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Tesla's S falls short in occupant safety among this group of large cars tested by the IIHS:

Tesla Fights Back Against Rating That Knocks Model S Safety

Tesla (TSLA) was fighting back Thursday against a report by an auto-insurance funded group saying its Model S sedan did not gain the top safety score after a series of crash tests.

The declaration deprived Tesla of IIHS's top safety honor. Instead, Tesla received only an "acceptable" rating in a test that presents the type of crash that occurs when the front driver-side corner of a vehicle hits a tree or utility pole or collides with another vehicle, known as the small overlap front test. It was one of five crash tests, with Tesla receiving a top rating in the other four....

Of six large cars the IIHS tested, three received the top safety rating. They were the Lincoln Continental made by Ford Motor (F), the Mercedes-Benz E-Class from Daimler (DDAIF)and the Avalon built by Toyota Motor (TM).

Of the three other cars tested, the Model S, Chevrolet Impala by General Motors (GM) and Ford Taurus "fell short of any award because they each earn only an acceptable rating in the small overlap front test," the IIHS said.
http://www.investors.com/news/technology/tesla-fights-back-against-rating-that-knocks-model-s-safety/?ven=DJCP&src=AURLABO

And another report shows much higher collision rate, claims frequency, and cost of claims, for the S than for other luxury cars:

Tesla Model S has higher insurance losses than other large luxury cars

When it comes to insurance losses, the Tesla Model S is an outlier. The luxury sedan has higher claim frequencies and is costlier to fix than gasoline-powered large luxury cars...

In comparison, the Model S had higher claim frequencies, higher claim severities and higher overall losses than other large luxury cars. Under collision coverage, for example, analysts estimated that the Model S's mileage-adjusted claim frequency was 37 percent higher than the comparison group, claim severity was 64 percent higher, and overall losses were 124 percent higher...

Under collision and property damage liability coverages, the seven electric vehicles with exact conventional counterparts had lower claim frequencies and higher claim severities than their comparison vehicles. When analysts controlled for mileage in the claim frequency analysis, the differences in the frequency benefits declined but were still significant. The Leaf largely followed the same pattern but had lower claim severities compared with the Versa.

In comparison, the Model S had higher claim frequencies, higher claim severities and higher overall losses than other large luxury cars. Under collision coverage, for example, analysts estimated that the Model S's mileage-adjusted claim frequency was 37 percent higher than the comparison group, claim severity was 64 percent higher, and overall losses were 124 percent higher...
http://www.iihs.org/iihs/sr/statusreport/article/52/4/4
 
What took them so long?

Given the modest increase in production cost, and the significant benefits in performance and efficiency, it just doesn't make sense to build 2wd BEVS, other than as low-priced entry-level models.

At ~$75k fully loaded more affordable model 3 will probably cost about the same as the new base model of the affordable S...

Tesla says it will discontinue the cheapest version of its Model S prior to the launch of the Model 3.

It’s still available to order now, for delivery in September, but it won’t be around for long.

We’ve received word that tesla will discontinue the cheapest version of the Model S, the rear wheel drive 75.

This move will put more distance (in terms of price) between the upcoming ~$35,000 Model 3 and the Model S.

The RWD 75 Model S starts at $69,500. Eliminating this version will push the base price of the Model S up to $74,500.

Additionally, by doing away with the RWD 75 Model S, neither the Model S nor the Model X will offer RWD versions. It’s dual-motor, AWD from here on out for the S and X.

Tesla has a history of discontinuing its cheapest models. Just a few months back, Tesla eliminated the Model S 60 kWh. In just for months or so, the cost for entry into a Model S jumped from ~$66,000 to nearly $75,000 once the RWD 75 disappears...
http://insideevs.com/tesla-will-discontinue-rwd-model-s-75-prior-launch-model-3/
 
Got my 2013 CPO Tesla model S five days ago. Takes a bit of learning to figure out how to do simple things (like vent the sunroof or close it), but overall not a problem. Love the car with one huge exception: the seats are (for me) the worst I have ever encountered either driving or riding in any car. They rate a 1 or 2 on a scale of 10 (which is the rating I give for 2011 Leaf, third generation Prius and 2002 Camry V6). The seats are very hard, have little give, and no matter how I adjust them (including lumbar support) they hurt my back and my butt within 20 minutes. I didn't notice a problem on the test drive of a new Tesla, either because the seats were better or because the drive was short and the excitement level high.

I have little padding on my frame, which could be part of the problem. I looked for solutions and saw several possibilities including Wet Okole seats, iRelax the Back seat cushion for Tesla, replacement seats at $6,000 which might or might not improve the problem, a seat and butt cushion for Tesla at Relax the Back store for $290. I got moderate relief so far by taking a pillow from my bed and putting it on the seat back. Saw (after purchase) that other people have complained about this. Anyone here have similar problems and a solution? Why do all the cheap cars I have ridden in have comfortable seats and a premium car like Tesla can't come close to matching them???

Thanks.
 
Stoaty said:
Got my 2013 CPO Tesla model S five days ago. Takes a bit of learning to figure out how to do simple things (like vent the sunroof or close it), but overall not a problem. Love the car with one huge exception: the seats are (for me) the worst I have ever encountered either driving or riding in any car.
Congratulations on your Model S!

I'm so sorry to learn that the seats aren't working for you! (You have the leather seats, right?) They've been great for everyone in our family, better than any other car we've had, and we're all relatively lean. But I understand that what may be a perfect fit for some people, ergonomically and otherwise, can sometimes be a nightmare for others. While I don't have any suggestions, I truly hope you'll be able to find a good solution that's not terribly expensive.
 
abasile said:
I'm so sorry to learn that the seats aren't working for you! (You have the leather seats, right?)
Yes, I have the leather seats. My (twin) brother agrees with me about how bad the seats are--must be genetic. :eek: :shock:
 
Stoaty said:
abasile said:
I'm so sorry to learn that the seats aren't working for you! (You have the leather seats, right?)
Yes, I have the leather seats. My (twin) brother agrees with me about how bad the seats are--must be genetic. :eek: :shock:
Hmmm, neither me, nor my wife have had any issues with the seats in either our Model S or Model X.
Did you get the 'next gen' seats? These were offered for a year or so. They were meant to be designed for the performance models. I didn't like them as they seemed too hard to me. I believe they don't offer them anymore and I would think they would have been noticed on your test drive.
 
Stoaty said:
lorenfb said:
Stoaty said:
Love the car
That's great! Enjoy.
Thanks, but you edited out the most important part: that I am not sure I can keep the car due to the awful (for me) seats.

The early cars had two seat options. (the very first had only one, then they added the option). It seems that people either loved the first ones or the second and you either liked one or the other. They finally got a good seat that everyone liked later on. But I think your car is in the time when there were two options. If you hate the ones you have, perhaps you would like the other option. Ask the service center if they have a set of the opposite seats to swap. I remember reading about several folks who swapped seats in those days, and there is a chance the service center has a set to swap out for you.
 
Stoaty said:
lorenfb said:
Stoaty said:
Love the car
That's great! Enjoy.
Thanks, but you edited out the most important part: that I am not sure I can keep the car due to the awful (for me) seats.

I have to think there is an option out there that will fix the issue. There are dozens of cushions, supports, beads, vibrators, etc that people use. I would consult your local bus driver. Trust me, they will have answers (might not work for you) galore.
 
palmermd said:
The early cars had two seat options. (the very first had only one, then they added the option). It seems that people either loved the first ones or the second and you either liked one or the other. They finally got a good seat that everyone liked later on. But I think your car is in the time when there were two options. If you hate the ones you have, perhaps you would like the other option. Ask the service center if they have a set of the opposite seats to swap. I remember reading about several folks who swapped seats in those days, and there is a chance the service center has a set to swap out for you.
I will look into this, thanks. So far have had significant improvement by using a pillow from my bed to cushion my back. Not a full solution, but better. Will also be useful if I decide to take a nap in the car or sleep overnight. ;)
 
Does anyone have a good guess on when the used 2013 base model S will drop below $30k used? With the Model 3 at 35k brand new and all the hype, I'm hoping to get a lower base model S in the next year or two. Probably an S 60 or something. Family and wife gives green light as soon as we find a $29,000 Tesla with a clean title...
 
eyedrop said:
Does anyone have a good guess on when the used 2013 base model S will drop below $30k used? With the Model 3 at 35k brand new and all the hype, I'm hoping to get a lower base model S in the next year or two. Family and wife gives green light as soon as we find a $29,000 Tesla with a clean title...
I'd expect the advent of the Model 3 would considerably hasten the drop in used S prices.
 
GRA said:
eyedrop said:
Does anyone have a good guess on when the used 2013 base model S will drop below $30k used? With the Model 3 at 35k brand new and all the hype, I'm hoping to get a lower base model S in the next year or two. Family and wife gives green light as soon as we find a $29,000 Tesla with a clean title...
I'd expect the advent of the Model 3 would considerably hasten the drop in used S prices.
That's my expectation as well. I think we might see a $30k S60 as soon as a year from now.
 
dgpcolorado said:
GRA said:
I'd expect the advent of the Model 3 would considerably hasten the drop in used S prices.
That's my expectation as well. I think we might see a $30k S60 as soon as a year from now.
I mostly agree with this. However, keep in mind that the US income tax credit, currently $7500, is expected to phase out for Tesla vehicles during 2018. While there's a chance that Tesla may choose to lower their prices to partly compensate for the loss of the tax credit, one might also argue that the Model 3 offers compelling value even without the tax credit and that demand will not be an issue. In any case, with less of an incentive to purchase new Teslas, I expect that the relative value of used Teslas will go up, thus slowing the drop in Model S prices.
 
dgpcolorado said:
GRA said:
eyedrop said:
Does anyone have a good guess on when the used 2013 base model S will drop below $30k used? With the Model 3 at 35k brand new and all the hype, I'm hoping to get a lower base model S in the next year or two. Family and wife gives green light as soon as we find a $29,000 Tesla with a clean title...
I'd expect the advent of the Model 3 would considerably hasten the drop in used S prices.
That's my expectation as well. I think we might see a $30k S60 as soon as a year from now.
No need to wait, If you can find one of the few base S's sold.

KBB, 2012 S60 base, 80k miles, private party sale.

Price ranges from fair condition ~$29.6k, to excellent condition ~$35.5k.

https://www.kbb.com/tesla/model-s/2012/performance-sedan-4d/?vehicleid=412347&intent=trade-in-sell&options=6811385%7ctrue&category=luxury&mileage=80000&pricetype=private-party&condition=fair

Find one with >100k miles, and prices come down to the $25k-$30k range.
 
abasile said:
While there's a chance that Tesla may choose to lower their prices to partly compensate for the loss of the tax credit, one might also argue that the Model 3 offers compelling value even without the tax credit and that demand will not be an issue. In any case, with less of an incentive to purchase new Teslas, I expect that the relative value of used Teslas will go up, thus slowing the drop in Model S prices.

Right, and the inference is that the Model 3 (basically same features) will cannibalize Model S sales resulting
in increased losses without a very significant increase, i.e. an order of magnitude, in Tesla's sales volume.
 
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