majkel
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:27 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2013
Leaf Number: 000587

Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:29 pm

Hi all,
I'm pleased that I found you guys on this forum.

I bought a preowned Leaf 2013 24kWh (probably Visia ;-) just 2 months ago. It was lightly crashed, so I've just started driving it (it's been in body shop for past 2 months).
The seller (professional used cars dealer) tried to hide crash signs at low cost, which was visible afterwards when I was repairing the body. Quite recently I got airbag errors, and also break pedal or ESP. I have good reasons to think that the seller tried to hide also other things like missing airbags or other defects. But to the point:

Is there a good way to check if the airbags are there?
Is there a way to check if odometer was falsified (that's a common practice among sellers here) and that would have explain poor battery state and still 12 bars.
I'm attaching Leaf Spy Pro images and looking for your advice. .

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Last edited by majkel on Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 9875
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:41 pm

With that SOH the car shouldn't have 12 bars. The BMS was almost certainly reset. You could be looking at an 11, 10 or even 9 bar car. What is the build date on the driver's door sill? 2013 leafs built in the first 3 months of the year use the old battery chemistry, and it is terrible. THAT is what you have to worry about, not the odometer.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

majkel
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:27 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2013
Leaf Number: 000587

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:18 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:With that SOH the car shouldn't have 12 bars. The BMS was almost certainly reset. You could be looking at an 11, 10 or even 9 bar car. What is the build date on the driver's door sill? 2013 leafs built in the first 3 months of the year use the old battery chemistry, and it is terrible. THAT is what you have to worry about, not the odometer.


Actually I still can have some of my money back since the seller tricked me, that's why I'm worrying about ODO. All in all the car is not that bad, except from maybe poor range on battery ;-)

Can I determine build date by this sticker?
Last edited by majkel on Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:51 am, edited 2 times in total.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 9875
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:49 pm

There should be a second sticker. If not I'll check the VIN for you later.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 9875
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:13 pm

Please post the VIN, and type it carefully. VINs are public record, since you can see them through the windshield. Or put it into this site: http://vehiclehistory.com They are squirrelly about letting you copy the url so I typed it as I rememberd it.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

majkel
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:27 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2013
Leaf Number: 000587

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:04 am

LeftieBiker wrote:Please post the VIN, and type it carefully. VINs are public record, since you can see them through the windshield. Or put it into this site: http://vehiclehistory.com They are squirrelly about letting you copy the url so I typed it as I rememberd it.


Thanks. ****

Unfortunatelly vehiclehistory website somehow is not working. Unfortunatelly I haven't found any other sticker in my car (except from the one with Tire pressure.
Last edited by majkel on Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 9875
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:11 am

I can't get it to work either. Oddly, it keeps saying to make sure the VIN is 17 digits, but...it is. It does look wrong for a Leaf VIN, though...

EDIT: I can get partial records on this European VIN by searching it with Google, but no manufacturing date. Do European cars have the VIN stamped on a plate at the base of the windshield? If it's correct you may have to pay for a full report. Sorry.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

majkel
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:27 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2013
Leaf Number: 000587

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Tue Dec 04, 2018 6:50 am

LeftieBiker wrote:I can't get it to work either. Oddly, it keeps saying to make sure the VIN is 17 digits, but...it is. It does look wrong for a Leaf VIN, though...

EDIT: I can get partial records on this European VIN by searching it with Google, but no manufacturing date. Do European cars have the VIN stamped on a plate at the base of the windshield? If it's correct you may have to pay for a full report. Sorry.



Thanks for checking. I'll pay then.
Just wanted to confirm other things.
Like where can I read about the GIDS and SOH values and what do they actually represent in terms of current state?

And as for airbags: The easier way to check if airbags are there would be to manually inspect them, right?

SageBrush
Posts: 2946
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: Colorado

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Tue Dec 04, 2018 7:23 am

I don't see any particular reason to doubt the 53.6 Ahr reading for a full charge. The 12th capacity bar should be falling off quite soon.
Now, about all those DTCs ... Get a good 12v battery and hope for the best or if you can, return the car.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Car is now enjoying an easy life in Colorado
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 9875
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Leaf Spy @ 2013 24kWh - verification request

Tue Dec 04, 2018 2:07 pm

Like where can I read about the GIDS and SOH values and what do they actually represent in terms of current state?


Look at the LeafSpy topics here. SOH (state of health) correlates fairly well to remaining battery capacity, although it actually seems to measure internal resistance. Hx isn't as useful. It may or may not be an instant value for internal resistance, with SOH possibly being a longer term average. Anyway, the 12th capacity bar "drops" (vanishes) at about 85-84% SOH/85-84% capacity in the 24kwh packs. With yours still showing 12 bars at a SOH of 81%, it would appear the battery management system (BMS) was reset to show 12 bars. It will relearn the capacity, though, and at least one bar will drop. If you only lose one bar then you have a fairly typical Leaf, probably with the newer chemistry. If the SOH and bars keep dropping, you likely have an early build with the worse battery chemistry.

I know nothing about the air bags, I'm afraid.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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