Plug-In Hybrid Car Sales Grow In France, All-Electric Decreases

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powersurge said:
I wonder how many people on this Leaf forum started with hybrids before they took the plunge to the Leaf??
Guilty as charged. Our first toe in the water was a 2008 Highlander Hybrid.

After that experience, I was much more open to the Leaf and the Clarity PHEV.

Interesting idea of having all new cars be either BEV, PHEV or at minimum old-fashioned Hybrid. I can see that being effective, though legally impractical in the U.S. anyway. China and Europe have much better prospects for doing something like that. Perhaps implement the concept for vehicles with an MSRP over $30k. Hybrid does add cost to the purchase; but by only requiring on higher end models, the argument that it would unduly burden those who can't afford it becomes rather moot. Also, when it is a standard feature on the more desirable models, it will become a more popular option on the more affordable models.
 
If hybrid AWD CUVs had been available when I bought my current car (Jan. 2003) and they were significantly more efficient than it is while meeting my other requirements and being within my price range, I would have bought one. As it was, the Escape Hybrid only appeared in the 2005 model year and got 1 mpg less Hwy than my Forester (26 vs. 27), and while it was more efficient around town (26 vs. 21) that's of little concern to me as I do so little local driving. That it also had worse performance than my Forester, especially at altitude, would have likely ruled it out in any case. The 2nd gen hybrid Escape would have been more powerful and also got better mileage (34 City/31 Hwy), so that might have been acceptable depending on price and other features. If I were looking now it would be a choice between the RAV4 and CRV hybrids and the Outlander PHEV, but I'd try and wait to see what PHEV CUV Subaru's going to come out with later this year.

As I don't need to buy a car now, I'll wait until someone makes a ZEV that meets my requirements (including charging/fueling infrastructure).
 
RegGuheert said:
Just like they did in January 2018 as discussed in the lead article in this thread, BEVs continue to outsell PHEVs by a 2:1 ratio in France four months into the year:
EV Sales said:
The 2018 PEV share dropped slightly (-0.2%), to 1.8%, with BEVs alone having 1.2% share.
Yes, they do, while growth rates continue to favor the PHEV - from the same article:
The French PEV passenger car market registered 2,833 registrations, up 34% YoY, with Plug-in hybrids continuing to grow faster than all-electrics (PHEVs +46%, BEVs +28%), pulling the market up by 20% in 2018, to 13,725 units.
 
GRA said:
Yes, they do, while growth rates continue to favor the PHEV - from the same article:
Of course that wasn't the point of this thread. The point of the thread was to point out that PHEV sales were climbing while BEV sales were dropping. It happened for one whole month while BEVs still outsold PHEVs by 2:1, just like they do worldwide, but you bring this here insisting this is a trend:
GRA said:
To date, you have produced exactly one link to an article showing BEV sales dropping while PHEV sales are falling--this one. And that was for a single month. It's all just lying with statistics to try to support your thesis that PHEVs are more attractive than BEVs.

I'll say it again: globally BEVs will win out over PHEVs long term, just as they do now, because of the extra baggage that PHEVs bring with them. PHEVs are for consumers and corporations not willing to fully commit to BEVs.
 
RegGuheert said:
I'll say it again: globally BEVs will win out over PHEVs long term, just as they do now, because of the extra baggage that PHEVs bring with them. PHEVs are for consumers and corporations not willing to fully commit to BEVs.

Latest news flash: smallest kids size bicycles with training wheels outsell same size kids bicycles without training wheels.
 
WetEV said:
Latest news flash: smallest kids size bicycles with training wheels outsell same size kids bicycles without training wheels.
It's not a great analogy since training wheels are nearly free and removable.

I don't know anyone who purchased more than one bicycle with training wheels for the same child. The same isn't (and won't be) true for all PHEV owners, but it is likely to be the rule rather than the exception as BEVs and infrastructure improve.
 
RegGuheert said:
GRA said:
Yes, they do, while growth rates continue to favor the PHEV - from the same article:
Of course that wasn't the point of this thread. The point of the thread was to point out that PHEV sales were climbing while BEV sales were dropping. It happened for one whole month while BEVs still outsold PHEVs by 2:1, just like they do worldwide, but you bring this here insisting this is a trend:
GRA said:
To date, you have produced exactly one link to an article showing BEV sales dropping while PHEV sales are falling--this one. And that was for a single month. It's all just lying with statistics to try to support your thesis that PHEVs are more attractive than BEVs.

I'll say it again: globally BEVs will win out over PHEVs long term, just as they do now, because of the extra baggage that PHEVs bring with them. PHEVs are for consumers and corporations not willing to fully commit to BEVs.

Reg, as I repeatedly pointed out (including in the quote above) and you have just as repeatedly ignored, I was curious to see if there was a trend, and as noted above, there wasn't. What we do see is that PHEV sales growth is generally increasing more rapidly than BEVs in areas where the incentives don't favor one or the other. We've never had any disagreement that BEVs will win out over PHEVs eventually, as PHEVs are an interim technology. But at the moment, as we also agree they are far more attractive to mainstream consumers who are unwilling to make the jump to BEVs for any number of reasons. PHEVs remain, as someone said on MNL a long time back, the gateway drug to BEVs. [Edit]: Went looking and found who first said it here. It was a poster named "Darkstar" who wrote on Nov. 10th, 2011, "The Volt is just a gateway drug to pure EV ownership. :lol: "
 
WetEV said:
GRA said:
It's my personal bias that 7 years after production PEVs were introduced here, they've only just reached 1% of U.S. sales despite large continuing subsidies?

I suspect you will be whining about how PEVs are only 4% of USA sales in 4 more years...

He could whine that Wisconsin plug in sales collapsed to 8 units sold in January after the much hyped hybrid and EV tax took effect.

At least those 8 people who bought a plug in now get to pay “their fair share”
and the 90% drop in sales is necessary to ensure everyone pays their “fair share”, right?
 
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