Limited Power - Motor power is being limited (Error with full charge)

My Nissan Leaf Forum

Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
I don't want to beat this thread into the dirt, but lastly, is the below screenshot showing anything useful? Seems strange cell pair 59 is so low.

3xcJciP.png
 
Thanks all for the help.
I'll post a summary when the repair is done. This group / thread has been very helpful.

Our local dealership called and said it was confirmed a bad Cell. The Cell is being shipped ground and they need two certified Techs, so another is going to be sent also -- to assist in the replacement. So it's another week at least before it will be all fixed.

For me, I need to decide if I want to keep the leaf after the extended warranty is up. If it was out of warranty, I would probably opted to just have the whole battery replaced. I've heard that the 120 mile packs cost around 5K. I have no idea if they would be user installable.

When I purchased the Leaf in 2011, I thought maintenance on an electric would be mush simpler, cheaper and quicker. I can see, this is not true. Since I have one of the originals, I am predicting all Leaf users will evenntually go through this if they keep their cars long enough. For me, I was planning on keeping it long enough for a ROI for a new electric car in 7 years.

Lastly, I have a loaner Gas car. Wow, I had forgotten how herky jerky gas cars are... and OMG, the gas prices!

Thanks again! I'll post a wrap up when I get the Leaf back for all the other Leaf owners who will eventually go through this!
 
MarkAugie said:
For me, I need to decide if I want to keep the leaf after the extended warranty is up. If it was out of warranty, I would probably opted to just have the whole battery replaced. I've heard that the 120 mile packs cost around 5K. I have no idea if they would be user installable.
Cell failure like you experienced is very rare. But it is covered for 8 years / 100,000 miles.

A 24 kWh 2015 LEAF pack (which can be fitted into all 2011-2015 LEAFs) costs about $6,000 installed. It is not user installable. It is unknown whether the 2016 30 kWh pack will be retrofitable to older LEAFs or not and what the cost will be when Nissan makes it available.
 
MarkAugie said:
Thanks all for the help.
I'll post a summary when the repair is done. This group / thread has been very helpful.

Our local dealership called and said it was confirmed a bad Cell. The Cell is being shipped ground and they need two certified Techs, so another is going to be sent also -- to assist in the replacement. So it's another week at least before it will be all fixed.

For me, I need to decide if I want to keep the leaf after the extended warranty is up. If it was out of warranty, I would probably opted to just have the whole battery replaced. I've heard that the 120 mile packs cost around 5K. I have no idea if they would be user installable.

When I purchased the Leaf in 2011, I thought maintenance on an electric would be mush simpler, cheaper and quicker. I can see, this is not true. Since I have one of the originals, I am predicting all Leaf users will evenntually go through this if they keep their cars long enough. For me, I was planning on keeping it long enough for a ROI for a new electric car in 7 years.

Lastly, I have a loaner Gas car. Wow, I had forgotten how herky jerky gas cars are... and OMG, the gas prices!

Thanks again! I'll post a wrap up when I get the Leaf back for all the other Leaf owners who will eventually go through this!
Are you located in a warm environment ? Mileage seems pretty good, I couldn't find your location.
 
I commute from Milwaukie Oregon to Hillsboro Oregon 5 days a week since I purchased the Leaf in 2011.
Depending on the route, 50-70 miles a day. 2 to 3 hours of driving.

Today it hit 102. Rare. We go below freezing 20 days out of a year. Seldom into the teens.

One day this year we got some Ice. My Leaf slid out into the road while parked in my driveway :) Not sure about anyone else, but I don't drive my Leaf on snow. Luckily, we have few snow days.
 
Summary:
Dealership replaced cell 60 in module 30.
It took a a total of 3 weeks. Once issue diagnosed 1.5 weeks. It took another 1.5 weeks to ship the battery and get another certifed tech to replace the battery cell. It sounds like they need two certificated techs to replace a cell.

My mileage range increased 10 miles on a full charge. I still will not risk my 50 mile round trip to work without charging at work. A few years ago, I could easily drive 70 miles on a charge.

What have I learned?
* Well, the first day I brought in my car with this issue, I received a report claiming my batteries were at 95 percent. Well, I can confirm, whatever test they use for that fancy chart is dead wrong.

* Leafspy is a good product to diagnose Battery issues.

* This forum is awesome! Thanks Guys! You had figured out what was wrong before the tehcs.

Below is a snip of the new cell. Kind of obvious which one it is huh? BTW what do the red lines mean?

suTp8Ex.png
 
Red lines mean the cell pair is being shunted to balance the voltage with other cells. I was making my 52-mile roundtrip mostly freeway commute without issue with 8 capacity bars remaining before Nissan replaced the battery in my 2011. I was discharging to VLBW every day (nearly to Turtle), but I always made it home.

Gerry
 
Eek! They sure didn't balance the new module that well. What's the cell-pair voltages look like at 100%?

The new module will hit 100% before the rest of the pack limiting usable capacity.

Eventually the module will come back into balance and you should pick up more range. I'd grab a screenshot every day, I'd love to see how long it takes.

Once it's balanced at 100%, you'll see the module have higher voltages at low states of charge.

BTW, it's not possible to replace just one cell, the entire module has to be replaced which contains 4 cells in 2-parallel 2-series configuration.
 
Does this mean that newer modules are compatible with the 2011 pack/LBC or Nissan stocks old module design, possibly used modules from warranty replacement core returns? Do you have the part code for the module they replaced somewhere on paperwork? I assume this work was done for free under battery warranty?
 
They replaced module 30 which contains cell pairs 59 and 60. Those two cell pairs should get balanced with the 47 original modules after a few charge/discharge cycles. As the pack gets better balanced, the BMS will allow deeper discharge and higher charge so you should get some range back.

Gerry
 
MarkAugie said:
I don't want to beat this thread into the dirt, but lastly, is the below screenshot showing anything useful? Seems strange cell pair 59 is so low.

3xcJciP.png

I got the same power is limited error on my 2013 SL after a full charge yesterday. Was able to drive 40-50 mph on flat roads though from 0-30 mph was annoying slow (for the people behind me) though I was able to get it to the dealer 40 miles away via backroads.

My dealership diagnosed Cell 57 as bad. First one the dealership has seen with this error. I was able to give them some hints from this forum so thanks everyone. It looks like it will take at least a week but it sounds like I can probably plan for 2-3 weeks. Got a loaner easy breezy from them.

To add to this thread and perhaps as a harbinger of what was to come: My Leaf had been quickly discharging once I hit about 50-55 miles remaining. I would start with 85-90 miles, and though my commute was only 47 miles, mostly at highway speeds, I was getting to work lately with only about 15 miles remaining and I did not use any climate control on most days. Last year I was arriving at work with about 40 miles remaining. Chargepoint app had been telling me that it had given me about 12 KWh (~50%) of a charge, though I should have received about 18-20 KWh. I suspected something was wrong and was about to take it in anyway.

Anyway, thanks again for this discussion. Looking forward to less range anxiety as I will need to use climate control (AC) if winter ever lets go here in Denver.
 
^^^ will it be covered under the 3 year warranty, if not did they say how much it was going to cost? I take it they are going to just replace the bad cell?
 
My 2013 Leaf S has been diagnosed with a bad cell at 30,000 miles. I still have all 12 battery bars but moderately reduced range. Leaf Spy has been showing a low cell for 2+ years. Hopefully the dealer can have it fixed in a week.

Jeff
N. California
 
DesertSprings said:
Bad cells should be covered under the 8 year battery warranty.
Even if the car is showing more than 8 bars? and if so, what exactly constitutes a bad cell and not just a weak cell?
 
jjeff said:
DesertSprings said:
Bad cells should be covered under the 8 year battery warranty.
Even if the car is showing more than 8 bars? and if so, what exactly constitutes a bad cell and not just a weak cell?

Most capacity loss is the result of all of the cells losing substantial capacity. A bad cell may not drop the capacity that much overall if the other cells are great, but it is still covered by the "defect" warranty, because it's a manufacturing defect, not what Nissan calls "gradual" capacity loss.
 
drees said:
Eek! They sure didn't balance the new module that well. What's the cell-pair voltages look like at 100%?

The new module will hit 100% before the rest of the pack limiting usable capacity.

Eventually the module will come back into balance and you should pick up more range. I'd grab a screenshot every day, I'd love to see how long it takes.

Once it's balanced at 100%, you'll see the module have higher voltages at low states of charge.

BTW, it's not possible to replace just one cell, the entire module has to be replaced which contains 4 cells in 2-parallel 2-series configuration.
If Nissan is defects warranty replacing modules instead of packs, just how many modules in a stack would constitute a stack replacement?
When the pack is manufactured, it is assembled and enclosed in an uncontaminated and sterile environment. Would not opening the the pack and servicing the cells not expose the remaining pack to say high humidity levels and develop into corrosion , or various other contaminants?
I guess a new module is better than no module but IMHO have reservations about it.
 
ElectricEddy said:
When the pack is manufactured, it is assembled and enclosed in an uncontaminated and sterile environment. Would not opening the the pack and servicing the cells not expose the remaining pack to say high humidity levels and develop into corrosion , or various other contaminants?
I guess a new module is better than no module but IMHO have reservations about it.
Eddy,
I can answer this as I have opened and worked on 8 packs so far.
While the pack is wheather-proof, itis *not* air tight.
In fact, if you remove the service disconnect you can look right into the pack, as the O-ring to seal the disconnect plug is in the plug itself that you pull out.
In addition, Nissan does not want to risk problems with pressure difference between inside and outside of such a big enclosure, that could easily lead to deformation, so there are 4 breather openings on the 2011/2012 packs (cost optimised to 2 on 2013+ packs), so ambient air can flow into and out of the shell and equalize pressure. In some conditions this could indeed cause some buildup of moisture from condensation, but the continuous breathing will also allow that to vaporize and dissipate over time again.
Hope this clarifies.
 
Back
Top