Electricity – Can What Happened in Massachusetts, Happen Elsewhere?
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rmay635703
Well-known member
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Mandated profit increases on decreasing electric use at its best.
Good reason to go fully off grid I guess
Good reason to go fully off grid I guess
RegGuheert
Well-known member
Some thoughts on this topic:
1) To answer the question in the InsideEVs title: Of course it can happen elsewhere! In fact, we can be quite sure this will happen nearly everywhere. This situation is very similar to what is happening with the wired telephone system. As more-and-more customers drop off the system, the costs are borne by a smaller-and-smaller customer base, resulting in rapidly-increasing prices. The difference with power is that the owner of the utility is not collecting revenue from the sale of alternative-energy systems as people purchase less electricity or drop off the grid altogether.
2) While electricity demand may have dropped 2.3% in 2017 in the US, it is not entirely clear that this trend will continue. As BEVs become compelling to more-and-more Americans, electricity consumption from those vehicles may offset or even overwhelm the reductions which are coming from conservation and home-based electricity production.
3) My utility is raising our electricity rates, but I consider their approach to be fair. They are in the process of converting from charging customers a rate based almost purely on consumption to one which mirrors their cost structure. Specifically, they are recognizing that their fixed costs equate to about $30/month/meter. As such, they are in the process of gradually increasing their monthly fixed costs from near zero to closer to the actual fixed costs. To wit, four years ago we paid a $5.00/month access fee, the last three years we paid a $10.00/month access fee and now we pay a $14.00/month access fee. I expect to be paying a $20.00/month access fee three years from now and $25.00/month six years from now, et cetera until the access fees match the fixed fees. That approach allows those of us who use the grid as a battery to pay our share in a more fair manner.
4) I would like to see BEVs become attached to the BEV owner's electricity account rather than the electricity being charged to the owner of the meter (at least within the BEV-owner's home electricity grid). I would also like to see on-board BEV chargers allow bi-directional power flow. With the appropriate structure in place, this would allow for BEV customers to participate in "BEV net metering" in a fashion that would allow them to manage their power consumption in a way that better suited the utilities, regardless of where the vehicle is located. (EVSE operators could still charge an access fee, as desired, separate from the electricity charge, since they would not be paying for that.)
5) The continual increases in utility rates combined with the continual decrease in battery prices will eventually result in the loss of the ability of the utility to continue to raise their prices. As rmay635703 said, at some point it will not make sense to stay attached to the grid. That point has likely already come in some locations (such as Hawaii), but the number of places where that will be true will certainly grow over time.
6) IMO, this transition from fully-centralized power to more distributed power will not happen quickly or without a major battle.
1) To answer the question in the InsideEVs title: Of course it can happen elsewhere! In fact, we can be quite sure this will happen nearly everywhere. This situation is very similar to what is happening with the wired telephone system. As more-and-more customers drop off the system, the costs are borne by a smaller-and-smaller customer base, resulting in rapidly-increasing prices. The difference with power is that the owner of the utility is not collecting revenue from the sale of alternative-energy systems as people purchase less electricity or drop off the grid altogether.
2) While electricity demand may have dropped 2.3% in 2017 in the US, it is not entirely clear that this trend will continue. As BEVs become compelling to more-and-more Americans, electricity consumption from those vehicles may offset or even overwhelm the reductions which are coming from conservation and home-based electricity production.
3) My utility is raising our electricity rates, but I consider their approach to be fair. They are in the process of converting from charging customers a rate based almost purely on consumption to one which mirrors their cost structure. Specifically, they are recognizing that their fixed costs equate to about $30/month/meter. As such, they are in the process of gradually increasing their monthly fixed costs from near zero to closer to the actual fixed costs. To wit, four years ago we paid a $5.00/month access fee, the last three years we paid a $10.00/month access fee and now we pay a $14.00/month access fee. I expect to be paying a $20.00/month access fee three years from now and $25.00/month six years from now, et cetera until the access fees match the fixed fees. That approach allows those of us who use the grid as a battery to pay our share in a more fair manner.
4) I would like to see BEVs become attached to the BEV owner's electricity account rather than the electricity being charged to the owner of the meter (at least within the BEV-owner's home electricity grid). I would also like to see on-board BEV chargers allow bi-directional power flow. With the appropriate structure in place, this would allow for BEV customers to participate in "BEV net metering" in a fashion that would allow them to manage their power consumption in a way that better suited the utilities, regardless of where the vehicle is located. (EVSE operators could still charge an access fee, as desired, separate from the electricity charge, since they would not be paying for that.)
5) The continual increases in utility rates combined with the continual decrease in battery prices will eventually result in the loss of the ability of the utility to continue to raise their prices. As rmay635703 said, at some point it will not make sense to stay attached to the grid. That point has likely already come in some locations (such as Hawaii), but the number of places where that will be true will certainly grow over time.
6) IMO, this transition from fully-centralized power to more distributed power will not happen quickly or without a major battle.
smkettner
Well-known member
Solar roof and a couple Power walls should due the trick. Program the system to draw max 10 amps from the utility connection.
jlv
Well-known member
I didn't know that happened here. I've lived in central Massachusetts for 30 years and we've never had TOU rates with any of the utilities I've dealt with.
