LeftieBiker
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:37 pm

...and likely to be more efficient, less expensive, and with superior build quality than the Prius.

Based on what? The press releases?
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edatoakrun
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 10:13 am

LeftieBiker wrote:
...and likely to be more efficient, less expensive, and with superior build quality than the Prius.

Based on what? The press releases?
Yes, and also on drive reports, Hyundai's previous pricing policies, and recent quality surveys of Hyundai's cars VS Toyota's.

I probably should have added the Ioniq's larger interior volume for both passengers and cargo, which seems to be confirmed already.

More info. posted on the thread and accompanying comparison table below:

http://www.ioniqforum.com/forum/129-hyu ... rison.html

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0
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LeftieBiker
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 11:41 am

Prius build quality has been great so far. We'll see how well Hyundai does outside of the media reports.
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TomT
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 12:17 pm

I'm an outlier... I require about 40 miles round-trip...
GRA wrote:]20 miles AER will cover the routine daily driving needs of 50% of Americans
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RonDawg
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 4:27 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
gsleaf wrote:My biggest issue with the 1st gen PiP (other than terrible EV range) was the engine vibration was awful. Does anyone know if the 2nd gen will improve this?
I think some of them may have defective engine mounts. Ours is smooth.
I don't know about the PiP, but the vibration on the Prius V I test drove was awful every time the gas engine kicked in. It reminded me of a 1980's econobox.

It was a brand new car (under 500 miles), being used for carefully-monitored test drives at the LA Auto Show (no aggressive driving allowed), so I don't think it was a motor mount issue.

"Some of them may have defective engine mounts" does not sound like "great build quality" to me.
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LeftieBiker
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 4:34 pm

"Some of them may have defective engine mounts" does not sound like "great build quality" to me.

Tue enough, although I think of "build quality" more as "assembly quality" with the quality of the parts a slightly different issue. Our two Priuses (a Prius II and a PIP) have been flawless. Fit and finish were perfect, no defects. There was an issue with ice (!) accumulating in the PIP motors under certain conditions, but that's not usually a problem and it can be avoided entirely.
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GRA
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:46 pm

TomT wrote:
GRA wrote:20 miles AER will cover the routine daily driving needs of 50% of Americans
I'm an outlier... I require about 40 miles round-trip...
Uh, huh, and for you and the 28% of American drivers whose routine needs fall between 25 and 40 miles of range (GM decided to aim for an 80% solution with the original Volt, and found that 40 miles AER covered 78% of routine daily driving needs), the Volt's a better match. The more options people have, the better chance of getting a car that best matches their needs. But the cheaper the car, the larger the potential market, and given the roughly $6k difference in MSRP, the Prius Prime's potential market should be at least twice the size of the Volt's. The difference in federal tax credit can narrow that by $3k if you have enough income to qualify for the max. credit, but the Prime may also be cheap enough that people with incomes less than 300% of the federal poverty limit can afford it, boosting the California rebate by $1,500 ($2,000 after Nov. 1st).
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

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akat
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:33 pm

edatoakrun wrote:
GRA wrote:...it wouldn't certainly boost sales here if it were better looking. We'll see how much more people are willing to spend for that reason (and/or 4.5 or 5 seats), as the Fusion Energi and Hyundai Sonata PHEV as well as the Volt are all competitors.
You left out what is likely to be the most direct competitor ( when it hits the USA next summer) the Ioniq PHEV.

https://www.hyundaiusa.com/ioniq

Hyundai Ioniq BEV, hybrid, and PHEV.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=21136

Far better looking, and likely to be more efficient, less expensive, and with superior build quality than the Prius.
Latest news reports put Prius Prime's EPA MPGe rating at 133. Whatever we think of MPGe rating, that is pretty impressive and will be hard for Ioniq PHEV to beat.

RonDawg
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Fri Oct 07, 2016 3:45 am

I doubt anybody who's shopping for a plug-in vehicle really cares about MPGe; they're more concerned about range than anything else, especially for a BEV. With fuel being cheap right now and the top three best selling "cars" in the US as of July 2016 being full size pickup trucks, I don't think Americans care about MPG (without the "e") all that much either.
Blue Ocean 2012 Leaf SV, lost that 1st bar at 34 months/26,435 miles. Lease returned 2 months later. Final LeafStat figures: 225 Gids, 17.44 kWH, SOC 91.89%, SOH 82.36%, 69.49% HX, 54.57 Ahr, battery temp 61.8 F.
Now driving a 2015 VW eGolf SEL.

edatoakrun
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Re: 2016 Prius Gen 4 PHEV

Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:06 am

akat wrote:
...Latest news reports put Prius Prime's EPA MPGe rating at 133. Whatever we think of MPGe rating, that is pretty impressive and will be hard for Ioniq PHEV to beat.
Yes, I noticed Toyota recently raised the Prime's projected MPGe from 124 to 133.

Looks like the official results are not up yet, for either PHEV:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/PowerSea ... owLimit=10

Or for the Ioniq BEV, which has been projected by Hyundai to be ~125:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/PowerSea ... typ=newAfv

It may be the Ioniq PHEV will have a significantly higher MPGe than the BEV version.

However, for the PHEV-to-PHEV comparison, I think you need to also consider ICE mpg, as of course both the Prime and Ioniq PHEV will have very short E range, and neither have DC charge capability, meaning both will need to burn a lot of gas, as driven by most of their owners.
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