Parking Tradeoffs - put us way in the back?

My Nissan Leaf Forum

Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Tugrik

Active member
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
26
I wasn't sure if I should put this under batteries, charging or EVSE threads… but as the reasoning behind it is mostly about PR/perception, maybe this is the best sub-board.

My company is moving to a new building. As five of us drive EVs I've taken up the drive to get charging stations in the parking garage (thus my trip to Coulomb earlier last week). The biggest challenge is with the building management as this is the first time my company is renting someone else's building instead of owning it. The building folks have been fed a ton of FUD about electric vehicles and are afraid of being on the hook for all kinds of costs and risks. Finally, though, we were able to educate and convince them, securing the rights to install two spaces (with a single, dual-headed charge point mounted between them) with the possibility of adding another pair in six months "if it all works out".

All that's left now is choosing the spaces within the garage. While there is the limitation of "has to be within (x) feet of certain conduit locations", the choice is otherwise left to me.

After thinking about it a while I'm going to pick two spots up on a higher level, farther in the back -- the "undesirable spaces". This is directly opposite the other campus locations we have where the EV spots are front-and-center, el-primo parking. Since I'm curious what my fellow Leafers think of this, here are my reasons for picking non-prime spots for our EV chargers:

* Some people use the spaces because they are "rockstar parking", even though they don't need a charge. Similar to someone using a not-yet-expired handicap tag long after they've healed up and don't need it. Making these be off in the back eliminates that temptation.
* Similarly, less chance of being ICEd as the ruder take-any-space types tend to go for fancy/close parking first.
* If us EV drivers are being green anyways, what's the harm of walking a little when we need a charge? When we don't we can use the more desirable parking up closer to the building. It gives us incentive to only charge when we need.
* Helps reduce the EV-Hate a little. We already get government rebates, carpool stickers and (in some cities) preferred parking downtown. For every person who goes "hey, cool, EV parking!" at seeing a front-and-center charger location, 10 more will grumble about more freebies to "those damn EV drivers who think they're so special". Combination of out-of-sight/out-of-mind, and being lower-key about getting our free fuel-up at work too.
* The building management has no interest in 'appearing green'; they're more worried that their precious garage (it's a rather fancy site) will get uglied up by cords and electronics. Keeping it in the back makes the building happier. Similarly, part of our contract states that the chargers cannot be made available to the public; employees only. So if they're to be locked down, why put them out front?

I'm thinking this will keep the angst down about the chargers enough that at the six month review point they'll let me install more. I'm thinking this is a good idea because if these reasons apply to other sites maybe if it'd help get more chargers approved/installed overall. I mean, hey… what would you rather have? If a mall could only have, say, 4 chargers... would you want them right at the front door, rock-star-parking, where they would commonly get ICEd, parked in by EVs who don't need a charge or used as political shouting points? Or would you rather they'd be way up in the parking garage or the back lot of the mall where only the folks needing a charge would go seek them out, giving you a much better chance of having a spot when you need it? And, since the "back 9" is probably cheaper for the mall to re-engineer, could they maybe put more chargers there than the could up front?

Dunno about you, but I'm willing to put in the extra legwork and lose a little privilege to get more charger access.
 
If I was employed by that company I would agree with your thoughts. The only thing I will add is keep them mostly together. I would not want to circle three different floors in the parking garage to determine if there is charging available.

Encouraging the use of the empty space actually makes the parking more efficient for everyone. Even the EV drivers can charge in the morning and park up front in the afternoon or the reverse. A little more walk would do good for most of us anyway.

If you use a networked charging station be sure to periodically verify it does not end up on the public map unless that is intended. I would suggest using an RFID control but no network connection. Schneider Electric also has a product to compare features and prices.
 
That's all great. The only thing that might throw a wrench into the works is handicapped access to the EVSEs. That seems to be one of the reasons that they often get installed front and center.
 
I would be in favor of adding a charge station to the EXISTING handicap space if required.
Is it required if no public access is available to the general charging spots?
 
To be honest I don't think the issue of ADA/handicap spaces vs. EV spaces has been addressed in my area. I don't think there's a requirement and with the extremely low number of chargers we get at first (just two, and already 5 of us driving EVs!) normal spaces are a priority for now.

We're using the Coulomb/chargepoint ones. Much like the ones on the Apple campus, they will be ACL locked down to our employees' chargepoint cards and as such not visible on the public maps.

Given my 'drothers, I'd much rather we put in more chargers and make them available to the public (with a proper fee, though) since we're so close to the airport. But that's just me wanting to help bring about more public EV infrastructure, which is at odds with both the building management and my company's budget. :)
 
Tugrik said:
To be honest I don't think the issue of ADA/handicap spaces vs. EV spaces has been addressed in my area. I don't think there's a requirement and with the extremely low number of chargers we get at first (just two, and already 5 of us driving EVs!) normal spaces are a priority for now.

We're using the Coulomb/chargepoint ones. ...
I would expect ChargePoint to know about any ADA requirements. The only reason I brought it up is that an ADA lawsuit threat would be exactly the sort of "costs and risks" that the building management worried about.
 
I agree with your original statements. I, too, think the best way to have dedicated EV spots is to NOT have them front and center. Not only is it more likely that ICE vehicles will stay out of them, but it doesn't get non-EV drivers a reason to be annoyed. Particularly if those spots end up not being used all the time (the mentality then is usually "why have these spots? Nobody is using them and it's forcing everyone else to park farther away").

I love the idea of having dedicated EV spots, whether an EVSE is available or not, but it certainly doesn't have to be in the choicest area of the garage.
 
we are having an issue because there is no surplus parking and some administrators feel this would create reserved spots for EV owners.
During the busiest times of the year we add valet parking to add spaces for an extra 200-300 cars.
one solution would be to put it in the most remote spots, but there is still a feeling that this "privilege" is too much.
 
thankyouOB said:
we are having an issue because there is no surplus parking and some administrators feel this would create reserved spots for EV owners.
During the busiest times of the year we add valet parking to add spaces for an extra 200-300 cars.
one solution would be to put it in the most remote spots, but there is still a feeling that this "privilege" is too much.
As long as the ratio of EV parking spaces to EV drivers is kept roughly equivalent to the ratio of regular parking spaces to ICE drivers, there is no special "privilege" created. In other words, if EV parking spots are kept in short supply just like regular spots, then I don't see any basis for them to complain. Maybe you can get them to add just one or two EV spots, with the understanding that more could be added as the number of EV drivers increases.
 
Just make valet parking a year round thing and put the charging equipment in the remote lot :D
I would be happy to valet every day.... I think. Well as long as they plug me in ;)
 
Tugrik,

I agree with your thinking on all points and think your plan for charging location is good.

With regard to the comments that have been made about ADA compliance, my company has installed 9 Level 2 chargers. None of them are associated with ADA compliant parking spaces, none of the spaces are designated as handicap only.
 
KeiJidosha said:
Tugrik said:
Dunno about you, but I'm willing to put in the extra legwork and lose a little privilege to get more charger access.
Good choice.
I prefer to park far away. Except when it is raining hard. Because of this, my cars over the years have tended to avoid the scuffs and bangs of the incompetent or inconsiderate or both... Also, the non charging EV parker, will self eliminate. To the OP, I concur!
 
Has ADA ever weighed in on this issue? The question is if the laws require equal access to the EVSE's or equal access to the EVSE's AND a building.
 
Randy said:
The distance to the power source can impact the installation costs...
Yes, that was one of the parameters the OP mentioned he had to follow in his planning...but that still allowed him freedom to choose more distant spots.
 
1. If there are only 2 spots, and 5 EVs daily, then NONE of you will be able to DEPEND upon getting a charge, right?

2. If you position the dual-head ChargePoint centered on one against-the-wall parking spot, it can probably serve 3 parking spaces.

3. However, if it is located in the center of 6 head-in parking spaces, it is possible, by sharing the day, that the two e-heads could serve 6 EVs without having to move the cars, which would be a SUBSTANTIAL increase in utility.
 
TRONZ said:
Has ADA ever weighed in on this issue? The question is if the laws require equal access to the EVSE's or equal access to the EVSE's AND a building.
I was told at the Balboa Park unveiling that one of the chargers had to be ADA compliant. Therefore one was installed in a handicap spot with an empty spot next to it so it could have dual use. The rest of the EVSEs were on the other side of the empty spot. I don't think there are different rules for public parking vs a private business, but there very well could be.
 
I agree, putting them in spaces that no one wants, helps to make sure they don't get ICE'd
also prevents Volts that those that don't need to charge, and don't want to walk from using them.
 
Back
Top