like2bike
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Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 1:36 pm

Now that we have some experience with heat pumps. Please provide thoughts on whether they are a good thing to have in an EV. Not that they are available in other EVs yet, but at least may be available in the LEAF 2. I don't have a heat pump since I have the 2013 S.
2013 Leaf S on Long Island, NY
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webeleafowners
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 1:58 pm

I was surprised to find them not available in the Teslas. Curious as to why.
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jjeff
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 2:01 pm

Also having a '13S I'd don't have a heatpump but I see no negative to having one, in colder temps heatpump cars have a resistive heater like our S models and in warmer temps you get the benefit of less energy with the heap pump.
One thing I have wondered though is how dehumidifying works with a heatpump car, with ours a heat coil comes on and also the AC to dry the air out, since I'd assume the AC and heatpump can't run at the same time in such cars they must use the heat pump and resistive heater, basically resulting in a car like ours so if thats the case it wouldn't really be that more efficient than our S models during dehumidifying in cooler temps.....but I'm not positive.

I do see a big benefit to a heat pump in something like a Prius Prime(PHEV) where it can heat while on battery only, with the old Prius's anytime you wanted heat you had to run the ICE, and in states like mine that basically meant 6+ months of the year you couldn't really run on EV only :( (oh the Prius doesn't have a resistive heater, probably due to minuscule battery).
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GerryAZ
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 2:15 pm

jjeff wrote:Also having a '13S I'd don't have a heatpump but I see no negative to having one, in colder temps heatpump cars have a resistive heater like our S models and in warmer temps you get the benefit of less energy with the heap pump.
One thing I have wondered though is how dehumidifying works with a heatpump car, with ours a heat coil comes on and also the AC to dry the air out, since I'd assume the AC and heatpump can't run at the same time in such cars they must use the heat pump and resistive heater, basically resulting in a car like ours so if thats the case it wouldn't really be that more efficient than our S models during dehumidifying in cooler temps.....but I'm not positive.

I do see a big benefit to a heat pump in something like a Prius Prime(PHEV) where it can heat while on battery only, with the old Prius's anytime you wanted heat you had to run the ICE, and in states like mine that basically meant 6+ months of the year you couldn't really run on EV only :( (oh the Prius doesn't have a resistive heater, probably due to minuscule battery).


Actually, the LEAF heat pump system (at least on 2015 model) has two heat exchangers in the duct work in the dash and can run one to heat the air while the other dehumidifies the air. Since I have had both 2011 with resistance heater and 2015 with heat pump, I can say that the heat pump is a great improvement in my climate.

Gerry
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 2:40 pm

There are more cars with heatpumps than just the Leaf and Prime. The higher end eGolf, the Kia Soul (IIRC) and the Hyundai Ioniq EV (higher trim levels), for example.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium Package and no QC, and 2009 Vectrix VX-1 with 18 Leaf cells.

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jjeff
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:33 pm

GerryAZ wrote:....
Actually, the LEAF heat pump system (at least on 2015 model) has two heat exchangers in the duct work in the dash and can run one to heat the air while the other dehumidifies the air. Since I have had both 2011 with resistance heater and 2015 with heat pump, I can say that the heat pump is a great improvement in my climate.

Gerry

Totally agree on that! Even my '13S(without a heatpump) is a great improvement overy my '12SL, on heating anyway.
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
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jjeff
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:35 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:There are more cars with heatpumps than just the Leaf and Prime. The higher end eGolf, the Kia Soul (IIRC) and the Hyundai Ioniq EV (higher trim levels), for example.

Interesting, so the high mileage Bolt doesn't have a heatpump :? If not it must be a cost cutting measure by GM, they'll probably add that feature to higher trim models in a couple years, like Nissan did on the Leaf. Gotta give early adopters a reason to upgrade ;)
It's one reason I'd be leery to purchase a 1st or even 2nd year vehicle, Nissan made great strides on the Leaf moving into it's third year, whether planned obsolescence or they actually listened to early customers I just don't know.....I'd like it to be the latter but the skeptic in me says the first may also come into play...
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
2013 S w/QC purchased new
Juicebox Premium 60a L1/L2 EVSE, Ebusbar 16a L1/L2 EVSE
'12 EVSEupgrade'd 20a L1/L2 EVSE, '13 EVSEupgrade'd adjustable 6-20a L2, 6-13a L1 EVSE
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:52 pm

Yeah, GM passed on using a heatpump, apparently to save money. They also passed on using real front seats.
2013 "Brilliant Silver" SV with Premium Package and no QC, and 2009 Vectrix VX-1 with 18 Leaf cells.

The most offensive, tasteless phrase in use here is "Pulled the trigger." I no longer respond to posts that use it.

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TomT
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 4:26 pm

The larger the battery, the less difference a heat pump makes... Plus, A/C is actually more efficient in a non-heat pump car...

jjeff wrote:Interesting, so the high mileage Bolt doesn't have a heatpump :?
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at lease return.

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jjeff
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Re: Heat pumps in EVs

Sun Feb 05, 2017 5:01 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:Yeah, GM passed on using a heatpump, apparently to save money. They also passed on using real front seats.

Yes I've read as much, too bad as I might have been interested. I'm still going to give it a sit when they hit my state but have almost zero expectations I'll care one bit for the Bolt seats :(
Also interesting about the A/C being more efficient with a non heatpump car, of course living in MN A/C isn't nearly as important as a good heater so I'd still probably prefer the heatpump but I could see where a AZ or TX resident might think differently.
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
2013 S w/QC purchased new
Juicebox Premium 60a L1/L2 EVSE, Ebusbar 16a L1/L2 EVSE
'12 EVSEupgrade'd 20a L1/L2 EVSE, '13 EVSEupgrade'd adjustable 6-20a L2, 6-13a L1 EVSE
Zencar 13, 20, 30a L1/L2 portable EVSE
GE Durastation 30a

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