DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 13868
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:00 am

LeftieBiker wrote:I think that the issue is the possibility of someone stopping while using PP in traffic, and getting out of the car for whatever reason, leaving it engaged. Would the car then take off alone and empty, and resume following the car ahead, or not.....?


Can't fix stupid. A simple seat sensor would do the trick but that is one more thing to fix. Nevertheless, I have full faith in Mankind's ability to circumvent the best of intentions.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 15,000 miles, 478 GIDs, 37.0 kwh 109.81 Ahr , SOH 94.61, Hx 120.15
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jdcbomb
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 12:17 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2015

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:35 am

LeftieBiker wrote:I think that the issue is the possibility of someone stopping while using PP in traffic, and getting out of the car for whatever reason, leaving it engaged. Would the car then take off alone and empty, and resume following the car ahead, or not.....?


The vehicle will not even go forward once it senses the driver's door is opened, as it automatically switches from Drive mode to Park immediately. Therefore, PP would not be engaged. I actually tested this inadvertently when I was backing in, and wanted to verify my ground position by opening the door.

I've already thought of a way to bypass this though. Just open the window all the way, crawl out, and I'm pretty sure the vehicle will just take off on its own, IF PP is on and in standby mode while it's stopped. If a small 300 g weight is attached to the steering wheel, it could literally keep going until it crashes or automatically stops. Who wants to test my theory? :-D
2018 Leaf SV - In Service 2019 January - Location: Raleigh, NC.
2013 Leaf SL - Original In Service 2013 February - Bar Losses: 2016.10.17 - 25,843 Miles -- 2017.06.23 - 32,080 Miles -- 2018.04.10 - 37,000 Miles -- 4th: 2018.09.23 - 44,255 Miles

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12192
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:13 pm

Given the above info, I think that Nissan wants to prevent inattention/distraction while stopped in traffic from causing the car to be responsible for a crash.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

User avatar
jlv
Posts: 1005
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2014
Leaf Number: 424487
Location: Massachusetts

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:15 am

Relevant xkcd:
Image

('cept for the "vrrrrrrroom")
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Tesla X 100D (12/18)
75K 100% BEV miles since '14
ICE free since '18

jdcbomb
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 12:17 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2015

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:17 am

Another sort of crazy idea: This solution could be applied to any EV with some sort of AP that works well on highways. Theoretically, if one person needed to transport a EV some distance along a highway / or relatively straight road without deep turns, etc., you could place the weight on the steering wheel, engage PP, exit the vehicle out the window, enter the "vehicle ahead", drive off, and theoretically be "towing" the LEAF (or other EV) behind you for quite awhile. Almost like a tractor beam tow! :-D
2018 Leaf SV - In Service 2019 January - Location: Raleigh, NC.
2013 Leaf SL - Original In Service 2013 February - Bar Losses: 2016.10.17 - 25,843 Miles -- 2017.06.23 - 32,080 Miles -- 2018.04.10 - 37,000 Miles -- 4th: 2018.09.23 - 44,255 Miles

Astros
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:21 am
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2018
Leaf Number: 310136
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:56 pm

ProPilot won't start the car from a complete stop if the car has been stopped for more than ~3 seconds. After that, you have to either gently tap the accelerator or press a button for it to resume driving.
2019 Deep Blue SL Plus

jdcbomb
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 12:17 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2015

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:14 pm

Astros wrote:ProPilot won't start the car from a complete stop if the car has been stopped for more than ~3 seconds. After that, you have to either gently tap the accelerator or press a button for it to resume driving.


...which is theoretically possible if you're standing outside the car and tap the button by reaching in...thus beginning the hands free tow. Although, I can see why you would need that 2nd person in the lead vehicle already moving to ensure the 3 sec window is not exceeded.
2018 Leaf SV - In Service 2019 January - Location: Raleigh, NC.
2013 Leaf SL - Original In Service 2013 February - Bar Losses: 2016.10.17 - 25,843 Miles -- 2017.06.23 - 32,080 Miles -- 2018.04.10 - 37,000 Miles -- 4th: 2018.09.23 - 44,255 Miles

wzaqnu
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:40 pm
Delivery Date: 24 Dec 2018

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:37 pm

I get the inattention/distraction argument in principle, but in practice the car already has sensors to determine if you're holding the wheel, sensors to determine if you're adequately paying attention to the road, and sensors to determine if you've exited the vehicle. So it seems beyond overkill to cripple ProPilot as well.

On top of that, I don't see why Nissan couldn't bump up the stop time to something more reasonable like 5-7 seconds. In practice, the 2ish seconds right now is incredibly awkward. In traffic-heavy cities, stops over 2 seconds are incredibly common. And if the car comes to a stop, I never really know if it'll continue to the follow the car in front of me or not. This is because it seems like it takes more than 2 seconds for the car to come to a full stop and then allow the car in front to gain a sufficient gap before the LEAF starts moving again. In most situations in Los Angeles, if the car comes to a stop, you're going to have to manually engage ProPilot again. It's almost as if Nissan never opted to drive with ProPilot in a city like LA.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12192
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:46 pm

I get the inattention/distraction argument in principle, but in practice the car already has sensors to determine if you're holding the wheel, sensors to determine if you're adequately paying attention to the road, and sensors to determine if you've exited the vehicle.


AFAIK there are NO sensors to determine if you are paying attention. Those are in development, but if any manufacturer is using them yet, it isn't Nissan.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

wzaqnu
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:40 pm
Delivery Date: 24 Dec 2018

Re: New Leaf ProPilot

Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:15 pm

AFAIK there are NO sensors to determine if you are paying attention. Those are in development, but if any manufacturer is using them yet, it isn't Nissan.


This is incorrect. My 2018 SL has the Intelligent Driver Alertness system, which has warned me on a few occasions after I've spaced out during a drive.

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