Yodrak
Posts: 492
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 7:01 am
Delivery Date: 12 Mar 2015
Leaf Number: 402954
Location: St Louis, MO

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Mon May 23, 2011 2:06 pm

I think EVs are just an extreme example of a trend that should result in the abandonment of the gas tax for supporting road infrastructure and replacing it with a tax based on mileage and weight. Maybe keep a 'gas' tax of some amount that would really be a carbon tax if we're serious about reducing fossil fuel use.

For the purpose of builing and maintaining highway infrastructure, whether its all electric (negligible for the near future), hybrid (also probably insignificant) or generally higher fuel efficiency standards no matter how achieved for an ICE, gas taxe revenues based on gallons of gas will be in decline in the future unless something is done.

I expect that all states collect vehicle weight information when a vehicle is registered, so that's a known. Each state could decide for itself the best way to collect mileage information - report it at annual or bi-annual registration, at annual or bi-annual collection of personal property tax, via the annual state income tax return, whatever would work best for each particluar state. All states have large revenue departments, each has to have some place where collecting the 'road tax' could be tacked onto an existing collection mechanism.

As for the cross-border issue, it's real but it's just an excuse to not act. The same situation exists already with respect to income taxes, sales taxes, the gas tax itself, and the states have been living with it - people near state borders will do their business in the state where the tax is lower to the extent that it makes sense for them to do so. Nothing new here.
Khun Yodrak
2013 SL

daniel
Posts: 398
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:57 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Spokane, WA

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Mon May 23, 2011 3:18 pm

At present, road maintenance is paid for my the gas tax. I drive on the roads, but my Xebra uses no gas. It's only right that I should help pay for the roads. Exactly how this is done is a matter for discussion. Miles times weight sounds like a good scheme to me. I'd advocate eliminating all tax exemptions, but taxing harmful fuels to pay for development of technology and infrastructure for sustainable fuels. I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.

So I will support any reasonable method of taxing EVs, as long as other alternative fuel vehicles are taxed similarly.
Reserved afternoon of 4/20.
"You can order" email late September, but was out of the country so...
Ordered very early October.
Dashboard says: more of the usual worthless Nissan b.s.
(Not on spreadsheet cuz I can't figure it out.)

Yodrak
Posts: 492
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 7:01 am
Delivery Date: 12 Mar 2015
Leaf Number: 402954
Location: St Louis, MO

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Mon May 23, 2011 3:21 pm

OMG!

daniel wrote:I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.
Khun Yodrak
2013 SL

User avatar
davewill
Posts: 4980
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:04 pm
Location: San Diego, CA, US

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Mon May 23, 2011 3:26 pm

Yodrak wrote:OMG!
daniel wrote:I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.
Yeah, that's pretty steep, although it's pretty difficult to undervalue the impact fossil fuels have had on the environment. If we had to pay the FULL cost of our cars' fuel, EVs would be jumping into people's garages. Right along with PVs onto our roofs.
2014 Rav4 EV, Blizzard Pearl White
2011 LEAF SL w/QC, Blue Ocean, returned at end of lease

DarkStar
Posts: 2066
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:06 am
Delivery Date: 25 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 568
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon, USA
Contact: Website

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Mon May 23, 2011 9:45 pm

daniel wrote:At present, road maintenance is paid for my the gas tax.

All of your road maintenance? In Oregon, most of our roads are paid through property taxes and state/federal income taxes. Very little of our roads are funded through fuel taxes, but our government talks it up like without fuel taxes there wouldn't be any roads... :?
Mikiko (2011 Nissan LEAF ETEC) Status:
Reserved: 04/20/10 | Ordered: 10/01/10 | EV Project Blink Installed: 03/22/11 | Delivered: 03/25/11 | VIN: 568

Oregon Electric Vehicle Association | Electric Auto Association

daniel
Posts: 398
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:57 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Spokane, WA

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Tue May 24, 2011 5:45 am

davewill wrote:
Yodrak wrote:OMG!
daniel wrote:I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.
Yeah, that's pretty steep, although it's pretty difficult to undervalue the impact fossil fuels have had on the environment. If we had to pay the FULL cost of our cars' fuel, EVs would be jumping into people's garages. Right along with PVs onto our roofs.

Pollution, degradation of the environment, and depletion of a NON-RENEWABLE resource is placing a burden on your children which will be many times greater than what you would pay if gas was $19 a gallon ($4 + $15 tax). FAILURE to tax gasoline at a rate commensurate with the damage it causes to our environment and the distortions it causes to our balance of trade is placing a debt burden on future generations for which they will curse our memories and will wish us to burn in hell for all eternity. (Which makes me glad I don't believe in hell!) When we burn gasoline in cars we are stealing from the future. Worse: we are obligating them to an insupportable debt at a crushing rate of interest. Of course, a lot of people think it's a great bargain: We get to consume the resource, and someone else has to pay the cost.

Before WWII we used public transportation and lived closer to work. Our present transportation-dependent life style is a CHOICE we have made, which, if not reversed, will condemn future generations to a life style the peasants of medieval Europe would have considered a step down.
Reserved afternoon of 4/20.
"You can order" email late September, but was out of the country so...
Ordered very early October.
Dashboard says: more of the usual worthless Nissan b.s.
(Not on spreadsheet cuz I can't figure it out.)

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13275
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Tue May 24, 2011 8:34 am

Yodrak wrote:OMG!

daniel wrote:I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.



the estimated "true cost" of gasoline from foreign oil is said to be 250% of the pump price. that would make it $10 a gallon...not too far away
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

daniel
Posts: 398
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:57 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Spokane, WA

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Tue May 24, 2011 11:30 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
daniel wrote:I've long advocated a $15 per gallon tax on gas for this purpose.


the estimated "true cost" of gasoline from foreign oil is said to be 250% of the pump price. that would make it $10 a gallon...not too far away

We need to charge the extra $5 to fund the change-over to sustainable energy, so we don't leave the next generation burning manure to heat their homes when there's no petroleum left. :?
Reserved afternoon of 4/20.
"You can order" email late September, but was out of the country so...
Ordered very early October.
Dashboard says: more of the usual worthless Nissan b.s.
(Not on spreadsheet cuz I can't figure it out.)

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13275
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Taxing EVs for use of the roads

Tue May 24, 2011 11:40 am

daniel wrote:We need to charge the extra $5 to fund the change-over to sustainable energy, so we don't leave the next generation burning manure to heat their homes when there's no petroleum left. :?


i 2nd that... what we need is a few more hundred of these

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A ... 2F&h=346e6

a couple dozen of these

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A ... ok&h=346e6
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 11,987 miles, 485 GIDs, 37.6 kwh 110.89 Ahr , SOH 96.00, Hx 115.22
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Return to “Business / Economy and Politics”