FIAT 500e

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also those numbers they spout can be dubious. I am sure he is trying to roll R&D cost into the "price" which I think is really unfair. The more you sell, the less the R&D cost factor in (so its never a set number). Add to the fact that the second you use ANY of that R&D into another car (anything from simple stuff for a better ICE or even more complicated things), you automatically defray that cost. They are just playing the pity party. You know their R&D for the car will be used for many other applications so applying it to a set number of vehicles and only to the 500e is pointless.

Some people in the media had inside numbers and had come up with the same fuzzy math, rolling R&D into the cost of the volt saying it would never be profitable until the CEO came back and said that was bogus and the cost of the parts+labor was still below what they were selling the car for and that is all that matters.

Honestly, I bet 10 to 1 that the actual parts and manufacture cost for the 500e are still below what they sell the vehicle at. Chrysler/Fiat is just being whiny babies. I akin those estimations of companies rolling computer electrical usage and other overhead cost into cost estimates and project bids. Its an overhead rate, not a project billing item. I hate when they pretend that is should be in the main budget. I smack that stuff down quickly.
 
These 'new' posts are actually fairly old news; these started cropping up from the boss of Fiat just before Memorial Day ... bottom line is that the 500e like the Rav4 EV and a number of other EV's are 'compliance' cars for the mfg to meet the CA requirements to sell X% of zero emission cars in order to be able to sell the rest of their ICE car line there as well; as CA is quite a big market for most mfg.'s they would be crazy not to. This can come in the form of simply buying zero-emission credits from others (like Tesla) and/or introducing a limited run EV themselves (or jointly with some help) so while 'they lose money with everyone they sell'; its simply a price to pay to sell cars in CA; how many non-EV's can be sold with the money they've 'lost' on each one? I'm sure someone will post the formula ... many mfg. double or triple or more the average MSRP for instance in China and can easily get away with it (see older article); there has been a recent surge of high-end luxury cars being bought here and then sold and shipped overseas because of how much they cost in China; it should be noted that Tesla isn't following this trend but BMW, VW and MBZ does charge significantly more in China for a quite similar model in the U.S.:

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424127887323585604579011720493890000

Mr. Luo at the CADA said that the price difference is the result of a combination of factors such as China's robust demand for luxury cars, the country's various taxes on imported cars and a stronger position of foreign car makers than local dealers in pricing.
 
Nothing down and ~$83 a month?

I think that's close to a new record for the lowest-cost California BEV lease.

Looks like a San San Joaquin Valley resident could get another $3,000 back, and get to drive a 500e for three years for ~free?

http://valleyair.org/grants/driveclean.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

...As of last Thursday, he's driving a new charcoal grey 2015 Fiat 500e for a total lease payment of $82.75 a month for 36 months.

The deal was made possible by generous discounts on the subcompact Fiat 500e electric car; the suggested retail price of $32,000 was reduced by a $2,100 limited-time promotion offered by Fiat Chrysler Automobiles.

That brought the down payment to $11,000 for that low monthly lease cost. The Fiat 500e is eligible for a Federal income-tax credit of $7,500, which the leasing company applied directly to the down payment.

That left $3,500, which will be offset by a $2,500 purchase rebate from the state of California--which Nuxoll and other buyers will get in the form of a check in the mail several weeks after they apply for it.

In other words, Nuxoll gets to drive a brand-new electric car for three years, and it cost him a net $1,000 down and $82.75 per month. (He's limited to 10,000 miles per year, though.)

Even more remarkable, buyers who could show that they were currently leasing a car from a non-Fiat Chrysler brand received an additional $1,000 incentive.

They got the Fiat 500e, in other words, for no money down at all...

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1097299_group-buy-of-fiat-500e-electric-cars-ignites-feeding-frenzy-100-plus-bought" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
edatoakrun said:
Nothing down and ~$83 a month?

I think that's close to a new record for the lowest-cost California BEV lease.

Looks like a San San Joaquin Valley resident could get another $3,000 back, and get to drive a 500e for three years for ~free?

http://valleyair.org/grants/driveclean.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

...As of last Thursday, he's driving a new charcoal grey 2015 Fiat 500e for a total lease payment of $82.75 a month for 36 months.

The deal was made possible by generous discounts on the subcompact Fiat 500e electric car; the suggested retail price of $32,000 was reduced by a $2,100 limited-time promotion offered by Fiat Chrysler Automobiles.

That brought the down payment to $11,000 for that low monthly lease cost. The Fiat 500e is eligible for a Federal income-tax credit of $7,500, which the leasing company applied directly to the down payment.

That left $3,500, which will be offset by a $2,500 purchase rebate from the state of California--which Nuxoll and other buyers will get in the form of a check in the mail several weeks after they apply for it.

In other words, Nuxoll gets to drive a brand-new electric car for three years, and it cost him a net $1,000 down and $82.75 per month. (He's limited to 10,000 miles per year, though.)

Even more remarkable, buyers who could show that they were currently leasing a car from a non-Fiat Chrysler brand received an additional $1,000 incentive.

They got the Fiat 500e, in other words, for no money down at all...

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1097299_group-buy-of-fiat-500e-electric-cars-ignites-feeding-frenzy-100-plus-bought" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've heard of a number of electric smarts going for less in California, and unlike this deal they're open to more than just a small group of buyers.

Even my electric smart lease in the Midwest (zero state incentives) is $430 down ($0 + tax/title/fees/first month), $139 per month before any dealer incentives.
 
TomT said:
He must know the folks at Toyota! :lol:

DaveinOlyWA said:
"I will sell the (minimum) of what I need to sell and not one more," [Fiat-Chrysler CEO] Marchionne said of the 500e.

I've got a feeling that Serge must have since changed his mind, if supply of the car is such that they have to give them away for $83/month.
 
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.
10K miles/year is pretty low, but I know a fair # of people who would put that few miles on their car a year.

If I were to jump on this deal (assuming it's still available when I'm back in the market) when my Leaf lease runs out, I'd need 12K miles/year.
 
cwerdna said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.
10K miles/year is pretty low, but I know a fair # of people who would put that few miles on their car a year.

If I were to jump on this deal (assuming it's still available when I'm back in the market) when my Leaf lease runs out, I'd need 12K miles/year.

Before I got a Leaf, I was routinely racking up 15k a year or more on my personal vehicles. I signed up for the 12k/year lease plan knowing I could use my ICEV "range extender" if I was starting to rack up too many miles.

26 months later I have less than 22k miles total on my Leaf. And it's not because I'm using my ICEV a lot more either as I only put 2k miles on that in all of 2014. It's because I have started to take fewer trips that would take me outside of the Leaf's range. So I have become more Eco-friendly even if you don't take propulsion method into account.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.

The actual average miles driven per LEAF from the AVTA survey (will post link when/if I can find it) is just under 10,000 miles per year.

Lack of DC charge infrastructure obviously limits miles driven for LEAF owners in most of the USA.

And the 500e lacks DC capability, which is why it's a non-option for me, an (occasional,'82 2000 Spider) Fiat driver.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.
My average annual mileage for my Leaf stands at 10,244. Of course, I drive my Camry another 3,000 miles.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.

I put about 7000-8000 miles into my gas smart annually, no other cars.

It's not too hard to do. My commute is only about 9 miles in each direction, and I'll take maybe 1-2 trips of 300 miles or less a year.

With a lease so cheap, you could easily afford a second car--or hell, even a second electric lease--for the price of a single car. My gas smart's monthly lease cost is about $87 a month, and my electric will be about $139 a month with $430 down and no state rebates/incentives. I'll have both vehicles for 6-7 months, and together they'll be about the cost of a Leaf lease.

I'm sure Fiat only has that sale to meet CARB credit minimums for their fleet.
 
edatoakrun said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.

The actual average miles driven per LEAF from the AVTA survey (will post link when/if I can find it) is just under 10,000 miles per year.

Lack of DC charge infrastructure obviously limits miles driven for LEAF owners in most of the USA.

And the 500e lacks DC capability, which is why it's a non-option for me, an (occasional,'82 2000 Spider) Fiat driver.

LOL!!

you might want consider that people bought LEAFs because their driving needs were very modest and public charging does not play as big a role as you think it does
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
you might want consider that people bought LEAFs because their driving needs were very modest and public charging does not play as big a role as you think it does
Like me... I was putting 10K mi/year on my Passat, so the LEAF was a perfect fit for my needs.
 
^^^
The amazing deal ended awhile ago.

Today, I went for a test drive (have driven once briefly before) and to try out the stereo since a really crappy stereo (since there's no optional better stereo) would be a dealbreaker. Also, if the ride was too harsh, that'd make me think twice. I considered the Spark EV but reports of the crap stereo made me rule it out. The dealer was quite busy when I arrived and ended up having a salesman from their sister VW dealer go out w/me (who knew almost nothing about the 500e).

Stereo was fine. Ride was ok.

W/o going into negotiations, local dealer said for a 3 year 10K mile/year lease would be $3500 down and $139/mo before tax. They figured as an estimate 8.75% tax and said the doc fee and license was already part of that $3500 down. 12K miles/year would take be ~$10/mo extra.

If I wanted stuff like sunroof, orange or pearl white paint, that's extra $. I believe white interior was more $, as well. I wouldn't go for any of that.

They mentioned $1000 conquest cash if I was leasing a car from another manufacturer. They just needed my registration card showing the lien holder.

Hmm... seems tempting. Total cost of lease for a 3 years/36K miles due to the conquest cash and after $2500 CVRP would be ~$5671.

If I extend my '13 Leaf lease for another year (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=427353#p427353" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;), I'd have to pay $3140 in payments and probably buy new tires for it.

If I were doing a 3 year lease on a 500e, it might also need new tires at lease end.

However, since I have an '13 Leaf SV w/premium + QC + LED packages, I'd lose DC FC capability (not that important to me), around view monitor (like a LOT) and anything like Intelligent Key System. It just has an old fashioned metal key to put in the steering column and I'd have to futz w/buttons on the key (fob). Also, the TomTom nav unit on a bracket feels like an afterthought.
cwerdna said:
DaveinOlyWA said:
10,000 miles? what is the overage rate? I mean 10,000 miles? I only know a handful of drivers that puts that little on their cars annually.
10K miles/year is pretty low, but I know a fair # of people who would put that few miles on their car a year.

If I were to jump on this deal (assuming it's still available when I'm back in the market) when my Leaf lease runs out, I'd need 12K miles/year.
My mom's Altima Hybrid bought new in Feb 08 has somewhere under 40K miles, IIRC. My 06 Prius is now hardly driven since I have my Leaf. It's WAY under 10K miles/year now... probably more like 3K to 5K max.
 
SteveInSeattle said:
I found the ride on the FiatEV to be firmer than the Leaf with considerably more road noise. Made me appreciate how quiet the Leaf is.

BUT...the 500e's ride was "slot car" like (as to a certain extent is that of the i3). As a classic Mini Owner I found it similarly exhilarating.
 
Firm suspension is fun on the twisty roads, but gets old quickly when you have to drive on a typical California highway full of potholes, large cracks, and uneven concrete slabs.

For driving around the city, my Leaf is far more comfortable than my Audi A3 (which doesn't even have the optional "Sport" suspension). Passengers who regularly ride in my car and have ridden in both vehicles also agree.
 
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