RonSwanson
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Leafspy shows battery at 55 ahr is this too low for this one showing 12 bars?
Considering leaf - so many questions!
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alozzy
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What does Leaf Spy show for %SOH?
A brand new Leaf has 66 AHr, so 55 AHr isn't great (83% of new).
Given the AHr value, it will drop a capacity bar very soon and the SOH should be between 80 -90%. If it's showing over 90% then the BMS has likely been reset.
The one on CarMax has the advantage of coming from a cooler climate. You're likely going to have a hard time finding a really healthy battery in a Leaf that's lived out it's life in LA.
A brand new Leaf has 66 AHr, so 55 AHr isn't great (83% of new).
Given the AHr value, it will drop a capacity bar very soon and the SOH should be between 80 -90%. If it's showing over 90% then the BMS has likely been reset.
The one on CarMax has the advantage of coming from a cooler climate. You're likely going to have a hard time finding a really healthy battery in a Leaf that's lived out it's life in LA.
alozzy
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Post the Leaf Spy screenshot if you can - the one where SOH is shown at the top and a bar graph shows in the lower portion
RonSwanson
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This one lived it's life (3 year lease) in the Bay Area in a much cooler climate than where I'm at. Here's the leafspy. I had to take a pic since my tablet is ancient and it wasn't working great. Took many times to get these numbers.
http://imgur.com/wenTHq0
A couple other things. I couldn't do a 25% test drive. The traffic was horrible so we went a few miles only and that took forever. Also they didn't fully charge it either. It looked to be 3/4 the way full or a bit more (forgot to check
) and it was showing a 60 mile range.
It does indeed have a quick charger and newish tires. The cheapest they'd go is $6900 + tax title and all that or about $7800 out the door. I say I had to consult my team of experts.
http://imgur.com/wenTHq0
A couple other things. I couldn't do a 25% test drive. The traffic was horrible so we went a few miles only and that took forever. Also they didn't fully charge it either. It looked to be 3/4 the way full or a bit more (forgot to check
) and it was showing a 60 mile range.It does indeed have a quick charger and newish tires. The cheapest they'd go is $6900 + tax title and all that or about $7800 out the door. I say I had to consult my team of experts.
alozzy
Well-known member
Yeah, I'd pass on the car you provided the Leaf Spy screenshot of. You should be able to find one in better shape.
Note, for the 25% range test, any state of starting charge will do...
For instance, suppose the SOC is 67% when you start, then you would drive until the SOC is 42%. If the trip counter was 20 miles after doing that, then your expected full range would be 20 x 4 = 80 miles +/- 10%. That's in addition to checking the SOH and AHr using Leaf Spy, to see if the numbers make sense. I think a BMS reset is enough of a concern that you really need to do the driving test nowadays.
Note, for the 25% range test, any state of starting charge will do...
For instance, suppose the SOC is 67% when you start, then you would drive until the SOC is 42%. If the trip counter was 20 miles after doing that, then your expected full range would be 20 x 4 = 80 miles +/- 10%. That's in addition to checking the SOH and AHr using Leaf Spy, to see if the numbers make sense. I think a BMS reset is enough of a concern that you really need to do the driving test nowadays.
RonSwanson
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I'd have done the driving test if possible. It would have probably taken a couple hours.
pmc
Member
RonSwanson said:I'd prefer to find one in my area (LA Area). Not sure how fun a 400 mile drive would be in a car with 75 mile range.
I just did 200 miles after buying mine. It was a hoot. :roll:
Met some nice people though! Friendly folks charging their Tesla's at the Hy Vee, and two very nice folks let me charge at their L2 home chargers. Even cooked me dinner!
alozzy
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When I purchased my Leaf in Seattle, I took a one way trip on Amtrak from Vancouver to Seattle, then drove the Leaf home. Amtrak would be an option for the OP to do same.
He'd want to buy a Leaf with the QC package as otherwise the trip would take forever. I would QC every 50-60 miles, going to 80% charge each time if it were me. Probably 7-8 QC charges, 40 mins each, so 4 hours of charging and 6 hours driving. Doable in a day, but everything has to go right. He'd likely find a 2013 Leaf in SF bay area with an SOH in the 90% - 95% range.
He'd want to buy a Leaf with the QC package as otherwise the trip would take forever. I would QC every 50-60 miles, going to 80% charge each time if it were me. Probably 7-8 QC charges, 40 mins each, so 4 hours of charging and 6 hours driving. Doable in a day, but everything has to go right. He'd likely find a 2013 Leaf in SF bay area with an SOH in the 90% - 95% range.
RonSwanson
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Back to the drawing board. Sigh
alozzy
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You should be happy though, as you did your homework and so you didn't get stuck with a Leaf with a not so great battery.
There was recently a guy on the forums who, like the rest of us who purchased a used Leaf, relied on Leaf Spy when making a purchasing decision. He got burned, as over the last month or so the BMS relearned the real state of the battery pack - it appears that his car had the BMS reset.
Unfortunately, the assumption among forum members was that AHr, as reported by Leaf Spy, was a reliable stat - that now seems to be inaccurate. In other words, an unscrupulous dealer can reset the BMS, making a Leaf with a lousy battery look like it has 12 bars and a healthy Leaf Spy report (SOH, AHr).
That's why I encourage you to do the 25% range test (if possible) as a means of verifying what Leaf Spy reports vs what the actual approximate range is under normal driving conditions. It's well worth the time to drive 20 or so miles to get some confidence that a BMS reset hasn't been done to the car...
There was recently a guy on the forums who, like the rest of us who purchased a used Leaf, relied on Leaf Spy when making a purchasing decision. He got burned, as over the last month or so the BMS relearned the real state of the battery pack - it appears that his car had the BMS reset.
Unfortunately, the assumption among forum members was that AHr, as reported by Leaf Spy, was a reliable stat - that now seems to be inaccurate. In other words, an unscrupulous dealer can reset the BMS, making a Leaf with a lousy battery look like it has 12 bars and a healthy Leaf Spy report (SOH, AHr).
That's why I encourage you to do the 25% range test (if possible) as a means of verifying what Leaf Spy reports vs what the actual approximate range is under normal driving conditions. It's well worth the time to drive 20 or so miles to get some confidence that a BMS reset hasn't been done to the car...
alozzy
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25% test would take about 30 to 45 mins if you can average 30 to 50 mph.
Asking the seller to show you the paperwork for the new battery would be the easiest way. Otherwise, combo of Leaf Spy and 25% test as I described throughout this post...
Asking the seller to show you the paperwork for the new battery would be the easiest way. Otherwise, combo of Leaf Spy and 25% test as I described throughout this post...
alozzy
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I hate to see people get ripped off, so I'm happy to share the same knowledge others shared with me on these forums. Good luck!
RonSwanson
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Just to settle my curiosity, what kind of state and federal incentives are available when purchasing a new leaf? I understand it's 7500 federal (granted you have 7500 in taxes owed). Is this correct? Also what rebate does CA offer?
All incentives are to the original owner. A used Leaf does not qualify. You must have a tax of greater than 7500 to get the full discount. The excess can not be carried over. When you lease Nissan takes the 7500 and discounts the car.
In California with a lease or purchase you can get a $2500 rebate as long as the contract is 30 months or longer.
In California with a lease or purchase you can get a $2500 rebate as long as the contract is 30 months or longer.
RonSwanson
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I found another potential used Leaf. This one is being sold by an acquaintance so I know the entire history of the vehicle. He kept very good records (not many but still has them). And he babies his car. The car is a 2015 Leaf S with QC and about 13k miles and selling for $10,500. Online in my area I'm seeing pricing at, below, and above the offered price. I'll do leafspy today but it has 12 bars for sure. I'm adding a bit more "value" to this vehicle because I know the seller and history. What do you think?
^^^ some people may not like the S model due to the less efficient heater and smaller backup camera/display screen but I really like mine. Personally I'd only want one with the QC/Charger package but it sounds like it has that.
There is some reassurance purchasing from someone you know, but on the flip side I guess if you ran into any major issues a few months down the line, how would that be handled. I guess the only real major issues I could think of would be the A/C bracket/hose if it hasn't been replaced under warranty(if it even effects 15's??) and maybe heater??. I haven't had any heater issues but I've read it can be expensive and I'm not sure again what particular models/years it would effect, I don't think it's very common. '15 should be under the 3 year full warranty for 6+ months more so thats good and would help with any of the issues I mentioned above.
Not sure if CC was added in '15 for the base S but if it's important to you, you should check it out. I believe rear seat heat was standard up through the '15 S models, but again verify if important.
$10.5K seems on the high side but the mileage is very low and I've more been looking at '13s and 14s so 15s are bound to be more, especially with the full warranty.
Does they have a L2 EVSE they'd include? If so thats worth a bit, if you planned on getting one anyway, that or a EVSEupgrade'd EVSE.
There is some reassurance purchasing from someone you know, but on the flip side I guess if you ran into any major issues a few months down the line, how would that be handled. I guess the only real major issues I could think of would be the A/C bracket/hose if it hasn't been replaced under warranty(if it even effects 15's??) and maybe heater??. I haven't had any heater issues but I've read it can be expensive and I'm not sure again what particular models/years it would effect, I don't think it's very common. '15 should be under the 3 year full warranty for 6+ months more so thats good and would help with any of the issues I mentioned above.
Not sure if CC was added in '15 for the base S but if it's important to you, you should check it out. I believe rear seat heat was standard up through the '15 S models, but again verify if important.
$10.5K seems on the high side but the mileage is very low and I've more been looking at '13s and 14s so 15s are bound to be more, especially with the full warranty.
Does they have a L2 EVSE they'd include? If so thats worth a bit, if you planned on getting one anyway, that or a EVSEupgrade'd EVSE.
RonSwanson
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jjeff said:
Thanks for the info. Heat isn't too important to me. I rarely use the heater on my cars (Southern California). I hope I wouldn't have any AC issues as I do use this AC quite often in the summer. What is "CC" that you mentioned?
