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lpickup
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:21 am

This may sound pedantic, but I think we need to get some terminology straight, because I am confused about what you are saying.

The CHARGER is inside the car. So let's not use that term or anything outside the car.

The EVSE is the device that plugs into the wall (or is hardwired to the breaker panel) on one end, and has the charging cable and connector that you plug into your car on the other end. For a permanent installation this may be mounted on the wall, or it may be the the portable unit that came with your car. Tesla calls the wall mounted version of this a WALL CONNECTOR and the portable one that comes with the car a UMC (Universal Mobile Connector). The Tesla does NOT come with a WALL CONNECTOR (this a a $500 item, which is actually a pretty good deal - https://shop.tesla.com/product/wall-connector), but it does come with a UMC.

The J1772 ADAPTER is a small device that has a female J1772 connector on one end and a male Tesla connector on the other. You would attach this to the end of a standard EVSE connector so that you can plug it into your Tesla. This adapter comes with the car. If you want a spare, it costs $95 from Tesla (https://shop.tesla.com/product/sae-j177 ... ng-adapter) although I found one online for a bit less.

The NEMA 14-50 ADAPTER is a small cord with a NEMA 14-50 plug on it that plugs into the Tesla UMC so that you can plug it into a NEMA 14-50 (240V) outlet. There are other similar adapters that can be used to plug into other 120V and 240V outlets. They used to include the NEMA 14-50 ADAPTER with the vehicle, but that is now something you need to buy extra (about $35 - https://shop.tesla.com/product/gen-2-nema-adapters)

With all that out of the way, here is where you lost me: "Another issue is I currently have my connector hooked up to wall charger." What are you calling a connector and what are you calling a wall charger? I'm assuming you just mean that you have a wall mounted EVSE that you insert the connector into and it holds it neatly in place. It's not actually "connected" in an electrical sense. It's just a plastic piece that neatly holds the connector in place. Let's call this the HOLSTER, although in your case it's built into to your EVSE. You can get these standalone for $15 or so (https://www.amazon.com/J1772-electric-h ... B00TBW1NRM). You can get similar for the Tesla connector from Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Tesla-Motors-102 ... 01EO5BCR6/) but most people just 3D print their own, or like me, just lay the cord over the charging station. It doesn't NEED to hook to anything. It is true though that with the J1772 ADAPTER attached, it will not fit into your EVSE's holster. You will have to remove it each time, or like I do, just lay the cord over the EVSE.
...Lance

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LeftieBiker
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:56 am

The charger is inside the car. So let's not use that term or anything outside the car.

Actually, a DC Fast Charger is a charger and is an installation outside of the car. It bypasses the onboard charger (although it does communicate with it) to charge the car's battery pack directly, with high voltage, high amperage direct current. What you wrote applies to L-1 and L-2 charging, not to DC Fast Charging.
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lpickup
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jan 31, 2020 5:12 am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:56 am
The charger is inside the car. So let's not use that term or anything outside the car.

Actually, a DC Fast Charger is a charger and is an installation outside of the car. It bypasses the onboard charger (although it does communicate with it) to charge the car's battery pack directly, with high voltage, high amperage direct current. What you wrote applies to L-1 and L-2 charging, not to DC Fast Charging.
Yes, quite true, although I assumed the OP did not have a DC fast charger at home :) I suppose if I can be pedantic, then it's fair game for everyone.

By the way, I think this fact is an overlooked advantage that Tesla has over all other charging network providers.

Basically the chargers that are inside Tesla Supercharger cabinets are copies of the chargers inside their vehicles. This gives them the R&D advantage of not having to design a charger from scratch, and a manufacturing advantage in that they are already producing these things in extremely high volume. The chargers that go into commercial DC fast chargers are custom-designed relatively low volume units. Add in the fact that charging networks like ElectrifyAmerica and EVgo don't make their own equipment, but rather buy them from 3rd parties, adding an additional layer in the supply chain (that needs to make money). For the same spend, Tesla should be able to install many more Superchargers than ElectrifyAmerica can. And that's before we even consider the synergies with V3 Supercharger sites and Tesla's solar and energy storage businesses.
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EVDRIVER
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jan 31, 2020 7:12 am

lpickup wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 5:12 am
LeftieBiker wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:56 am
The charger is inside the car. So let's not use that term or anything outside the car.

Actually, a DC Fast Charger is a charger and is an installation outside of the car. It bypasses the onboard charger (although it does communicate with it) to charge the car's battery pack directly, with high voltage, high amperage direct current. What you wrote applies to L-1 and L-2 charging, not to DC Fast Charging.
Yes, quite true, although I assumed the OP did not have a DC fast charger at home :) I suppose if I can be pedantic, then it's fair game for everyone.

By the way, I think this fact is an overlooked advantage that Tesla has over all other charging network providers.

Basically the chargers that are inside Tesla Supercharger cabinets are copies of the chargers inside their vehicles. This gives them the R&D advantage of not having to design a charger from scratch, and a manufacturing advantage in that they are already producing these things in extremely high volume. The chargers that go into commercial DC fast chargers are custom-designed relatively low volume units. Add in the fact that charging networks like ElectrifyAmerica and EVgo don't make their own equipment, but rather buy them from 3rd parties, adding an additional layer in the supply chain (that needs to make money). For the same spend, Tesla should be able to install many more Superchargers than ElectrifyAmerica can. And that's before we even consider the synergies with V3 Supercharger sites and Tesla's solar and energy storage businesses.
Bingo! Not to mention stacking them makes the output scalable and they can be distributed or aggregated to work in different installation environments. The V3 stalls also have much narrower cables.

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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jan 31, 2020 7:46 pm

lpickup wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:21 am
This may sound pedantic, but I think we need to get some terminology straight, because I am confused about what you are saying.

The CHARGER is inside the car. So let's not use that term or anything outside the car.

The EVSE is the device that plugs into the wall (or is hardwired to the breaker panel) on one end, and has the charging cable and connector that you plug into your car on the other end. For a permanent installation this may be mounted on the wall, or it may be the the portable unit that came with your car. Tesla calls the wall mounted version of this a WALL CONNECTOR and the portable one that comes with the car a UMC (Universal Mobile Connector). The Tesla does NOT come with a WALL CONNECTOR (this a a $500 item, which is actually a pretty good deal - https://shop.tesla.com/product/wall-connector), but it does come with a UMC.

The J1772 ADAPTER is a small device that has a female J1772 connector on one end and a male Tesla connector on the other. You would attach this to the end of a standard EVSE connector so that you can plug it into your Tesla. This adapter comes with the car. If you want a spare, it costs $95 from Tesla (https://shop.tesla.com/product/sae-j177 ... ng-adapter) although I found one online for a bit less.

The NEMA 14-50 ADAPTER is a small cord with a NEMA 14-50 plug on it that plugs into the Tesla UMC so that you can plug it into a NEMA 14-50 (240V) outlet. There are other similar adapters that can be used to plug into other 120V and 240V outlets. They used to include the NEMA 14-50 ADAPTER with the vehicle, but that is now something you need to buy extra (about $35 - https://shop.tesla.com/product/gen-2-nema-adapters)

With all that out of the way, here is where you lost me: "Another issue is I currently have my connector hooked up to wall charger." What are you calling a connector and what are you calling a wall charger? I'm assuming you just mean that you have a wall mounted EVSE that you insert the connector into and it holds it neatly in place. It's not actually "connected" in an electrical sense. It's just a plastic piece that neatly holds the connector in place. Let's call this the HOLSTER, although in your case it's built into to your EVSE. You can get these standalone for $15 or so (https://www.amazon.com/J1772-electric-h ... B00TBW1NRM). You can get similar for the Tesla connector from Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Tesla-Motors-102 ... 01EO5BCR6/) but most people just 3D print their own, or like me, just lay the cord over the charging station. It doesn't NEED to hook to anything. It is true though that with the J1772 ADAPTER attached, it will not fit into your EVSE's holster. You will have to remove it each time, or like I do, just lay the cord over the EVSE.
Sorry for confusing you, I don't know the terminology very well. Yes, my EVGO wall mount has the holster holding the connector in place. When I get home, I take the connector out of its holster and plug connector into my LEAF. Thanks for idea. if the connector doesn't need to be in the holster when not in use, I can just lay it over the charging station with the Tesla adapter attached. I thought the the connector had to be in the holster when not in use.

cwerdna
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:52 pm

I just stumbled across this.
specialgreen wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:26 am
To maximize the warranty period, a new Model 3 owner could opt for the 8-year extended warranty; then sell back to Tesla before 100k miles.
What's "the 8-year extended warranty"? I'm not aware of any such thing being offered by Tesla on the 3. Are you talking about a 3rd-party extended warranty?

They only offer such a thing on Model S and X at the moment: https://www.tesla.com/support/extended- ... -agreement.

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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Jul 24, 2020 3:20 pm

cwerdna wrote:
Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:52 pm
I just stumbled across this.
specialgreen wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:26 am
To maximize the warranty period, a new Model 3 owner could opt for the 8-year extended warranty; then sell back to Tesla before 100k miles.
What's "the 8-year extended warranty"? I'm not aware of any such thing being offered by Tesla on the 3. Are you talking about a 3rd-party extended warranty?

They only offer such a thing on Model S and X at the moment: https://www.tesla.com/support/extended- ... -agreement.
In the US, Tesla’s warranty is 4years/50,000miles bumper-to-bumper. The battery and drive unit are warrantied for 8 years and either 100,000 or 125,000 miles depending upon model; this is standard, no opting-in or extra payments needed. At present, there is no extended warranty in the normal sense for the Model 3. For insomniacs: https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/fi ... _en_US.pdf
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:57 pm

here is something interesting from the model 3 forum:

The average Teslafi degradation is 6.7% on my ODO (10mo old car 29k km) So I’d say my examples are pretty on point.
If the average is already ~7% capacity loss, there must be alot of people above 10% loss also.
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lpickup
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:37 am

DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:57 pm
The average Teslafi degradation is 6.7% on my ODO (10mo old car 29k km) So I’d say my examples are pretty on point.
If the average is already ~7% capacity loss, there must be alot of people above 10% loss also.
I think this is a relative newbie that hasn't had enough time with the car to determine that, like the LEAF, there is an initial drop-off of capacity that flattens out significantly.

Of course I just went to check my own report...it's a bit hard to determine what my loss actually is because while my car nominally started out at 310 miles of range (and TeslaFi actually estimated 315 miles in my earliest reports), a software update was rolled out to my car that extended that range to 325 miles, resulting in a TeslaFi estimate of 318.25 miles. At 13K miles I had my then highest range estimate at 319.66, and then it fell to 297.76 miles in January of this year at about 20K miles. But then, who knows why, but my capacity has recovered, and the latest estimate at 24K miles is now 319.97. So my battery has actually GAINED capacity! Even if you go with a theoretical 325 mile range when new, that's still 1.5% capacity loss on a 2 year old car.

So these are only calculated estimates based on non-100% charges for the most part (and definitely recently where I am only charging to 60%). But even if you look at the wider distribution of Teslas out there, you see an initial drop of about 5% and then a VERY slow tail only reaching the 10% after well over 100K miles. I'd say that this person probably had their initial capacity drop and will probably hover at around 6.7-7% capacity loss for a long time to come.
...Lance

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SalisburySam
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Re: Official Tesla Model 3 thread

Fri Aug 21, 2020 11:51 am

Just as a datapoint, or many, here is my battery capacity over time from delivery just over two years ago to today. My charging has been mostly to 80% with occasional charging above that for trips. When at home, which is most of the time especially now, the car is plugged in. I use the AeroVironment EVSE I purchased when I bought my 2012 LEAF in February of that year so my max charge to the Model 3 is only 32amps even though the 3 could take up to 48 amps with the Tesla EVSE and appropriate circuitry. Still, it all works. Started with 310-mile range, now have 311-mile range. Not sure why. don’t care, loving the 3. At roughly the same mileage, the Model 3 gives me 9 times the range of my LEAF.
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