SageBrush
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Sun Jan 07, 2018 5:55 pm

GRA wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:How many ZE trucks are out there, GRA? How many ZE SUVs and crossovers? I'd love to see 100% ZEVs in California, but passing laws requiring what is practically impossible isn't going to help. Aren't you one of those who argue that the perfect is the enemy of the good?

I have no problem with 2040

Too many politicians between now and 2040.

5% a year
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GRA
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:31 pm

SageBrush wrote:
GRA wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:How many ZE trucks are out there, GRA? How many ZE SUVs and crossovers? I'd love to see 100% ZEVs in California, but passing laws requiring what is practically impossible isn't going to help. Aren't you one of those who argue that the perfect is the enemy of the good?

I have no problem with 2040

Too many politicians between now and 2040.

5% a year

That would only triple sales over a 22 year period. While it might only be that much for the first few years, as prices come down and performance improves the % will rise. Alternatively, something like the Model 3 will cause a big jump early.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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Nubo
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:58 pm

...
Last edited by Nubo on Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

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Nubo
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:59 pm

SageBrush wrote:
GRA wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:How many ZE trucks are out there, GRA? How many ZE SUVs and crossovers? I'd love to see 100% ZEVs in California, but passing laws requiring what is practically impossible isn't going to help. Aren't you one of those who argue that the perfect is the enemy of the good?

I have no problem with 2040

Too many politicians between now and 2040.

5% a year


When the tipping point is reached, the politicians don't matter --it's gonna' happen regardless. In my opinion there's already enough research and capital in motion to assure EVs are going to replace ICE passenger vehicles entirely. The dependency is on battery breakthroughs so the date is hard to predict. It may be before or after 2040. If the tech arrives early the changeover happens early and CARB gets to pat themselves on the back. If it arrives later the CA law will be pushed back or rescinded, just like its previous "mandates".
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:20 pm

All that does is move the emissions to the coal power plants.
LTL
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Nubo
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:46 pm

LTLFTcomposite wrote:All that does is move the emissions to the coal power plants.


Yeah, too bad there aren't other ways to generate electricity. That would be something!
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

GRA
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:57 pm

LTLFTcomposite wrote:All that does is move the emissions to the coal power plants.

Fully recognizing that the above is tongue in cheek, for those non-Californians out there, California has virtually no coal-fired power plants, and the number of out-of-state coal-fired contracts has been decreasing for a long time, as they cannot be renewed when they expire. It's anticipated that California will end all-coal-fired electricity use by 2026, very possibly sooner. See http://www.energy.ca.gov/renewables/tracking_progress/documents/current_expected_energy_from_coal.pdf
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:38 pm

You guys are a disappointment. In the good old days that troll would have landed at least 30-40 posts worth of outrage.

Soon all we'll be left with will be spontaneous cross country road trips and 30' boat towing.
LTL
White 2012 SV delivered 10 Dec 2011 returned 25 Nov 2014 replaced with stopgap ICE Sentra
[35 months] [35K miles] [9 Bars]
2013 Volt replaced after 36 months/30k miles with ICE Rogue
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WetEV
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:09 pm

LTLFTcomposite wrote:Soon all we'll be left with will be spontaneous cross country road trips and 30' boat towing.


The problem with that is?
WetEV
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Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
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DarthPuppy
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Re: New Bill Proposed In California Requires All New Passenger Vehicles To Be ZEV By 2040

Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:05 pm

If we are going all EV by 2040, Cali better get cracking on building out the power grid and charging infrastructure. I'm fairly certain our present power grid won't handle converting all of the miles driven in California daily to being powered by the grid. It wasn't that long ago we had rolling outages because the grid couldn't handle summer HVAC needs. Now lets require all movement to be powered by that grid. Sounds legit.

Oh and we will need to pay for that throughout the country or set up ICEV rental stations at the borders so when someone drives cross country they can make it through the vast wilderness of the gas-loving, no EV infrastructure midwest. :lol: I know, someone already beat me to the 30' boat towing, but still had to throw this in.

I would like to know however just how California plans to fund the grid infrastructure to replace all driving with plug in power. Also, the time it takes to get a power plant approved and built in this state is substantial. If it is going to be in place by 2040, they better start figuring out now how to fund it, and pulling the permits. The NIMBY lawsuits can add decades to the build or expansion of each plant and that assumes they can do so without harming a single endangered mouse somewhere.

Or we can pay Nevada or Mexico a ton of money to build nukes on the border and buy the power from them. Hope we never get in a dispute with them or they could turn us off and leave the state standing still. Did someone say 'build a wall'?

Just how many solar panels would be required to power all those miles. Assuming 4 miles per KWH, someone here should be able to figure out how many of the most efficient SunPower panels would be required and what amount of square miles those panels would cover. I'm guessing we might not need HVAC anymore because we will all be in the shade of solar panels. But I could be wrong - perhaps simply adding a few here and there will power all those miles that Californians drive daily.

Oh, I almost forgot, we will need a bazillion batteries so we can keep charging cars when there is some cloud cover. I'm sure there are no environmental consequences of producing that many batteries.
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