2017 Prius Prime PHEV

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GRA said:
Has anyone ever bought... a car from GM (at least in the past 40 years) because they expected exceptional reliability from it?
Plenty of GM fanboys have. Oh boy... you should check out some of the GM fanboy defenders on some places like Cruzetalk.com when Cruze reliability was AWFUL for years. They'll claim that Japanese cars are not more reliable, CR and all reliability surveys are biased, BS, paid off, etc., give all sorts of anecdotal reports of unreliable Japanese cars (sure, there's always going to be %), and so on.

Surprisingly, the most recent model year of Cruze got a very good reliability rating in CR, unlike virtually all previous model years. It'll be interesting to see if that holds over the long term.

I'm sure there are many other such places...

Funny enough, I do pay for a subscription to Car and Driver. As for Prius Prime... well, Gen 4 Prius (non-plugin; began with model year 2016 was awful in terms of styling. :( At least they fixed the front and mostly fixed the back. Even though I'm still somewhat of a Prius fan, I'd never buy a Gen 4 non-plugin just due to its styling. Prius Prime is actually "fixed" enough that it'd be on my consideration list if I'm in the market for a hybrid or PHEV.
 
GM fanboys.. Toyota Fanboys.. Tesla fanboys.

In my life I've owned three Toyotas (2dr RAV4 ice, gen1 RAV4-EV, gen2 Prius) and three GM vehicles (gen1 EV1 (15kWh!!), gen2 EV1 and now the Volt2).

The Toyotas were rock solid. I don't recall any of them requiring service despite how much I pounded on them.

I can't say that about the EV1s. They were in the shop multiple times.

But I didn't mind at all. I loved the EV1 and it's the most fun I've ever had with a car (EV1 fanboy?) Like Tesla, GM (via the Saturn dealerships) knew how to pamper their early adopters. If your car needed service they always had another EV1 loaner for you while your car was in the shop. All at no cost.

As for looks, I thought the EV1 looked like a cool spaceship. One time I parked the car, got out and a passerby on the sidewalk looked at the car then looked at me and said "That's the most f&ing ugly car I've ever seen!" I was a bit shocked at first. Different strokes I guess.
 
While I never owned an EV1, a buddy did and I got to drive it often... I loved that car! And I thought it was way-cool looking!

GregH said:
I loved the EV1 and it's the most fun I've ever had with a car (EV1 fanboy?) Like Tesla, GM (via the Saturn dealerships) knew how to pamper their early adopters. As for looks, I thought the EV1 looked like a cool spaceship. One time I parked the car, got out and a passerby on the sidewalk looked at the car then looked at me and said "That's the most f&ing ugly car I've ever seen!" I was a bit shocked at first. Different strokes I guess.
 
TomT said:
I knew there had to be SOMEONE out there who liked the looks of the current Prius!
Not me. I call it acceptable, which spans a range that includes most cars on the market today. I'm more of a Bolt look (minus the ostentatious, huge logo on the front) kind of guy, all else being equal.
 
TomT said:
GregH said:
I loved the EV1 and it's the most fun I've ever had with a car (EV1 fanboy?) Like Tesla, GM (via the Saturn dealerships) knew how to pamper their early adopters. As for looks, I thought the EV1 looked like a cool spaceship. One time I parked the car, got out and a passerby on the sidewalk looked at the car then looked at me and said "That's the most f&ing ugly car I've ever seen!" I was a bit shocked at first. Different strokes I guess.
While I never owned an EV1, a buddy did and I got to drive it often... I loved that car! And I thought it was way-cool looking!
Definitely different strokes. For me, the EV1 always brought to mind the 'car of the future' in Woody Allen's
"Sleeper," and my reaction was similar to his: http://editorial.designtaxi.com/news-woodyallenpredicts1210/3.jpeg

Some people have noticed similarities to a different BEV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnT6_S-aECc
:lol:
 
cwerdna said:
GRA said:
Has anyone ever bought... a car from GM (at least in the past 40 years) because they expected exceptional reliability from it?
Plenty of GM fanboys have. Oh boy... you should check out some of the GM fanboy defenders on some places like Cruzetalk.com when Cruze reliability was AWFUL for years. They'll claim that Japanese cars are not more reliable, CR and all reliability surveys are biased, BS, paid off, etc., give all sorts of anecdotal reports of unreliable Japanese cars (sure, there's always going to be %), and so on.

Surprisingly, the most recent model year of Cruze got a very good reliability rating in CR, unlike virtually all previous model years. It'll be interesting to see if that holds over the long term.

I'm sure there are many other such places...

Funny enough, I do pay for a subscription to Car and Driver. As for Prius Prime... well, Gen 4 Prius (non-plugin; began with model year 2016 was awful in terms of styling. :( At least they fixed the front and mostly fixed the back. Even though I'm still somewhat of a Prius fan, I'd never buy a Gen 4 non-plugin just due to its styling. Prius Prime is actually "fixed" enough that it'd be on my consideration list if I'm in the market for a hybrid or PHEV.
I haven't seen a Prime in the flesh yet (but oddly enough have seen a Bolt in the wild, despite the 4:1 disparity in sales to date) so can't say for certain, but judging by photos most of the more egregious styling miscues of the HEV Prius Gen. 4 seem to have been improved on the Prime. Jury's still out on the rear, though. I could probably live with its looks, but not with everything else.
 
SageBrush said:
That's OK -- I find muddled thinking (or is it just a bit of hypocrisy ?) more than a little offensive.

If you "don't care" if you are are "understood," then why post ? Surely the "understanding" of one anonymous reader is equal to another ? I think you are looking for agreement. I recommend volt.com

The rest of your post is at least honest
A host of priorities, some of them conflicting, lead you in the end to choose a Volt. Fair enough, but "I wanted a heating steering wheel" and "I don't find the Prius fun or attractive" have NOTHING to do with your original post that the Volt was chosen based on AER. Like many a Volt owner I have read, ONE of your priorities is to drive high torque EV on most days and you are willing to to turn a blind eye towards EV efficiency, overall fuel utilization, tailpipe emissions, plant emissions and carbon pollution.

118792_IMG_2014.jpg


http://mynissanleaf.com/posting.php?mode=quote&f=10&p=481338
https://attachments.priuschat.com/attachment-files/2017/01/118792_IMG_2014.jpg

Nah, none of us volt owners care about the environment

What with my summer long 232mpge and 49mpg on the gas brick on a Gen I volt !

I also get free fillups with partially "renewable" electricity 5 days a week.

obviously the average person driving a Tesla, Prius Prime or Nissan leaf uses less energy than 6.9 miles per kwhr

and can then drive 3500 miles out and back to Yellowstone park without any frustration.

But no every volt uses more energy than other EVs and the non-existant charging architecture out west and 15 minute 200 mile fillup requirements are no hindrance either.

Obviously my 49mpg on the gen I volts gas brick is so MUCH worse than an average Prius.

And the volt is so much more unreliable what with it going 300,000 miles before needing a new set of front wheel bearings
http://www.voltstats.net/Stats/Details/1579
and zero battery degradation.

And yeah, I should own a T3, where do I go buy one of those unicorns?

Some people have to live in reality,

until I can buy a T3 and the governments VW paved electric highway initiative goes through all areas...

well I can see your point but with the right hat you could cover it.
 
Via IEVS:
Toyota Prius Prime Test Drive Review From UK Finds Other Competitors Closing In
http://insideevs.com/toyota-prius-prime-test-drive-review-from-uk-finds-other-competitors-closing-in/

. . . Overall, Autocar laments that Toyota could have done better with the offering overall (driving experience, better material quality and practicality) and that the earlier Prius first mover advantage has been exhausted.

"…compared to the hybrid state of the art – the latest-generation petrol-electric offerings from the European car-makers who’ve spent two decades trailing in Toyota’s wake but are now in a position to go toe-to-toe with it – it’s weedy and one-dimensional“. . . .
Yup, still a Prius.
 
Well we checked out the Prius Prime today and were pleasantly surprised. I liked the styling much better than the (IMO) fugly new Prius and while at first I was quite upset at the lack of the 5th seat(middle rear) I guess we rarely use that in our '07 Prius and without it you gain a nice storage/cup holder thingy. I'd still probably rather have the 5th seat but it's no longer the deal breaker I once thought it might be.
Compared the Prius to several other PHEVs with similar ranges and the Prius still seems to be the one to beat in it's class. A big selling point to me in my climate is it's heat-pump heater, from what I can tell not a very common thing in EVs or for sure PHEVs.
 
jjeff said:
Well we checked out the Prius Prime today and were pleasantly surprised. I liked the styling much better than the (IMO) fugly new Prius <snip>
I've seen four or five Primes now, and I agree that unlike the Gen 4 Prius it's not fugly. Still ugly IMO, but I don't feel the need to avert my eyes as with the regular Prius. :shock:
 
Thanks to my FB feed, I spotted a post pointing to http://www.cleanmpg.com/community/index.php?threads/53726/page-2#post-422833.

Keep in mind this is before taxes and that sales tax would be on the purchase price of the car. Wayne Gerdes aka xcel said:
Hi All:

There is currently approximately $700 discount off MSRP being offered from the California area dealerships and $1,000 rebate from Toyota currently. For California consumers, this brings a Prius Prime Plus to just over $20k +TTL. I think there may more $s on the hood by late summer given both the Ioniq and Niro PHEVs are scheduled to arrive this fall.

$27,965 to start including the $865 D&H charge
$4,500 Fed Tax Credit
$1,500 Calif. State tax rebate
$700 off retail
$1,000 Toyota Rebate
__________________

$20,265
Wow. Seems like a pretty cheap way to get green HOV stickers. If I were in the market for an ICEV to replace my 06 Prius, I'd actually consider this.
 
cwerdna said:
Thanks to my FB feed, I spotted a post pointing to http://www.cleanmpg.com/community/index.php?threads/53726/page-2#post-422833.

Keep in mind this is before taxes and that sales tax would be on the purchase price of the car. Wayne Gerdes aka xcel said:
Hi All:

There is currently approximately $700 discount off MSRP being offered from the California area dealerships and $1,000 rebate from Toyota currently. For California consumers, this brings a Prius Prime Plus to just over $20k +TTL. I think there may more $s on the hood by late summer given both the Ioniq and Niro PHEVs are scheduled to arrive this fall.

$27,965 to start including the $865 D&H charge
$4,500 Fed Tax Credit
$1,500 Calif. State tax rebate
$700 off retail
$1,000 Toyota Rebate
__________________

$20,265
Wow. Seems like a pretty cheap way to get green HOV stickers. If I were in the market for an ICEV to replace my 06 Prius, I'd actually consider this.
That does sound good when you put it that way, and while I don't have the paperwork with me right now I believe it might even be cheaper than what we paid for our '07 Prius, which at the time was in high demand due to high gas prices and therefor wasn't discounted one bit, there were waiting lists at least in my state.
Not to derail this thread too long but since you have a '06 and I a '07 Prius, aren't you starting to worry about any possible upcoming maintenance issues with your Prius? I mean for the past several cars I've liked to buy new and drive for 10 years, thus avoiding most repairs. It's worked well and in the case of my '94 Geo Metro worked very well as about 6 months after selling it the purchaser had a catastrophic failure that resulted in it being junked. I kind of felt bad about it but it had been 6 months and I can truthfully say I knew nothing about failure or that it would happen, since then I've found it's somewhat common for Geos of those years in my climate(rust causing the whole front end to fall to the ground, non repairable). Anyway thats why I've been thinking of replacing our Prius. It still runs great, somewhat low mileage I believe for it's age(~80k) and no visible rust. I'm just worried something might go wrong with say the NiMh pack(which I've read can be somewhat expensive to replace and might be required to drive the car) or even electrical problems which could also be costly to fix. We'd also have the advantage if going with the Prime of using even less gas as my wifes commute(who is the primary driver) works well within the Prime's EV range, thus possibly reducing our gas usage to longer trips, or maybe a bit more if the Prime is like the Volt and likes to run the engine to make sure the gas doesn't get too old. As it is now unless were using it for a trip she generally only has to full up monthly as when not commuting she uses one of our Leafs and uses no gas.
 
Via IEVS:
Toyota Prius Prime Wins 2017 World Green Car Award
http://insideevs.com/toyota-prius-prime-wins-2017-world-green-car-award/

The Toyota Prius Prime earned the nod for the 2017 World Green Car title at the New York International Auto Show this week. For Japanese manufacturer, it’s the second title in a row, as year ago Toyota Mirai hydrogen fuel cell model was considered the best.

The win by Prius Prime could be the right choice as initial sales results are pretty encouraging, although we have to say…we thought it would go to the Chevrolet Bolt EV, which has been sucking up awards like a Dyson vacuum cleaner lately. . . .

Vehicles in all award categories are selected and voted on by an international jury panel comprising 75 top-level automotive journalists from 23 countries around the world. . . .”
 
We own a Prius Prime and now have about 3 weeks of use.

This is the fourth* car in the Prius family we have bought and hands down it is the best as an overall package. As a car it is quiet, has dynamics about on par with the LEAF (a good thing), and is pleasant to drive. I don't really view the Prime as an EV, but as a fuel sipper and in that context it exceeds my high expectations. It is mostly used to drive my 90 mile commute to work, and it gets a little bit of in-town driving. The first ~ 800 miles on the car are averaging 105 mpg and I'm pretty confident that the annualized mpg will be over 90 after winter is included. My wife and I combined drive ~ 16,000 miles a year and this will work out to about $25 a month in fuel costs between petrol and our home PV supplied kWh for the Prime and LEAF at current petrol prices. The PV is of course fixed at ~ 2.5 cents a kWh.

Not including TTL I paid $17,000 which is an astounding price for the car, but keep in mind that Colorado chipped in $5,000.

*
2004 Prius
2011 Lexus CT 200h
2012 Prius vagon
 
Via GCR:
Toyota Prius One: stripped-down hybrid added at lower price
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1109910_toyota-prius-one-stripped-down-hybrid-added-at-lower-price

It hasn't been the greatest of years for the Toyota Prius hybrid, the Japanese carmaker's flagship product. The fourth generation hybrid hatchback debuted as a 2016 model into the teeth of continued low gasoline prices, and its radical design language apparently turned off at least some potential buyers. Now Toyota is taking steps to make the Prius more "accessible" to a greater pool of buyers. . . .

The new Prius One base model is a mid-year addition. It'll have about a $1,200 advantage in price over the current Prius Two, with some minor sacrifices in equipment. Those include the omission of three components: a spare tire, a rear-window washer-wiper, and the pockets on the backs of the front seats. Its starting price will be $24,360, including the mandatory $885 destination charge. That's roughly $1,210 lower than the starting price for the Prius Two, the previous base model.

Notably, however, Toyota has not deleted any of the standard active-safety equipment from the new Prius One. Specifically, those are the standard (and awkwardly named) Toyota Safety Sense P (TSS-P) package of driver assistance technologies. They include a collision warning system with pedestrian detection, lane-keeping assist, adaptive cruise control, and automatic high beams. . . .
I doubt this will tempt many Prius shoppers to opt for this over the Prime, at least as long as the Fed. credit and/or state rebates are available.
 
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