Committed LEAF 2018 Buyer: Raise Your Hand

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DaveinOlyWA said:
kennethbokor said:
I'll throw my hat into the ring. Going to order SL Jade Frost at the end of this week. Was told normal delivery should be April or May latest. However, with Nissan Corp Fiscal Year end March 31st, they may accelerate orders to ship as much as possible. Since Jade Frost is not a common colour, that would take longer then the Pearl White, Black or others.

I'll update once our order is in and we get some feedback, but excited to finally be entering the EV realm!

Jade Frost was my choice and it was always listed as a delayed option but looks like we will start seeing our first in Mid March. I simply can't wait that long though.... I am LEAFless and its kinda killing me... :(


Good to see your colour choice too. I'd love to see a real pic of that colour as I've only seen renderings.
 
LeftieBiker said:
My hand is now officially DOWN. I'll take a perfect 2017 SV with Premium, in a color I like, over a 2018.

Are you sure you want to deal with the garbage battery in the 2017 SV?

I've already lost 21% of the original capacity (2016 SV) in two years time here in frozen Minnesota!
 
No, I'm not sure, and a good starting SOH is mandatory. That alone may make it impossible. I'd also be interested in a good low mileage 2015 SV or SL (I'd swap seats with mine) with excellent SOH and Premium.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
kennethbokor said:
I'll throw my hat into the ring. Going to order SL Jade Frost at the end of this week. Was told normal delivery should be April or May latest. However, with Nissan Corp Fiscal Year end March 31st, they may accelerate orders to ship as much as possible. Since Jade Frost is not a common colour, that would take longer then the Pearl White, Black or others.

I'll update once our order is in and we get some feedback, but excited to finally be entering the EV realm!

Jade Frost was my choice and it was always listed as a delayed option but looks like we will start seeing our first in Mid March. I simply can't wait that long though.... I am LEAFless and its kinda killing me... :(


Great! I'd love to see actual pics of this colour. Mainly seen renderings and a still video from the Japanese Tokyo Auto Show launch last year. The video is not that good of the lighting, but it looks like an amazing colour. Let us know!
 
I signed the paperwork for a 2018 scarlet Red SL with Black leatherette interior. Tech package, protection package, and some mud flaps and kick plates. Order says it should arrive at the dealer sometime in March.

This was in DFW area, and total cost will be ~$41k.
 
wesofwaco said:
I signed the paperwork for a 2018 scarlet Red SL with Black leatherette interior. Tech package, protection package, and some mud flaps and kick plates. Order says it should arrive at the dealer sometime in March.

This was in DFW area, and total cost will be ~$41k.

I wish it were leatherette. It's more or less actual leather.

There is a Nissan dealership in Wisconsin, IIRC, that is offering a free lifetime limited powertrain warranty with all new Nissans. I'm looking into it.
 
I was all in.

Until we went to lease one. Leaf 2 is a dud, folks. Sorry to pour rain on this parade, but having been through Leaf 1, Spark, Kia Soul EV and Bolt, accounting for all that each of these vehicles' pluses and minuses entail, and having driven a cumulative total of about 210k e-miles, Leaf 2 is not doable.

Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.

Second, the height difference between your left and right elbow rests is about 8 inches. It's like the middle of the car designers did not talk to the door designers. It makes you feel contorted. It's the craziest thing I've ever seen in a car. The left is too low and the right is too high, neither normal. You feel unbalanced.

Here is the rest: I am a cruise control freak. Not everyone is, but I live by it. The CC buttons feel like prototypes, they are small, oddly shaped with sharp edges, and feel chintzy. Worse yet, they are poorly angled so that reaching the top "resume" button is unnatural. To make things worse, the "cancel" button, resting between the "set" and "resume," is so tall and convex-shaped, it is in the way of reaching "resume" without tripping on it. Nissan apparently does not think it is necessary to run their designs by ergonomics experts. That would pertain to all counts of this vehicle's interior. I've been telling car manufacturers that the most natural position for the CC buttons is at 3:30-4 o'clock recessed below steering wheel plain. None is listening.

The display with the analog speed dial looks like they're not finished with it, it's just temporary, and we'll get it done maybe next year. I could hardly tell -- or see -- what speed I was traveling. It was unbelievable. Granted, I did not play with possible other configs, it there are any, or illumination. It looks real bad, period. Very bad. The Leaf 1 was much refined as compared to this bungled, perhaps thought as "retro" display,

Rear seats fit 5"4' person. At 5"11' you're hitting the ceiling, like Model S. Rear, in fact the entire car feels cramped, definitely more cramped than Leaf 1. I cannot envision the 5th person in the rear, other than a small child.

The steering is mushy, mushier than Leaf 1. Certainly no comparison the just about anything on the market today. It felt like a 50's Detroit car. Adding to the list the 150 mile range, I realized that Bolt in comparison is MUCH MORE REFINED vehicle, with 80 extra more miles, super-responsive steering, cool display, but overtightened suspension (for my taste).

We needed a car, our Soul lease was up, extended, just waiting for that Leaf 2 like salvation... What a disaster! So we ended up leasing another Bolt. There was nothing else we could do. Now we have a white and arctic blue Bolts so we can tell them apart. Two Chevys. Never in my life, folks... I must report that GM's Mary Barra listened and fixed the Bolt front seats, as I expected she would. No more Bolt seat issues, folks!

Check Leaf 2 out and judge for yourselves.
 
So the second Bolt is a 2018? I had concerns about the Leaf Too steering wheel buttons just looking at pictures of them. I hope I like them better than you did. As for the steering, I'd suspect under-inflated tires, since it hsn't been mentioned before.
 
ILETRIC said:
I was all in.

Until we went to lease one. Leaf 2 is a dud, folks. Sorry to pour rain on this parade, but having been through Leaf 1, Spark, Kia Soul EV and Bolt, accounting for all that each of these vehicles' pluses and minuses entail, and having driven a cumulative total of about 210k e-miles, Leaf 2 is not doable.

Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.
For my test drive, I sat in the car for almost an hour and test drove for much of it. I had no issue with it but yours isn't the first time I heard the complaint about the intrusion on the '18 Leaf. Granted, it wasn't a common complaint but you aren't alone.

I had sat in the car a bunch at other '18 Leaf EVents, so my time in the driver's seat is probably about a bit over an hour.
ILETRIC said:
Second, the height difference between your left and right elbow rests is about 8 inches. It's like the middle of the car designers did not talk to the door designers. It makes you feel contorted. It's the craziest thing I've ever seen in a car. The left is too low and the right is too high, neither normal. You feel unbalanced.
I had no issue with this but I've had and rented many cars where it was "unbalanced".

ILETRIC said:
Here is the rest: I am a cruise control freak. Not everyone is, but I live by it. The CC buttons feel like prototypes, they are small, oddly shaped with sharp edges, and feel chintzy. Worse yet, they are poorly angled so that reaching the top "resume" button is unnatural. To make things worse, the "cancel" button, resting between the "set" and "resume," is so tall and convex-shaped, it is in the way of reaching "resume" without tripping on it. Nissan apparently does not think it is necessary to run their designs by ergonomics experts.
I had no issue with this even those I used ProPilot Assist. FWIW, it looks like Nissan has been adopted this steering wheel and CC design. 2017 Rogue's steering wheel and CC seems very much like '18 Leaf: http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/presskits/us-2017-nissan-rogue-press-kit/photos/2017-nissan-rogue-sl-21. Rogue US sales for 2017 have done pretty well: http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/releases/nissan-group-reports-december-and-2017-calendar-year-u-s-sales, up 22.3%. Nissan sold 403K Rogue in the US last year vs. 11K Leafs.

If this CC design is a big minus/issue, it sure doesn't seem reflected in Rogue sales.

Nissan has been all over the place in terms of CC button control design depending on the year range. It's quite different from my former 02 Maxima to my former 04 350Z to my mom's 07 Altima Hybrid. At least Leaf's isn't that far off from Altima.
ILETRIC said:
I've been telling car manufacturers that the most natural position for the CC buttons is at 4:30-5 o'clock recessed below steering wheel plain. None is listening.
Thru what means have you been telling them? CC design doesn't seem to be a very often discussed topic nor complaint on ANY car forum I've been on.. So, even if you went thru the proper channels, it's likely to not be a top complaint or one of the top sources of owner suggestions for improvement.

Arguably, I like Toyota's CC design best that's been common from around model year 1992 until now. It was found on '92 to '96 Camry (but NOT previous that ended w/model year 1991) and probably for a few generations more (+ on numerous others Toyotas and Lexuses). Gen 2 Prius (04 to 09 model year) thru Gen 4 (2016 to current) still seem to use it but for some cars (e.g. '18 Camry), they've shifted away from it.

Your Bolt and Spark EV has the CC buttons on the left side of the steering wheel. Seems common on GM cars, probably for historical reasons. GM cars in the past had the CC buttons, switches, etc. crammed onto the turn signal stalk.
ILETRIC said:
The display with the analog speed dial looks like they're not finished with it, it's just temporary, and we'll get it done maybe next year. I could hardly tell -- or see -- what speed I was traveling. It was unbelievable.
It is weird that they went analog but I already posted Nissan's claimed reason for going that way in another thread.

I also wasn't used to it since both my Leaf and Prius have digital speedos right in front of the driver and I currently have no cars w/dials. But, the cars you listed ALSO have digital speedos, so this is probably why you weren't used to it either.

You can switch the left display to show a digital speedo. However, I don't think you can have that up while using ProPilot Assist.
ILETRIC said:
Granted, I did not play with possible other configs, it there are any, or illumination. It looks real bad, period. Very bad. The Leaf 1 was much refined as compared to this bungled, perhaps thought as "retro" display,
I didn't find the rest of the display on the left LCD "unfinished". Seemed totally finished to me. It has a bit of a learning curve since it's nothing like Leaf's b&w display and nothing like previous Nissans I've had.

I could see some non-tech savvy people being confused by it as I'm shocked and annoyed at how little some people know/are willing to learn about how the simple small b&w display in '11 to '17 Leaf now and other Nissans w/similar systems. (e.g. they don't even know how to advance thru screens, that some can be reset along w/how)

What's in '18 Leaf left LCD and the UI is probably an order of magnitude more complex.
ILETRIC said:
Check Leaf 2 out and judge for yourselves.
I have.

I'll have to sit in an '18 vs. '17 Bolt to compare the front seats sometime. I unfortunately have insufficient seat time in either to really compare but I had no issue with either seat during my short test drives.
 
cwerdna said:
ILETRIC said:
I was all in.

Until we went to lease one. Leaf 2 is a dud, folks. Sorry to pour rain on this parade, but having been through Leaf 1, Spark, Kia Soul EV and Bolt, accounting for all that each of these vehicles' pluses and minuses entail, and having driven a cumulative total of about 210k e-miles, Leaf 2 is not doable.

Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.
For my test drive, I sat in the car for almost an hour and test drove for much of it. I had no issue with it but yours isn't the first time I heard the complaint about the intrusion on the '18 Leaf. Granted, it wasn't a common complaint but you aren't alone.

I had sat in the car a bunch at other '18 Leaf EVents, so my time in the driver's seat is probably about a bit over an hour.
ILETRIC said:
Second, the height difference between your left and right elbow rests is about 8 inches. It's like the middle of the car designers did not talk to the door designers. It makes you feel contorted. It's the craziest thing I've ever seen in a car. The left is too low and the right is too high, neither normal. You feel unbalanced.
I had no issue with this but I've had and rented many cars where it was "unbalanced".

ILETRIC said:
Here is the rest: I am a cruise control freak. Not everyone is, but I live by it. The CC buttons feel like prototypes, they are small, oddly shaped with sharp edges, and feel chintzy. Worse yet, they are poorly angled so that reaching the top "resume" button is unnatural. To make things worse, the "cancel" button, resting between the "set" and "resume," is so tall and convex-shaped, it is in the way of reaching "resume" without tripping on it. Nissan apparently does not think it is necessary to run their designs by ergonomics experts.
I had no issue with this even those I used ProPilot Assist. FWIW, it looks like Nissan has been adopted this steering wheel and CC design. 2017 Rogue's steering wheel and CC seems very much like '18 Leaf: http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/presskits/us-2017-nissan-rogue-press-kit/photos/2017-nissan-rogue-sl-21. Rogue US sales for 2017 have done pretty well: http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/releases/nissan-group-reports-december-and-2017-calendar-year-u-s-sales, up 22.3%. Nissan sold 403K Rogue in the US last year vs. 11K Leafs.

If this CC design is a big minus/issue, it sure doesn't seem reflected in Rogue sales.

Nissan has been all over the place in terms of CC button control design depending on the year range. It's quite different from my former 02 Maxima to my former 04 350Z to my mom's 07 Altima Hybrid. At least Leaf's isn't that far off from Altima.
ILETRIC said:
I've been telling car manufacturers that the most natural position for the CC buttons is at 4:30-5 o'clock recessed below steering wheel plain. None is listening.
Thru what means have you been telling them? CC design doesn't seem to be a very often discussed topic nor complaint on ANY car forum I've been on.. So, even if you went thru the proper channels, it's likely to not be a top complaint or one of the top sources of owner suggestions for improvement.

Arguably, I like Toyota's CC design best that's been common from around model year 1992 until now. It was found on '92 to '96 Camry (but NOT previous that ended w/model year 1991) and probably for a few generations more (+ on numerous others Toyotas and Lexuses). Gen 2 Prius (04 to 09 model year) thru Gen 4 (2016 to current) still seem to use it but for some cars (e.g. '18 Camry), they've shifted away from it.

Your Bolt and Spark EV has the CC buttons on the left side of the steering wheel. Seems common on GM cars, probably for historical reasons. GM cars in the past had the CC buttons, switches, etc. crammed onto the turn signal stalk.
ILETRIC said:
The display with the analog speed dial looks like they're not finished with it, it's just temporary, and we'll get it done maybe next year. I could hardly tell -- or see -- what speed I was traveling. It was unbelievable.
It is weird that they went analog but I already posted Nissan's claimed reason for going that way in another thread.

I also wasn't used to it since both my Leaf and Prius have digital speedos right in front of the driver and I currently have no cars w/dials. But, the cars you listed ALSO have digital speedos, so this is probably why you weren't used to it either.

You can switch the left display to show a digital speedo. However, I don't think you can have that up while using ProPilot Assist.
ILETRIC said:
Granted, I did not play with possible other configs, it there are any, or illumination. It looks real bad, period. Very bad. The Leaf 1 was much refined as compared to this bungled, perhaps thought as "retro" display,
I didn't find the rest of the display on the left LCD "unfinished". Seemed totally finished to me. It has a bit of a learning curve since it's nothing like Leaf's b&w display and nothing like previous Nissans I've had.

I could see some non-tech savvy people being confused by it as I'm shocked and annoyed at how little some people know/are willing to learn about how the simple small b&w display in '11 to '17 Leaf now and other Nissans w/similar systems. (e.g. they don't even know how to advance thru screens, that some can be reset along w/how)

What's in '18 Leaf left LCD and the UI is probably an order of magnitude more complex.
ILETRIC said:
Check Leaf 2 out and judge for yourselves.
I have.

I'll have to sit in an '18 vs. '17 Bolt to compare the front seats sometime. I unfortunately have insufficient seat time in either to really compare but I had no issue with either seat during my short test drives.

He already got a Bolt so his comments are only there to justify his decision. I can see the center bridge being an issue to some but I am nowhere near that tall for it to be an issue with me.

As far as CC? Its like dozens of other cars I have used. Its all about taking 5 mins to get used to it and then its a nothing thing.
 
The center console is an issue for me. I was concerned about it from the pictures. One of the major decisions points on my 2013 Leaf was being able to drive it without my right knee banging against the console.
 
baustin said:
The center console is an issue for me. I was concerned about it from the pictures. One of the major decisions points on my 2013 Leaf was being able to drive it without my right knee banging against the console.

I can see it being an issue for taller people. I am simply nowhere near tall enough. I don't even notice it. But I do know one person who is so tall that even the seat all the way back does not give him enough leg room. He is driving a LEAF now.
 
I drove a 2018 SV with Tech Package today, and the center console and uneven armrest heights weren't an issue for me. What was an issue was the smell. My 2013 smelled strongly of rubber for over a year, but I preferred that to my housemate's PIP, which smelled strongly of uncured automotive paint (and still does). The Leaf I drove today smelled of both. It was nauseating. I also found the steering wheel button layout horrible for doing anything beyond activating and setting the Cruise Control. The power was what I'd call "nicely adequate," especially above 40mph. The e-Pedal was nice, too. The Pro Pilot wouldn't fully activate. The handling was a bit more crisp than my car, not mushy. The suspension wasn't very compliant going over road seams, but it was better than the Bolt.

I'm still looking for a car that meets all of my needs. The Leaf SV could easily have been it, but since I now rely on the Around View in parking lots and even parking at home, and the SV no longer has AV, it isn't. I may start looking for a perfect 2015 SV with Premium and QC, as the local Leaf-certified dealership won't even order a Leaf at all, much less to my specs. So much for Nissan's hyped "reservation" crap. My hand stays down.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
baustin said:
The center console is an issue for me. I was concerned about it from the pictures. One of the major decisions points on my 2013 Leaf was being able to drive it without my right knee banging against the console.

I can see it being an issue for taller people. I am simply nowhere near tall enough. I don't even notice it. But I do know one person who is so tall that even the seat all the way back does not give him enough leg room. He is driving a LEAF now.

They were making seat brackets for previous Leafs, that more than likely will work on this year also, to extend the seat even farther.
 
ILETRIC said:
Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.

It is absurd to have that rigid and non-functional buttress intrude into the cabin legroom space the way it does. Because of some arbitrary "design language"? Gah.
 
Nubo said:
ILETRIC said:
Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.

It is absurd to have that rigid and non-functional buttress intrude into the cabin legroom space the way it does. Because of some arbitrary "design language"? Gah.

There is no "non functionality" here. Its literally jam packed with buttons, switches, cupholders and cubby holes. The ideology is rather transparent.
 
ILETRIC said:
Here is the worst part: you cant's sit and drive in the driver's seat. There is NO PLACE to put your right knee. It is squeezed by the very intruding, and might I say unnecessary center console wall you cannot negotiate. My 5 min drive was a true torture, rubbing against it and some sort of protrusion running along the top of it like a sick cherry on a bad pie.

I had an extensive test drive of a 2018 Leaf S Friday. The center console was not an issue for me. It did not even know this could be a problem for some until I just read your post. For reference, I'm 6'1".

I've also read many people complaining about the driving wheel not being telescoping. I could adapt to the driving position without issue.

ILETRIC said:
The display with the analog speed dial looks like they're not finished with it, it's just temporary, and we'll get it done maybe next year. I could hardly tell -- or see -- what speed I was traveling. It was unbelievable. Granted, I did not play with possible other configs, it there are any, or illumination. It looks real bad, period. Very bad. The Leaf 1 was much refined as compared to this bungled, perhaps thought as "retro" display,

Agreed, it's a step backward.

ILETRIC said:
Rear seats fit 5"4' person. At 5"11' you're hitting the ceiling, like Model S. Rear, in fact the entire car feels cramped, definitely more cramped than Leaf 1. I cannot envision the 5th person in the rear, other than a small child.

I could sit in the rear with my head slightly inclined. It would work for small trips but not for long ones. What surprised me is that there's almost no space to put your feet under the front seat. It's better on the passenger side but on the driver side, yikes!

Agreed that this is a four person car. There's no headrest in the middle. Having been rear ended twice in the last two years, I can say that headrests are essential. The Bolt also does not have a middle headrest.

The rear passenger area of the Bolt has more space but the trunk is smaller. So what do you value more? Trunk or rear passenger?

ILETRIC said:
The steering is mushy, mushier than Leaf 1. Certainly no comparison the just about anything on the market today. It felt like a 50's Detroit car. Adding to the list the 150 mile range, I realized that Bolt in comparison is MUCH MORE REFINED vehicle, with 80 extra more miles, super-responsive steering, cool display, but overtightened suspension (for my taste).

I borrowed a 2017 Bolt from work to drive to the Nissan dealership, so I was able to compare them fairly closely. I'm not an aggressive driver. I found both cars to be fine to drive.

The Leaf is quieter. The Bolt has a middle to high pitch whine when it accelerates at low speed. The Leaf does not have that.

ILETRIC said:
I must report that GM's Mary Barra listened and fixed the Bolt front seats, as I expected she would. No more Bolt seat issues, folks!

I'm really surprised by this. I tried three Bolts in the last month and all we very uncomfortable to sit in. The seats are too narrow and have tall bolsters. If you have a wide pelvis, it's not good.

I was hoping that the 2018 models would be better but two Chevy dealers told me the seats were the same, so I did not try an '18.

Can you provide more details? Trim, year, etc?
 
For those of you that want the digital speedometer option in the LEAF2, you just need to go to the screen that has it.

18_LEAF_dual_speedometer.jpg


It seems that the center console issue only affects those that are larger than the 95th percentile human, or have larger mid-section girth.
 
For those of you that want the digital speedometer option in the LEAF2, you just need to go to the screen that has it.

Post a picture of that screen up with Pro Pilot engaged. If we have to choose between having a digital Speedo and using pro Pilot, that's a complete Fail.
 
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