Reddy
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Leaf Number: 006828
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:52 am

I wasn't eligible for the cash for clunkers program since my 17 yo (at the time) "clunker" exceeded the mpg requirement. I kept it until just recently, about 25 y, so I definitely was "above average" on that one. It ran just fine just not a lot of use, though noisy and stinky compared to my 2011 Leaf. Also, it was my only automobile purchase until my 2011 Leaf. Unfortunately, the 2011 Leaf will NOT last as long, nor go as many miles, without at least one battery change. Sorry, I'm not doing that since Nissan has so graciously provided "screw you" replacement battery pricing, and reneged on their promise to provide backward compatibility to the newest battery technology. I won't be buying another until used model 3 prices are out of the nosebleed category.
Reddy
2011 SL; 9 bar, 45.80 AHr; 45,000 mi; rcv'd Aug 18, 2011
Long: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... al#p226115"
Cold: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 60#p243033"

rmay635703
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 7:43 pm

Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Sat Sep 01, 2018 6:59 am

LeftieBiker wrote:I think a lot, if not all, of that is a direct result of the 'Cash for Clunkers' program in 2009.


And the fact that many used and crashed cars are exported from the market making the pool of newer used cars much smaller than in years past.

I guess somethings gotta go back on the empty super tankers and super large cargo boats

LeftieBiker
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Sat Sep 01, 2018 12:14 pm

I'm a bit surprised that people take out extremely long loans on inexpensive cars, but human nature being what it is, I'm also not shocked. Most people view leasing as "renting" instead of as a way to drive a car you might buy with less risk.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

RonDawg
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Sun Sep 02, 2018 4:38 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:I'm a bit surprised that people take out extremely long loans on inexpensive cars, but human nature being what it is, I'm also not shocked. Most people view leasing as "renting" instead of as a way to drive a car you might buy with less risk.


Those who have to get into extended debt for a cheap car probably don't have the sufficiently-good credit required for leasing. They may also be putting on a lot of miles (may have to live far from work due to housing costs, and/or may have multiple jobs to make ends meet) which would cause the lease to be unacceptably expensive.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL.

WetEV
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Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Mon Sep 03, 2018 7:35 am

RonDawg wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:I'm a bit surprised that people take out extremely long loans on inexpensive cars, but human nature being what it is, I'm also not shocked. Most people view leasing as "renting" instead of as a way to drive a car you might buy with less risk.


Those who have to get into extended debt for a cheap car probably don't have the sufficiently-good credit required for leasing. They may also be putting on a lot of miles (may have to live far from work due to housing costs, and/or may have multiple jobs to make ends meet) which would cause the lease to be unacceptably expensive.


Lease to purchase is SOMETIMES the cheapest way to buy a car. Especially if there isn't enough income tax owed to use the full tax credit. And if purchase is the plan, selecting the lowest possible miles can sometimes make the lease to purchase cheaper.

And not everyone with low income has poor credit.
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red

RonDawg
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Mon Sep 03, 2018 4:59 pm

WetEV wrote:
RonDawg wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:I'm a bit surprised that people take out extremely long loans on inexpensive cars, but human nature being what it is, I'm also not shocked. Most people view leasing as "renting" instead of as a way to drive a car you might buy with less risk.


Those who have to get into extended debt for a cheap car probably don't have the sufficiently-good credit required for leasing. They may also be putting on a lot of miles (may have to live far from work due to housing costs, and/or may have multiple jobs to make ends meet) which would cause the lease to be unacceptably expensive.


Lease to purchase is SOMETIMES the cheapest way to buy a car. Especially if there isn't enough income tax owed to use the full tax credit. And if purchase is the plan, selecting the lowest possible miles can sometimes make the lease to purchase cheaper.

And not everyone with low income has poor credit.


Leftie wasn't referring to EV's specifically, just "inexpensive cars" in general.

And yes while not all low income people have poor credit, it's disproportionate to that demographic, if the density of "Buy Here Pay Here" dealerships, "Rent to Own" stores, and check cashing businesses in such neighborhoods is any indication.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL.

LeftieBiker
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Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Poor credit results in higher interest rates for car loans as well as leases. It may be easier to get a predatory car loan from a local bandit dealer than a lease from a manufacturer's leasing arm, but it certainly isn't a better deal than leasing and then buying if you want to keep the car.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

RonDawg
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:25 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:Poor credit results in higher interest rates for car loans as well as leases. It may be easier to get a predatory car loan from a local bandit dealer than a lease from a manufacturer's leasing arm, but it certainly isn't a better deal than leasing and then buying if you want to keep the car.


It is MUCH easier to get a predatory loan (to include BHPH) than a traditional loan, much less a lease, for someone with poor credit. Of course it's not a better deal, just like "Rent to Own" is a TERRIBLE deal, but when you have a low FICO score you don't have a choice.

If credit were equally available to everybody, these places would be out of business overnight.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL.

LeftieBiker
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:33 pm

That may be starting to change, as dealers realize that with a lease they get the car back almost for certain to sell again, instead of having to hope it gets repossessed. I do see occasional low lease offers without the usual manufacturers' disclaimer "for well qualified lessees."
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

RonDawg
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Re: GCC: US households are holding on to their vehicles longer

Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:29 am

LeftieBiker wrote:That may be starting to change, as dealers realize that with a lease they get the car back almost for certain to sell again, instead of having to hope it gets repossessed.


I'm not sure how leasing is better than selling from a repossession perspective. If you don't/can't/won't make your payments, the car will be repossessed.

Trust me, the BHPH places have NO problem repo'ing cars. One way they do so is installing starter remote disable and hidden GPS trackers in the cars. If you don't pay, the car doesn't start, and the tracker helps them find it. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/car-reposs ... edit-city/

There are articles and videos on how BHPH places work, and they have been known to make a killing repo'ing then reselling the same car to some other sucker. It's actually quite lucrative; according to this LA Times article, the average industry profit is a whopping 38 percent per car sold: http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-buyhere-payhere/
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL.

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