15 amps = 3,600 watts = 3.6 kW

I haven't looked at the power draw of these 3.6 kW OBCs, but at work on our ~208 volt L2 EVSEs, it seems '11 and '12 Leafs (w/a totally different OBC in the hump area in the back) with their "3.3 kW" OBC actually pull about 3.7 to 3.8 kW.

(208 volts is common commercial power. When we only had our previous buildings at work, a Chargepoint tech who came out confirmed our supply voltage was 208 volts.)

cwerdna said:

240 volts is a typical household voltage in the US, not 240.

240 * 15 amps = 3,600 watts = 3.6 kW

I haven't looked at the power draw of these 3.6 kW OBCs, but at work on our ~208 volt L2 EVSEs, it seems '11 and '12 Leafs (w/a totally different OBC in the hump area in the back) with their "3.3 kW" OBC actually pull about 3.7 to 3.8 kW.

(208 volts is common commercial power. When we only had our previous buildings at work, a Chargepoint tech who came out confirmed our supply voltage was 208 volts.)

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Thanks! I knew I was doing something wrong.

FWIW, there are claims here that Leafs w/the 6.6 kW OBC pulls 27.5 amps max. I've seen a graph (was found via http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=338038#p338038 but the PDF dead now), showing 6.6 kW max, presumably at 240 volts.

On my work L2 Chargepoint 30 amp EVSEs, it seems my 6.6 kW OBC car at supposedly 208 volts tends to pull anywhere between 5.7 to ~6.0 kW, typically. I recall seeing 6.1 kW and even 6.2 kW at max.
27.5 amps * 208 volts = 5,720 watts
30 * 208 = 6,240 watts

Not clear if the voltage is actually slightly higher than 208 volts and/or OBC can actually pull more than 27.5 amps when below 208 volts.

Tesla Model S that I've plugged in usually max out at ~6.2 kW, which is no surprise since they at min have 10 kW OBCs.

I'll post up a Chargepoint graph sometime when I get a chance. Ack... and I'll need to pay for membership again, unless I put the image elsewhere.

You can link images from other sites here, with the "image" button. They will appear as if uploaded here, until the originating site drops them.

cwerdna said:

FWIW, there are claims here that Leafs w/the 6.6 kW OBC pulls 27.5 amps max. I've seen a graph (was found via http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=338038#p338038 but the PDF dead now), showing 6.6 kW max, presumably at 240 volts.

On my work L2 Chargepoint 30 amp EVSEs, it seems my 6.6 kW OBC car at supposedly 208 volts tends to pull anywhere between 5.7 to ~6.0 kW, typically. I recall seeing 6.1 kW and even 6.2 kW at max.
27.5 amps * 208 volts = 5,720 watts
30 * 208 = 6,240 watts

Not clear if the voltage is actually slightly higher than 208 volts and/or OBC can actually pull more than 27.5 amps when below 208 volts.

Tesla Model S that I've plugged in usually max out at ~6.2 kW, which is no surprise since they at min have 10 kW OBCs.

I'll post up a Chargepoint graph sometime when I get a chance. Ack... and I'll need to pay for membership again, unless I put the image elsewhere.

Click to expand...

My '13S w/6.6kw charger charges @ 27.5a max on any voltage. Therefor at:
120v I can charge at a max of 3.3kw
208v =5.72kw
240v =6.6kw

cwerdna said:

I'll post up a Chargepoint graph sometime when I get a chance. Ack... and I'll need to pay for membership again, unless I put the image elsewhere.

Click to expand...

Here's what a typical charge to 100% on a '13+ w/6.x kW OBC looks like on our work EVSEs. This wasn't my car and it's Chargepoint's old UI.

We have EVSEs spread across numerous locations, across several buildings, parking lots and parking garages. In the old buildings I used to be in, it seems like the EVSEs out in front of the building would only tend to allow my car to pull ~5.7ish kW while ones under the building tended to be a bit higher (e.g. 5.9 to 6.0 kW). There might've been supply voltage differences.

One of the next times I charge, I'll take a screenshot w/the mouse cursor over a peak point of full speed charing.

Do not forget the car sets the maximum charge rate. You can have the spec max 80A but your car will still only draw its max of 16A at 240V. An enhanced Leaf will dray 27.5A from an EVSE of at least that capacity

240V charging is more efficient than 120V . The overhead stays the same at either voltage so you get more bang at the higher voltage.

My 2011 would draw 16 amperes at 240 volts or 18 amperes at 208 volts nominal. My 2015 draws about 26.5 amperes at 240 volts or 30 amperes at 208 volts nominal. The owner manual lists the maximum current as 32 amperes, but the highest I have actually measured is 30 amperes at actual 212 volts. The Clipper Creek EVSE I have at my workshop/garage is rated at 40 amperes output for use with 14-50 receptacle (50-ampere breaker) so it should not be the limiting factor.

Both cars will (would) draw more current at 208 volts nominal to keep the input power nearly the same as when charging on 240 volts.

GerryAZ said:

My 2011 would draw 16 amperes at 240 volts or 18 amperes at 208 volts nominal. My 2015 draws about 26.5 amperes at 240 volts or 30 amperes at 208 volts nominal...

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In Electrical Engineering Power Lab we had a lab manual that said "'nominal' is a word that every engineer must master. 'Nominal' means that the value has been measured to the best of our ability but we are not prepared to say exactly how good that ability is!"

John Kuthe...