All4Leaf
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Apr 2015
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon

Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:56 pm

Hi all,

Newbie from Pacific Northwest here - I never lease a vehicle but based on special rates provided by my local Nissan dealer and no gas expense per month, I opted for leasing 2015 Nissan Leaf S (base model with quick charger option). The car this Leaf replaced used to cost me about $120 per month in gas alone; never mind scheduled maintenance, etc. I got the Leaf for $199 per month. The residual value is quite reasonable.
I am considering buying the car in Apr 2018 instead of lease return. I charge my Leaf every night with trickle charge/110V home outlet. The battery when fully charged after two and half years, still gets ~104 miles range.

Now that I have given some background - considering the vast experience of owners on this forum, my question is if I buy this 2015 Leaf that has about ~26000 miles on it and my average of ~12000 miles per year drive, how long should I expect the current battery to last before I need to purchase a new battery?

In case if I need to put this question somewhere else on this forum, please do point me in that direction.

Thanks,
U.S. Department of Energy cites electric cars as making up about a third of all vehicles on the road in 1900. In 1911, the New York Times even called existing electric vehicles “ideal.”
https://energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8930
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:59 pm

In your climate it could be usable for ten years or more - it depends on how much range you need. The 2015 battery is the best that Nissan has ever made. If you like the car, then buying it will give you the best return on your investment - again, if the range is more than adequate. You might want to find someone who can check the remaining capacity with LeafSpy.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

All4Leaf
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Apr 2015
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:24 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:In your climate it could be usable for ten years or more - it depends on how much range you need. The 2015 battery is the best that Nissan has ever made. If you like the car, then buying it will give you the best return on your investment - again, if the range is more than adequate. You might want to find someone who can check the remaining capacity with LeafSpy.


Thank you for the quick reply LeftieBiker - could you please clariy "check the remaining capacity" - does this mean checking if the battery is still 24kWh?

Thanks,
U.S. Department of Energy cites electric cars as making up about a third of all vehicles on the road in 1900. In 1911, the New York Times even called existing electric vehicles “ideal.”
https://energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

alozzy
Posts: 1006
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:02 pm

Incredible that you are getting 104 miles of range! I'm guessing most of your driving is done through relatively flat terrain and at lower speeds.

Being a PNW LEAF, it's probably still > 95% state of health (SOH in LeafSpy). It's hard to estimate battery degredation, as there are so many variables, but you'll likely lose the first capacity bar sometime in 2020. Five years from now, your best range might be 70 miles, based on your current driving. The vast majority of Leaf owners would be thrilled to have that kind of range from what will then be a 7 year old LEAF.

In your shoes, I would drive it until a used EV with better range becomes more affordable. That's my plan, likely my next EV will be a Bolt or perhaps a used 2018 LEAF.
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

joeriv
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:33 pm
Location: Fairfield County CT

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:15 pm

RE residual value: You might get significant discount off the residual value - don't hesitate to bargain.
2017 Leaf S with QC, JUN mfg date

LeftieBiker
Posts: 8930
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 31 May 2013
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:37 pm

All4Leaf wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:In your climate it could be usable for ten years or more - it depends on how much range you need. The 2015 battery is the best that Nissan has ever made. If you like the car, then buying it will give you the best return on your investment - again, if the range is more than adequate. You might want to find someone who can check the remaining capacity with LeafSpy.


Thank you for the quick reply LeftieBiker - could you please clariy "check the remaining capacity" - does this mean checking if the battery is still 24kWh?

Thanks,


More or less. Nissan EV batteries are notorious for degrading over time - especially in hotter climates, and especially the early ones. Those made after March of 2013 are better, but those made in 2015 only (called the "Lizard pack") are best. 2016 and 2017 packs once again degrade fast, especially in heat. LeafSpy is an app that uses a diagnostic port reader to interpret data from the Battery management System (BMS) to determine remaining capacity, among other things.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

brotherjethro
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:21 am
Delivery Date: 03 May 2017
Location: Vancouver, WA

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:58 pm

Where in PNW do you live? If you're near Vancouver, WA, I have LeafSpy and can help you understand the current state of your battery.
2013 Pearl White SV, bought used in 2017 with only 5100 miles. Vancouver, WA.

All4Leaf
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Apr 2015
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:01 pm

Hi all,

I have been on other car forums and am really liking this Leaf forum. All helpful comments; not a single wiseguy comment.

Thanks,
U.S. Department of Energy cites electric cars as making up about a third of all vehicles on the road in 1900. In 1911, the New York Times even called existing electric vehicles “ideal.”
https://energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

All4Leaf
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Apr 2015
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:18 pm

alozzy wrote:Incredible that you are getting 104 miles of range! I'm guessing most of your driving is done through relatively flat terrain and at lower speeds.

Being a PNW LEAF, it's probably still > 95% state of health (SOH in LeafSpy). It's hard to estimate battery degredation, as there are so many variables, but you'll likely lose the first capacity bar sometime in 2020. Five years from now, your best range might be 70 miles, based on your current driving. The vast majority of Leaf owners would be thrilled to have that kind of range from what will then be a 7 year old LEAF.

In your shoes, I would drive it until a used EV with better range becomes more affordable. That's my plan, likely my next EV will be a Bolt or perhaps a used 2018 LEAF.


Alozzy,

I have been really happy with my 2015 Nissan Leaf S. I dont know much about electric batteries and their internals but here are some of the things that related to my driving and charging - dont know if any of them contributes to the range:

1. So far I have always charged my Leaf at home using 110V trickle charge.
2. My daily drive is about 36 miles
3. So far, because of my ignorance, I had been charging my battery full.I would put my car for charging at around 8:00pm and in the morning around 7:00am when I head out, it is already fully charged.
4. My commute is hilly especially in the morning, it is about 5 miles steep uphill followed by 6 miles downhill. Then it is pretty much flat 8 miles. On the way back, it is mostly flat 17 miles.
5. I am not exactly a very slow driver; pretty much on par with gas car drivers. Let's put it this way, no one complains I am slowing them down ;)

Based on some expert input I got on this forum, seems like the credit goes to the 2015 Leaf batteries.
I wish I had joined this forum earlier; if that were the case, I probably would have been doing the 80% charging.
Thank you for giving me some estimates - that really helps with my decisiion to buy this car.
U.S. Department of Energy cites electric cars as making up about a third of all vehicles on the road in 1900. In 1911, the New York Times even called existing electric vehicles “ideal.”
https://energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

All4Leaf
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:22 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Apr 2015
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon

Re: Newbie battery question - Leased in 2015 - considering buying it in Apr 2018

Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:25 pm

brotherjethro wrote:Where in PNW do you live? If you're near Vancouver, WA, I have LeafSpy and can help you understand the current state of your battery.


Thank you brotherjethro. I'm in Hillsboro, OR. Really appreciate your offer.
I am thinking about getting LeafSpy and would ask for your & others guidance on this forum.

Thanks,
U.S. Department of Energy cites electric cars as making up about a third of all vehicles on the road in 1900. In 1911, the New York Times even called existing electric vehicles “ideal.”
https://energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

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