GlennD
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Posts: 1339
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:14 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Jul 2013
Leaf Number: 410357
Location: Anaheim

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:21 pm

Without changing the L1 table it follows the J1772 spec and it max's out at 16A. That said you can edit the max and the table for more. I tested my eGolf at its 30A max at 120V. Given its defaults it adheres to the J1772 spec but since it is open you can edit the tables.

In my short test I simply forced the L2 table. L1 or L2 is purely cosmetic and it only affects the display. The actual pilot could care less about the voltage.

L2 240V is in all cases faster. Assuming a leaf max's at 27.5A 240 at 27.5A is much faster than the same current at 120V. I know from testing my Leaf that it only wants current. It does read the pilot so 12A EVSE's work fine.

High current at 120V only makes sense it 120V is all that is available. In that case use what you have.
2012 Cayenne Red SL traded for:
2013 Pearl White SL Premium
Traded for a Cirrus White 2014 Mercedes B (totaled)
2016 Urano Gray eGolf SEL w/ drive assist
Loved the VW but it sat too low for my old body
Back to a Cirrus White 2017 B250e

erco
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2017 11:32 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Tue Jan 16, 2018 11:22 am

Are you sure you want to? 99% of 120V outlets are connected to 15A circuit breakers through wiring rated for 15A. 12A is a very reasonable maximum for that common situation. 15A rating is a maximum, not a suggested goal. An EVSE pulling 16A will trip circuit breakers and/or possibly overheat old wiring and outlets. Is that wise or desirable? Seems like leaving it at 12A is the smarter and more versatile play, if recharging "anywhere" is the goal. There's a reason why the upgrader makes you sign a release form for the 120V/16A mod.
Ocean Blue 2014 S, 3.6kW OBC, no QC, purchased 10/21/17, 12 bars, Los Angeles
Car first sold in Buford Georgia
Dropped 1st bar 11/30/17
AmazingE 3.8 kW EVSE

jjeff
Posts: 1690
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 9:10 am
Delivery Date: 13 Jul 2014
Leaf Number: 422121
Location: MSP MN

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:21 pm

erco wrote:Are you sure you want to? 99% of 120V outlets are connected to 15A circuit breakers through wiring rated for 15A. 12A is a very reasonable maximum for that common situation. 15A rating is a maximum, not a suggested goal. An EVSE pulling 16A will trip circuit breakers and/or possibly overheat old wiring and outlets. Is that wise or desirable? Seems like leaving it at 12A is the smarter and more versatile play, if recharging "anywhere" is the goal. There's a reason why the upgrader makes you sign a release form for the 120V/16A mod.

While that may be true in very old homes, most modern homes use 20a breakers and wiring. Also basically all commercial outlets are on 20a circuits. Oh and I believe your 99% is off, AFAIK all homes have been required to have 20a outlets in the kitchen area for many years, I know my home(vintage '74 with at one time AU wire :o ) had many 15a circuits but did have 2 20a circuits in the kitchen :)
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
2013 S w/QC purchased new
Juicebox Premium 60a L1/L2 EVSE, Ebusbar 16a L1/L2 EVSE
'12 EVSEupgrade'd 20a L1/L2 EVSE, '13 EVSEupgrade'd adjustable 6-20a L2, 6-13a L1 EVSE
Zencar 13, 20, 30a L1/L2 portable EVSE
GE Durastation 30a

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EVDRIVER
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Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:51 am

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:06 pm

jjeff wrote:
erco wrote:Are you sure you want to? 99% of 120V outlets are connected to 15A circuit breakers through wiring rated for 15A. 12A is a very reasonable maximum for that common situation. 15A rating is a maximum, not a suggested goal. An EVSE pulling 16A will trip circuit breakers and/or possibly overheat old wiring and outlets. Is that wise or desirable? Seems like leaving it at 12A is the smarter and more versatile play, if recharging "anywhere" is the goal. There's a reason why the upgrader makes you sign a release form for the 120V/16A mod.

While that may be true in very old homes, most modern homes use 20a breakers and wiring. Also basically all commercial outlets are on 20a circuits. Oh and I believe your 99% is off, AFAIK all homes have been required to have 20a outlets in the kitchen area for many years, I know my home(vintage '74 with at one time AU wire :o ) had many 15a circuits but did have 2 20a circuits in the kitchen :)


You may be surprised. Most commercial outlets are on 20A breakers but can often be shared and are generally worn out and in poor shape for EV charging. There are also many times 20A outlets that are used on 15a circuits, shared and unshared. Many modern homes also have cheap outlets that are not good for EV charging. I can't tell you how many 20A circuits I see in commercial applications that are unfit for EV charging. Not to mention the many circuits with loose wiring, bad grounds and hidden outlets on the same circuit that are shared. Assuming any 20A outlet is suitable is really a bad call in general unless it's one you had installed professionally at home. Even 12A charging is suspect on many unknown outlets, in the last 15 years I have encountered far more suspect and bad outlets than good ones. Public and commercial outlets are usually high duty and rarely checked.
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jjeff
Posts: 1690
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 9:10 am
Delivery Date: 13 Jul 2014
Leaf Number: 422121
Location: MSP MN

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:25 pm

EVDRIVER wrote:
jjeff wrote:
erco wrote:Are you sure you want to? 99% of 120V outlets are connected to 15A circuit breakers through wiring rated for 15A. 12A is a very reasonable maximum for that common situation. 15A rating is a maximum, not a suggested goal. An EVSE pulling 16A will trip circuit breakers and/or possibly overheat old wiring and outlets. Is that wise or desirable? Seems like leaving it at 12A is the smarter and more versatile play, if recharging "anywhere" is the goal. There's a reason why the upgrader makes you sign a release form for the 120V/16A mod.

While that may be true in very old homes, most modern homes use 20a breakers and wiring. Also basically all commercial outlets are on 20a circuits. Oh and I believe your 99% is off, AFAIK all homes have been required to have 20a outlets in the kitchen area for many years, I know my home(vintage '74 with at one time AU wire :o ) had many 15a circuits but did have 2 20a circuits in the kitchen :)


You may be surprised. Most commercial outlets are on 20A breakers but can often be shared and are generally worn out and in poor shape for EV charging. There are also many times 20A outlets that are used on 15a circuits, shared and unshared. Many modern homes also have cheap outlets that are not good for EV charging. I can't tell you how many 20A circuits I see in commercial applications that are unfit for EV charging. Not to mention the many circuits with loose wiring, bad grounds and hidden outlets on the same circuit that are shared. Assuming any 20A outlet is suitable is really a bad call in general unless it's one you had installed professionally at home. Even 12A charging is suspect on many unknown outlets, in the last 15 years I have encountered far more suspect and bad outlets than good ones. Public and commercial outlets are usually high duty and rarely checked.

That we agree :)
I also wouldn't really charge at more than 12a unless I knew the outlet and circuit was rated for more or I had used it in the past without issues. Even at 12a for an outlet I'd never used I'd probably unplug it(of course first the j1772 cable) after 5 or so minutes of charging and feel the prongs for any source of heat. If everything was cool I'd continue charging, if not I'd either dial it down on my EVSE or look for another outlet. Of course there could be heat other places like any splices upstream or even the breaker but I'd probably not have access to check those areas.
I regularly charge at 18a @ 120v at work for several hours at a time, the only thing that gets warm is the breaker itself but not hot and it's never tripped. The outlet is a quality(hospital grade) 20a outlet and all wiring is 12 gauge, oh and it's a dedicated outlet, that I do know.
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
2013 S w/QC purchased new
Juicebox Premium 60a L1/L2 EVSE, Ebusbar 16a L1/L2 EVSE
'12 EVSEupgrade'd 20a L1/L2 EVSE, '13 EVSEupgrade'd adjustable 6-20a L2, 6-13a L1 EVSE
Zencar 13, 20, 30a L1/L2 portable EVSE
GE Durastation 30a

GlennD
Forum Supporter
Posts: 1339
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:14 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Jul 2013
Leaf Number: 410357
Location: Anaheim

Re: Can you upgrade my upgraded EVSE?

Tue Jan 16, 2018 6:03 pm

If you have control of the commercial building you can inexpensively change out a worn outlet. It gets messy if the building is rented. In that case all you can do is request a repair that might not happen.

The building the city leased had a landlord but the city was responsible for complete maintenance. That allowed me to install my own L2 EVSE.
2012 Cayenne Red SL traded for:
2013 Pearl White SL Premium
Traded for a Cirrus White 2014 Mercedes B (totaled)
2016 Urano Gray eGolf SEL w/ drive assist
Loved the VW but it sat too low for my old body
Back to a Cirrus White 2017 B250e

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