LEAF Fire in North Texas

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jpadc said:
... As a proportion of total number of cars manufactured and sold, even ONE LEAF fire makes this car a statistically higher risk than most any other on the road today ...
Clearly there is room for debate and discussion, but that statement really needs some supporting data.
 
jpadc said:
Firetruck41 said:
I would say it is probably more common for modern car fires to be a result of a 12v issue, than a fuel/fluid/engine heat problem.
Not according to these guys, and they work for insurance companies. Note they attribute 12 volt fires to battery charging and batteries sparking and catching fuel on fire. http://www.waltersforensic.com/articles/fire_investigation/vol3-no1.htm
Meh... sounds like yesteryear. In my experience in modern cars, 12v is more likely cause. There are a few issues in that marketing material that aren't quite jiving with my experiences putting out those fires.
 
jpadc said:
Firetruck41 said:
I would say it is probably more common for modern car fires to be a result of a 12v issue, than a fuel/fluid/engine heat problem.
Not according to these guys, and they work for insurance companies. Note they attribute 12 volt fires to battery charging and batteries sparking and catching fuel on fire. http://www.waltersforensic.com/articles/fire_investigation/vol3-no1.htm

you are attributing that to fuel only but not everyone takes that view.

See howstuffworks version of that

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/car-driving-safety/accidents-hazardous-conditions/10-causes-of-car-fires.htm#page=9

Electrical system failures take the second spot on the list because they're the second most common cause of car fires [source: Walters Forensic Engineering]. Car batteries are problematic, and not just the hybrid and all-electric vehicle battery pack types we've already discussed. A typical car's standard battery is capable of causing plenty of trouble. The battery's charging cycles can cause explosive hydrogen gas to build up in the engine bay, and the electrical current the battery provides (along with faulty or loose wiring) can produce sparks that can quickly ignite a fluid drip or leaked vapors. The electrical system's hazards aren't confined to the area under the hood, either. Electrical wiring runs throughout the entire car; through channels, into doors, under the carpet and through powered and heated seats, just to name a few places where a stray, unnoticed frayed wire could cause havoc.
 
Come on guys, this debate could go on forever. Bottom line is, thus far we do not know why my car caught fire! Speculation comes from many angles and ends in even more angles. I began to engage in this forum because I am the one who experienced this problem and am hoping nobody else has but urge safety and concern going forward. I will not own another Leaf after my personal experience, but I hope for everyone's sake that my car was an isolated incident and not part of a larger number that is being covered up or has yet to emerge.
 
Shawn75067 said:
I have pictures from afterward, but do not know how to post them from my computer on here.
You should be able to put some up at free image sharing sites like Flickr, Imageshack, Imgur, Picasa or maybe Pinterest.

Or... us paid members can post pics, but it's some work on our part.

Again, very sorry to hear about your ordeal and totally get you wouldn't want another Leaf. Please file that safety complaint w/NHTSA, if you haven't already. Hope they get to the bottom of this and yours was a one-off or that if there is a recall class problem, they figure it out and issue a recall for the affected cars.
 
Shawn75067 said:
Come on guys, this debate could go on forever. Bottom line is, thus far we do not know why my car caught fire! Speculation comes from many angles and ends in even more angles. I began to engage in this forum because I am the one who experienced this problem and am hoping nobody else has but urge safety and concern going forward. I will not own another Leaf after my personal experience, but I hope for everyone's sake that my car was an isolated incident and not part of a larger number that is being covered up or has yet to emerge.
Shawn,

So glad that nobody was hurt. Has your insurance company said anything?

J.
 
I did file with on safe car and haven't heard anything yet. My insurance company Unfortunately never did tell me and seem unsure of what caused the fire, they deemed it totaled and moved on. I'll keep everyone posted if there is any more news. Feel free to ask any questions if you need further detail of the incident.
 
Shawn75067 said:
Come on guys, this debate could go on forever. Bottom line is, thus far we do not know why my car caught fire! Speculation comes from many angles and ends in even more angles. I began to engage in this forum because I am the one who experienced this problem and am hoping nobody else has but urge safety and concern going forward. I will not own another Leaf after my personal experience, but I hope for everyone's sake that my car was an isolated incident and not part of a larger number that is being covered up or has yet to emerge.
Shawn:
I am certainly glad you did. Please, this "debate" is nothing more than a little back and forth banter that makes the board fun. It would be a boring place if everyone always agreed. But I certainly don't want you to feel like the place and thread is unwelcoming so, as you request, I'll let the discussion drop. The important thing is to ultimately let us know if/when you learn something. I for one hope my colleagues are right and this really is "nothing to see here"
 
Thank you for your reply and insight. I am a very laid back guy and not familiar with forums like this. I was sensing conflict and apologize for my misunderstanding. I jumped on because after finding this feed, I saw so much speculation that was off track and was hoping to give first hand insight of what did occur and welcome any information that may be helpful as well.
 
Firetruck41 said:
jpadc said:
Firetruck41 said:
I would say it is probably more common for modern car fires to be a result of a 12v issue, than a fuel/fluid/engine heat problem.
Not according to these guys, and they work for insurance companies. Note they attribute 12 volt fires to battery charging and batteries sparking and catching fuel on fire. http://www.waltersforensic.com/articles/fire_investigation/vol3-no1.htm
Meh... sounds like yesteryear. In my experience in modern cars, 12v is more likely cause. There are a few issues in that marketing material that aren't quite jiving with my experiences putting out those fires.

Same with my experience doing failure analysis.

Bulk of any rv/boat/buss/truck/semi fires are traced directly to bad or failed 12v wiring.

It is a standard because of age NOT SAFETY

@jpadc

24V is a far better value in modern, current(Amp) hungry vehicles, and better in a shock hazard sense as well

Low voltage = High current
High current = more heat potential (I^2*R)

This is why we run houses at 120/240V and not 6 to 36V
 
I'm the owner of the car and I was never given any further details of the cause. Unfortunately it is a dead-end anywhere I tried to get any info. I have moved on and hope nobody else goes through this with their car.

Best wishes, Shawn
 
Thanks for the update. I suppose an isolated incident like this is not enough to trigger a full blown investigation unless there were injuries or fatalities, which fortunately there was none in this case. Oh well, the rest of us will now have to live in fear :)
 
Valdemar said:
Thanks for the update. I suppose an isolated incident like this is not enough to trigger a full blown investigation unless there were injuries or fatalities, which fortunately there was none in this case. Oh well, the rest of us will now have to live in fear :)

If that makes you scared how do you manage to get out side during the day?

why not live in a bubble in bunker the air is scary too!

Political fear culture is why the governments been able to bend you over and strip you of every right you have! and counting! grow a pair and live life!
 
Jedlacks said:
Valdemar said:
Oh well, the rest of us will now have to live in fear :)

hmmm... nope.

Cars catch fire and burn all the time. Houses do also... IJS

http://www.nfpa.org/public-education/by-topic/property-type-and-vehicles/vehicles

152,300 Automobile fires per year - 417 per day - 17 per hour around the clock!!

6% of all US Fire related deaths. - 209 deaths per year - 764 injuries per year

536 million in direct property damage per year - $3,519/car fire
 
With no injuries or deaths along with being an isolated incident there would be little motivation to spend the money on a full forensic investigation.

I had a motor home catch fire while driving down the interstate and the insurance investigator was very candid about it. With no deaths or injuries and only property damage of less than $100,000 there was no reason for them to start a full $35,000 to $50,000 fire investigation to determine the root cause of what appeared to be an isolated incident. If there were deaths, injuries, multiple occurrences following a pattern or something overtly suspicious then that would be different. The insurance company offered that it was up to me if I wanted to consult an attorney and look into taking to task the last person who worked on the vehicle in the area where the fire was first noticed. The insurance adjusters feeling was that it was more likely human error on the part of the last mechanic who worked on it however that would be prohibitively costly to prove with little chance of recovering the expense.

Was there a cell phone charger or some USB device plugged in at the time? Any after market electrically powered items wired into the car such as an emergency band radio, CB, amplifier, sub woofer or alarm system? Any of the above could be suspect in an electrical fire. I almost had one in my 1978 124 Spider Convertible a few months ago when an item with a faulty plug overheated the accessory outlet in the center console. Thankfully I had the radio out and had a way to get to the area that was smoldering before things got out of hand. No fuses blew and non were oversized. It was just a cheap Chinese accessory plug that heated up the socket causing enough heat to start things smoldering behind the dash according to what I observed during my 50 cent investigation.

On other item that comes to mind is that many car fires seem to be related to the wiring for heated seats which in the Leaf with the switches to control them in the center console could be suspect in this case too.
 
XeonPony said:
Valdemar said:
Thanks for the update. I suppose an isolated incident like this is not enough to trigger a full blown investigation unless there were injuries or fatalities, which fortunately there was none in this case. Oh well, the rest of us will now have to live in fear :)

If that makes you scared how do you manage to get out side during the day?

why not live in a bubble in bunker the air is scary too!

Political fear culture is why the governments been able to bend you over and strip you of every right you have! and counting! grow a pair and live life!

Wow. Just...wow. I'm 62, lived in the states all my life. I had no idea I had been stripped "...of every right you have! and counting!...)

Really? Could you be more specific? I haven't noticed a single stripping as of yet...still drive the highways, sometimes even at triple digits, still own a gun,...

Sorry for the thread drift, but really, this statement by XeonPony (Canadian, I assume???) shouldn't go w/o comment.
 
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