NHTSA hasn't tested the 2018 LEAF yet, but Euro NCAP has. Comparing across different test procedures isn't the best idea, but:SageBrush said:https://insideevs.com/nhtsa-tesla-model-3-safest-vehicle-tested/golfcart said:SageBrush said:I certainly understand the desire to not waste money on cars but I view cost in terms of total cost of ownership and safety while striving be a positive member of society.
I notice you keep saying safety... Is there a reason you consider a 2018 model 3 to be substantially safer than a 2018 leaf given that the new leaf has automatic emergency braking, blind spot detection, propilot, etc...?
https://www.theverge.com/2018/9/20/17882634/tesla-model-3-nhtsa-five-star-safety-rating
https://cleantechnica.com/2018/05/0...in-new-more-rigorous-euro-ncap-crash-testing/2018 Nissan LEAF Wins 5-Star Safety Rating In New, More Rigorous Euro NCAP Crash Tests
SageBrush said:https://insideevs.com/nhtsa-tesla-model-3-safest-vehicle-tested/
https://www.theverge.com/2018/9/20/17882634/tesla-model-3-nhtsa-five-star-safety-rating
GRA said:https://cleantechnica.com/2018/05/0...in-new-more-rigorous-euro-ncap-crash-testing/
I suspect the safety difference between the two on the same test regime will be fairly marginal, but we'll see.
SageBrush said:As an owner of a Tesla and a LEAF, I can tell you that the Tesla has a LOT more than 1% additional marginal utility:
- Safety
Enjoyment
Superior engineering
Expected long life
*Full replacement of an ICE*
I paid $46k for the two cars net out of pocket and pay trivial fuel costs. No back-up ICE crap rusting in my driveway while I am forced to pay carrying costs. It would be difficult if not impossible to have better value.
The ride in my Model 3 is wonderful.LeftieBiker said:In fact, the rougher ride
golfcart said:I am just going through this exercise in my head now and was curious what other leaf owners think or have done.
I have a 2015 Leaf S with 43,000 miles on it. My latest leafspy stats show 83% SOH and 52AHr on the battery. I just dropped my first bar last week. I have a 52 mile round trip commute and a child with activities a few days a week. Right now I can manage pretty well but it is getting tight on some cold days to get the kid after work and get them where they need to go without having the charge first (which is not always an option).
I don't think there is any chance of me getting my battery replaced for free based on my rate of degradation current my commute which will likely cause me to hit 60,000 miles sometime in late 2019 or early 2020.
I originally paid $23,400 for the car with the QC Package and Winter Package. That came out to $15,900 after the tax rebate. We financed at 0% so this car didn't really cost me that much.
Here is my dilemma... Do I unload the car now while I can get about $10k for it or just drive it until it can no longer make my commute in the winter and sell it/trade it in then (which will likely be the 2019/2020 winter).
If I got $10k for the car early in 2019 (which I think I could) I would have spent $5900 net for 3 1/2 years of maintenance free driving. That is pretty great in my opinion. I could use that money to put towards a 2018 SV with winter package and tech package that has been sitting on the dealer lot for the last year (assuming it's still there). Then, given the 40kWh battery pack and 8 year warranty, never have to worry about range again. Even if the battery dropped to 60% in 8 years I'd still be able to get to work and back no problem. Plus I'd get the pro-pilot, hybrid heater, android auto, e-pedal, etc...
If I hold on to the current car, I risk the vehicle becoming a real hassle for me sometime next winter and having questionable resale value at that point. I mean, who wants a car that only goes 55 miles in the winter (probably 45 if you turn the heater on)?. I suppose at that point I could trade it in on a 2019 or used 2018 but I am unsure how much resale I will lose between now and then. Given the number of other EV and PHEV options coming out it just makes me feel like the GEN1 leaf is gonna look like a dinosaur soon and nobody will want it.
I guess my final option is just drive it into the ground and QC it on my lunch break every day once the range gets to low. That is probably the cheapest since the dealership is right by my office and I can charge for free since I bought it there. That just sounds like it'll get old real quick.
Any thoughts? Anyone sold a 2015 recently or upgraded from a GEN1 leaf to a GEN2 leaf? If so, do u think it was a good choice? What would y'all do in my situation? There are no bad opinions, I am just mulling over my choices and would appreciate any input.
I am 60 years old. My hope is that our Model 3 will be the last car I buy. Say .. 20 years of use, trivial fuel costs. If it works out that way the value will have been tremendous.kosjet said:SageBrush said:As an owner of a Tesla and a LEAF, I can tell you that the Tesla has a LOT more than 1% additional marginal utility:
- Safety
Enjoyment
Superior engineering
Expected long life
*Full replacement of an ICE*
I paid $46k for the two cars net out of pocket and pay trivial fuel costs. No back-up ICE crap rusting in my driveway while I am forced to pay carrying costs. It would be difficult if not impossible to have better value.
True, my 1% was purely a measure of my number of days of reasonable utility and did not account for other factors of value. There is no doubt that the Model 3 is a better car. The question is how much extra are you willing to pay for that extra. For me, I did not value those additional factors over the Leaf at their current price points. It's a personal value calculation.
SageBrush said:The ride in my Model 3 is wonderful.LeftieBiker said:In fact, the rougher ride
NJLeaf75 said:If I were in your shoes I would wait until the 60 kWh Leaf hit the market and then trade in your 2015 Leaf for a 2018 Leaf.
NJLeaf75 said:However, if you plan on taking any regional trips that require to charge more than twice enroute, then you may want go for a 64 kWh Leaf or a 64 kWh Kona.
While it will undoubtedly be priced higher than the Kona, the Kia Niro will use the exact same 64kWh pack and will have more back seat leg (and cargo) room than the Kona, and around the same range (still waiting for EPA, but on WLTP it was slightly MORE than the Kona despite being bigger). I'm considering one, although the lack of AWD and the still relatively slow max. charge rate are negatives for me, as I want to use this for serious road trips, and distances to and between attractions out here in the west tend to be greater than where you are. CCS is definitely looking preferable to CHAdeMO at this point.NJLeaf75 said:<snip>That leaves me somewhere in between the 64 kWh Leaf and the 64 kWh Kona. The decision between those two for me will come down to, in order of priority: (i) backseat legroom, (ii) the rate at which the vehicle can fast charge, and (iii) usable cargo/trunk space. The Kona's ability to suck in electricity at a rate of 72 kWh is about as good as I will be able to get on my budget, so that may sway my decision since I road trip a bit. I am also staring to think that the CCS fast charging standard may be a better option since Electrify America is installing a network of chargers that is clearly biased towards that standard. Accordingly, the I will give the Kona a detailed look...even though in my heart I will be rooting for the long range Leaf.
The Kona and Niro won't have the 39kWh pack as an option in the U.S. - we'll have to see on the Soul. I've always liked the Soul -it's got a jaunty personality, but range/charging speed are top priorities for me (at a price I can afford).alozzy said:FYI, the Sole EV is also rumored to be built on the same platform and battery pack options.
How much time have you spent driving a Model 3 ?LeftieBiker said:SageBrush said:The ride in my Model 3 is wonderful.LeftieBiker said:In fact, the rougher ride
You like it, but that doesn't make it soft enough for those who prefer ride comfort over enhanced cornering capability. The somewhat harsh ride has been mentioned in several reviews of the 3 now..
How much time have you spent driving a Model 3 ?
GRA said:snip>While it will undoubtedly be priced higher than the Kona, the Kia Niro will use the exact same 64kWh pack and will have more back seat leg (and cargo) room than the Kona, and around the same range (still waiting for EPA, but on WLTP it was slightly MORE than the Kona despite being bigger). I'm considering one, although the lack of AWD and the still relatively slow max. charge rate are negatives for me, as I want to use this for serious road trips, and distances to and between attractions out here in the west tend to be greater than where you are. CCS is definitely looking preferable to CHAdeMO at this point.
GRA said:While it will undoubtedly be priced higher than the Kona, the Kia Niro will use the exact same 64kWh pack and will have more back seat leg (and cargo) room than the Kona, and around the same range (still waiting for EPA, but on WLTP it was slightly MORE than the Kona despite being bigger). I'm considering one, although the lack of AWD and the still relatively slow max. charge rate are negatives for me, as I want to use this for serious road trips, and distances to and between attractions out here in the west tend to be greater than where you are. CCS is definitely looking preferable to CHAdeMO at this point.
Obviously. Try to understand that the large majority of Model 3 owners think the ride is quiet, refined and compliant while having amazing dynamics, and that relying on a small minority opinion to make a general statement is worthy of a trumper.LeftieBiker said:How much time have you spent driving a Model 3 ?
None.
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