mitch672
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:10 pm
Location: Boston, MA

PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Thu May 27, 2010 9:35 pm

http://www.pge.com/includes/docs/pdfs/a ... ev5pt3.pdf

To whoever was asking about a 40' or 50' cord, forget about it, in the code it is specified at 25' Maximum (from the EVSE to the vehicle), also they mention a 50A 240V outlet (L14-50R), I would try and push for that on my EVSE installation (I may actually have my electrician install it and be ready, when my service is upgraded this summer), then the entire EVSE could be take with you, to say and RV park, which has these L14-50R receptacles on 240V circuits for campers..
2012 Advanced Plug in Prius (sold)
I Support OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
My Fuelly page: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/mitch672/prius-plugin
Tesla Model S 85KW Dolphin Grey VIN: 03245, delivered 1/17/2013

User avatar
planet4ever
Posts: 4674
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:53 pm
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 2:49 am

Good find! Not that the news is all good. As you point out, however, one good news point is that a 240V 50A RV type plug does meet code for level 2 charging.

The biggest surprise to me is that a level 1 connection (120V 12A) with a plug to an ordinary wall outlet is still classified as an EVSE. I expect to average less than 30 miles/day in my Leaf, so have been planning to use level 1 charging. I now see that I need to keep a sharper eye out for restrictions that apply to all EVSEs.

Case in point: the interrupting device built into the cord must be either in the wall plug or no more than 12 cable inches away from it. So much for using an extension cord. You say you live in an apartment with parking behind the building? Sorry, no cords allowed out a window and down to the car. You're visiting your kids and parking overnight in their driveway? Sorry, you'll have to kick their car out of the garage. Nissan recommends that 120V charging be reserved for trickle charge "opportunity" use, but for most of the "opportunities" (read emergencies) I can think of away from home you're going to need an extension cord, so you'd better keep a sharp eye out for the electrical code police. ;)

At the other end of the scale, if you have some extra dough and were dreaming of installing a level 3 charger (only about $15,000!!) for the convenience of your MyNissanLeaf buddies when they come through town, you're also out of luck. Only level 1 and level 2 charging is allowed for personal use.
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

green01
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 4:32 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: San Francisco Bay Area

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 6:36 am

Very interesting. Thanks for finding this.

I know nothing about the electric code, but Tesla sells a 240 Volt Universal Mobile Charger on their website.

When a J-1772 version of this appears, I'll have the electrician install a couple of 240 Volt L14-50R receptacles (with Safety Switches & labels) in my 2-car garage and one on the front of my garage to use in the driveway.

Reading PG&Es level 2 requirements, this satisfies them. A hard-wired EVSE seems unnecessary.

I suspect the national electric code hasn't been kept up to date to reflect current electric car reality. This PG&E document does.
Bay Area/Newark, CA
Silver SL w/ QC
Ordered: 09/29/2010
Delivered: 05/15/2011

mitch672
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:10 pm
Location: Boston, MA

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 6:46 am

Very true, and I suspect that this PG&E document will very likely become what most States/Utilities adopt, since it looks reasonable, and the work has already been done for them. I wouldn't expect anything very different in any other area.
2012 Advanced Plug in Prius (sold)
I Support OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
My Fuelly page: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/mitch672/prius-plugin
Tesla Model S 85KW Dolphin Grey VIN: 03245, delivered 1/17/2013

User avatar
LEAFer
Posts: 2647
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 000215
Location: Sacramento Area

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 8:24 am

Thanks for this find. I appreciate the info, however, I need to point out that *apparently* this is Chapter 3 of "EV Infrastructure Installation Guide" by PG&E, but without the benefit of referencing the entire document. The most important concern I have is the timeliness (read: current applicability) of the document. My cursory attempt to locate the entire document -- so that we could get an idea as to its timeliness -- resulted in THIS. Although *apparently* identical, there's no proof that it is an excerpt from the same document, but most likely it is, and that means it is from March 1999. I am not trying to dispute the information or the value contained in it ... just wondering if there's an updated version (but that's all the time I can spend on this ...).

Something my mother taught me many (I am not trying to date myself!) years ago: "If your paper doesn't have a date on it ... consider it worthless." :(
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

mitch672
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:10 pm
Location: Boston, MA

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 8:34 am

Yes, it may be old, but I don't see a reason as to why they would need to update it, it still seems to be current, for the most part. Until we find a newer version, we can assume this is fairly close.

Electrical code doesn't change drasticlly from year to year, I wouldn't expect major difference from this to say the 2008 code.

Here is the full document link:

http://www.pge.com/includes/docs/pdfs/a ... ehicle.pdf
2012 Advanced Plug in Prius (sold)
I Support OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
My Fuelly page: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/mitch672/prius-plugin
Tesla Model S 85KW Dolphin Grey VIN: 03245, delivered 1/17/2013

User avatar
LEAFer
Posts: 2647
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 000215
Location: Sacramento Area

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 9:21 am

Mitch ... you're right of course. What's in Chapter 3 of the document is basic electrical safety, but my point about referencing the "whole enchilada" and finding the most recent guide stands. (btw, the link you provided, is the same I posted with the term "THIS" ... I don't know how to make it stand out more in the text). With new technologies, and Time-of-Use-Metering (dual meter? limited to 32A?), and smart grid advancements ... we want to be sure to not shoot ourselves in the foot relying on 1999 standards while planning a new installation.
(And I didn't mean to offend the OP (you) with the term "worthless" ... that was my mother speaking to me! :cry: )
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

mitch672
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:10 pm
Location: Boston, MA

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 9:38 am

Well, the Leaf is not going to have V2G, it doesn't seem to be planned for from what we have been hearing... I think we'll need to wait for EV Gen 4 for that :( (Gen 1 was the early 1900's, Gen 2 was during 1997-2002 time frame, EV1/RAV4EV), Leaf/Tesla/Volt will be Gen 3...
2012 Advanced Plug in Prius (sold)
I Support OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
My Fuelly page: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/mitch672/prius-plugin
Tesla Model S 85KW Dolphin Grey VIN: 03245, delivered 1/17/2013

AndyH
Posts: 6388
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:43 pm
Location: San Antonio

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 1:20 pm

Mitch - the National Electric Code is updated every couple of years - 2011 is/will be current. The 2009 code appears to require 240V EVSE to be hard-wired.

I don't know enough about the details of the code, and haven't seen the 2011 code, so please don't take this as definitive. But I strongly suspect the 1999 PG&E doc has been overcome by events a number of times since 1999 - at least because the SAE practices that define EVSE have changed.

Andy

mitch672
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:10 pm
Location: Boston, MA

Re: PG&E EVSE Code Requirements PDF found

Fri May 28, 2010 2:30 pm

Yes, it is updated every 2 years, but in general the changes are not signifigant.

My electrician also applied to Aerovironment to be an EVSE installer, so I'm sure he'll be able to find out the code requirements in Massachusetts. Regardless, it's only $40 for the L14-50R receptacle and the 6' UL listed molded range cord, so it's not a big deal... If it is all prepared, when they come to evaluate it, we will get a final decision at that point.
2012 Advanced Plug in Prius (sold)
I Support OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
My Fuelly page: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/mitch672/prius-plugin
Tesla Model S 85KW Dolphin Grey VIN: 03245, delivered 1/17/2013

Return to “Batteries & Charging”