Lancpudn
Well-known member
Greenpeace have just boarded a ship in the Thames estuary carrying thousands of VW diesel cars bound for the UK. https://www.rt.com/uk/404058-greenpeace-board-ship-volkswagen/
Greenpeace
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RegGuheert
Well-known member
Ironic, isn't it? Greenpeace uses 200-HP outboard motors on their boats to board the ship in order to protest the use of fossil fuels. I wonder if their boats were launched from one of Greenpeace's ships powered by 3000-HP diesel-powered motors.
Greenpeace is somewhat culpable in the proliferation of diesel since they promoted diesel cars back in the 1990s and 2000s.
Greenpeace is somewhat culpable in the proliferation of diesel since they promoted diesel cars back in the 1990s and 2000s.
Yes, they were fools to believe VW and Mercedes. Obviously we shouldn't believe anything they say, and should shun them.
LeftieBiker said:
Europeans were led to believe by their governments, and many such people still believe despite dieselgate, that diesel is still a better fuel than gasoline due to the lower C02 emissions of such engines. Europe's emission laws, and vehicle taxation schemes, use CO2 emissions, and not NOx or even fuel economy, as their basis. That's different from North America where NOx (which causes the lung irritation and visual pollution we closely associate with smoggy days) is more the primary factor for emission regulation, and CAFE rules are MPG-based.
Where diesels are inferior to gasoline engines without massive amounts of technology are emissions of NOx and particulates (aka "diesel smoke"). VW couldn't meet EPA/CARB rules on NOx without severe sacrifices in performance, and this is where they resorted to cheating.
https://longtailpipe.com/2015/10/02/differences-in-us-and-eu-emissions-standard-key-cause-of-dieselgate/
Show of hands: how many people realized I was being sarcastic?
LeftieBiker said:
The point of my post was that it wasn't necessarily the fault of Greenpeace for spreading the very same misinformation that European governments were giving to their own people, and reinforcing it via legislation that promoted diesel over gasoline. LOTS of people believed it then, and in the aftermath of dieslegate some still do.
RegGuheert
Well-known member
Except for the inconvenient fact that CO2 emissions are HIGHER for diesel engines:RonDawg said:
Note that there is a bit of slight-of-hand in the above image since they use 182,000 km for the diesel vehicle and 175,000 km for the gasoline vehicle. But the well-to-wheels emissions are still lower for the gasoline car if you use 182,000 km. What is perhaps missing is that the diesel car MAY last longer than the gasoline car.
Truly, the Europeans have been sold a bill of goods from top to bottom. Frankly, I've been puzzled by their love affair with diesel ever since my first visit to Rome in the 1980s and I saw the damage that diesel was doing to the antique marble monuments and building there.
