Power consumption when stopped in Drive

[summakor]

I use ePedal sometimes for two reasons: 1) It's a quicker reaction time when the light turns green (gotta watch for wheel spin because traction control can't be turned off and really kills power), and 2) ePedal does excellent brake modulation for that last second of motion, for very smooth stops. It's smoother at stopping than I can reliably be.

In general I stay in D and slow by coasting when possible. If I know I really need to slow down I'll briefly use B or Eco for more regen. Coasting is possible in any of these modes but it's easiest in D. Also, for whoever needs to know, the power consumption at top speed is 2.2mi/kWh so the range should be 80 mi (or 120mi for the PLUS.). The battery temperature doesn't go up much because the power is dialed down when the limites max speed is reached.

As far as the creep power consumption, it's surely the same at a standstill in any mode. Powering the motor to push against the brakes is a way ICEs waste energy and nobody would program an RV to do that. Not sure all modern ICEs even do that anymore with stop-start and all.

 

[Jerther]

traction control can't be turned off

Actually there's a config option burried in the menus. On my 2018 I could turn it off and have the wheels spin free on snow. Not sure on my 2022. Will know soon enough

 

[Jeffrey Stumpf]

Good place to understand what Nissan says about B Mode and e-pedal is to download the online PDF and search for these terms.

1. “B mode” is in the online downloadable & searchable PDF manual, for the 2024 Nissan Leaf SV Plus.

2. “e-Pedal” is in this same manual 61 times.

To me this is the definitive high level explanation of these two modes and what they do as explained to the tech writers by the Leaf engineers.

How these modes actually work, in all possible scenarios, is based on these explanations. If you need more you would have to do extensive research and/or talk to these engineers. Even then, since software and hardware systems may behave a bit differently depending on the particular use case and interactions between the two.

That being said, I almost always have the “ECO” and “e-Pedal” and the “Retain” e-pedal switches and setting set. If I remember around town and on a long downhill I most times have the shifter in the “B mode” to give maximum regeneration back to the battery, this should yield maximum efficiency. BTW: LeafSpy pro labels the “B mode” “B/ECO” in its screens showing the “Gear Pos” shift /drive modes.

 

[summakor]

Actually there's a config option burried in the menus. On my 2018 I could turn it off and have the wheels spin free on snow. Not sure on my 2022. Will know soon enough

Yeah but even TCS OFF (2022) is not really fully off. I think because the motor has such little inertia that the RPM shoots up faster than in a skidding ICE car, stressing tires and maybe other drivetrain parts. That's what I've heard/thought.

 

[Jerther]

@BillAinCT Here's the video I promised.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/LYXt2AkTghkjZLvd9

I tried to show the difference between D and B modes, then same thing but with ePedal on, then finally I tried to add Eco mode into the loop but I ran out of hill I never touched the brake pedal.

Can you spot anything?

 

[BillAinCT]

I agree that it doesn't change the amount of regen in e-Pedal mode. Why I felt like it was more efficient is that it seems to kick in regen later when lifting the pedal in B mode. Therefore making it easier to coast. I've been testing this and it might just be that the blue regen blocks light up later, although it feels to me like as I lift the pedal in D mode the car begins to slow faster before blue bars show, than it does in B mode. Like I don't feel as much deceleration. But I admit now after testing the past 3-4 days that it's pretty subtle and I quite possible am wrong about this. Since switching to B as much as I can remember to, and often I feel like I'm reminded to switch by seeing regen blocks come up more quickly in D, that efficiency is better. Temperature has been relatively consistent and I watch tire pressure often.

You would expect (I think) if in e-Pedal B mode it was a do-nothing, why did the engineers allow it be to selected? Did they think people are switching frequently from e-Pedal on and off? I can't prove what I think is happening, but those who say it's disabled in e-Pedal mode haven't proved that also.

 

[Jerther]

it seems to kick in regen later when lifting the pedal in B mode

I see! Interesting. I'll look into that on mine.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

If creep mode is not disabled, then why does the car remain stationary when stopped when e-pedal is engaged? It will not move until the go-pedal is pressed - doesn't that qualify as eliminating the car's ability to "creep" forward? Personally, I like not having to have my foot on the brake when I am stopped. Also, what do you think happens to B when the e-pedal is on? Does it revert back to D? Your statement that B does not exist in e-pedal mode may be true for a Gen 1 Leaf, but I don't think it applies to a Gen 2 - certainly not in mine! There is a distinct difference in performance between B and D when the e-pedal is engaged.

Friction brake application.

E Pedal, D, B, N, etc. are all individual drive modes. ECO is the only drive modifier

E Pedal does not exist in a Gen 1

Your distinct performance is true simply because you want it to be.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Clarify this? E-Pedal doesn't creep unless you press the pedal. There's no creep with no pedals touched like an ICE.

B doesn't exist in E-pedal mode? Not only is it there, I now know when I let off the pedal and when it regens that I've forgotten to double shift into B. B mode starts regen later. In a + 2022. Maybe there were firmware changes. After driving 2 years in D only mode and now using B as much as I can remember, there is positively a difference. Different enough that I'm adding a module to the shifter to shift into B mode when I shift into D because I don't often remember and it's annoying.

I don't know anything about newer model changes to E Pedal nor have I read anything about it. Could a change have happened? Anything is possible and immediately cleared up with a link.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

This post mentions going in and out of B mode in e-Pedal mode to change the braking distance.

My post and apparently not well written. I recorded each drive mode independently so it was D, B and E Pedal. I also found that E Pedal did not change its regen profile in D or B which makes sense since all three are drive modes and the only drive modifier is ECO.

Tests were done on a steep downhill slope roughly .86 miles in length by accelerating to a speed roughly 70 mph and then "coasting" down the hill with LEAF Spy running to measure regen levels. I repeated the tests at 50 and 35 mph (the latter didn't provide enough data in E Pedal to be useful) Each leg was run 3 times in each mode except the 35 mph run in E Pedal because the car slowed too quickly to get a decent data run.
The tests were done with SOC at 30% and at 75% and there was also no difference.

 

[BillAinCT]

@DaveinOlyWA you claim B mode does not exist in e-Pedal mode. Where is the link or where has this been proven and for what MY? And if so then it makes no sense that it is allowed to be selected. As I've said more than once, I'm not claiming that the regen amount changes with B and D in e-Pedal mode. I feel (and it well could just be a feel) that the car coasts easier as if regen or the feeling of deceleration is somehow happening slightly later. I don't care if I'm right or wrong and if switching t to B makse me drive differently somehow and it's more efficient, so be it. I'll be happy with that.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

@DaveinOlyWA you claim B mode does not exist in e-Pedal mode. Where is the link or where has this been proven and for what MY? And if so then it makes no sense that it is allowed to be selected. As I've said more than once, I'm not claiming that the regen amount changes with B and D in e-Pedal mode. I feel (and it well could just be a feel) that the car coasts easier as if regen or the feeling of deceleration is somehow happening slightly later. I don't care if I'm right or wrong and if switching t to B makse me drive differently somehow and it's more efficient, so be it. I'll be happy with that.

As mentioned, I accept the possibility that E Pedal was edited in later models but ATM, it is nothing but that unless you have something to support your claim. But if you are happy with your feelings, does anything else matter?

 

[Jerther]

I agree that B and D modes being switchable while in ePedal mode does not make much sens if it does not matter. However, it not making sense doesn't mean it does not exist. I know plenty of nonsense

Peace guys. We're here to learn stuff and have fun.

 

[Kenny]

That action has never been available on any LEAF.

It’s easy to see it for yourself in 2 ways. First is when coming to a stop on an uphill grade. The moment you come to a standstill the car will roll backwards as the creep disengages. This forces the driver to press the pedal harder. However if you just release the brake in most cases the creep will engage again and hold the car in place for you. Obviously you won’t see this if using ePedal.
The second way involves the use of LeafSpy. Observe the power usage meter when stopped in gear with the brake on. You will notice an instant power usage increase the moment you release the brake pedal, before you hit the accelerator. This is the creep reengaging. Again, you can see this if using ePedal.
This is what happens on my 2018 Leaf SL and I’ve observed the same behaviour on my sister’s 2018 Leaf SV. I can’t speak for any other model years.

 

[Kenny]

I used to use ePedal all the time and really liked it. One thing, however, that I didn't like is how much braking it used. I would also rely on the adaptive cruise control to bring the car to a stop (at traffic lights and stop signs when following other cars) and to slow down in traffic. The adaptive cruise control is not the sharpest tack in the drawer, as it would have to over react constantly. It obviously could not see or anticipate the big picture. I started cancelling cruise control in most of those situations and quit using ePedal so I could coast more (foot off the right pedal, not in neutral) and control braking. Lo and behold my battery efficiency increased probably 15 percent. There's something to be said for the "human in the loop" at least in this case.

Agree 100% with this comment. Coasting in D is far more efficient than ePedal

 

[Carli Steiermarker]

Thank you John. From the beginning (6 months ago) of my Leaf ownership I have pulled my foot off the acceleration pedal and allowed the e-pedal to bring the car to a stop, but I kept my foot resting on the brake without pressing on it. The past couple of months I finally trust the e-pedal enough to keep me from creeping.