What gm-volt guys think of MNL ...

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evnow

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Here are some interesting comments about MNL by gm-volt members (and personally about me, as well). LOL.

http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?9892-Cool-*ev-comparison-table-by-EVNow-on-MNL-MyNissanLeaf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

update : Hmmm ... apparently the thread was deleted.
 
evnow said:
Here are some interesting comments about MNL by gm-volt members (and personally about me, as well). LOL.

http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?9892-Cool-*ev-comparison-table-by-EVNow-on-MNL-MyNissanLeaf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Interesting that you created this MNL thread. Goal?

Obviously readers should look at the opening post of that thread titled "Cool *ev comparison table by EVNow on MNL MyNissanLeaf" to see why I started it. It was positive and not negative.

I've actually meet folks here and had some great exchanges in the MNL forum as well as in various PMs. Lot of great technical information here about EVs in general. Nice. Obviously many great threads and experiments on the LEAF.
 
Because it is interesting, and sometimes amusing, to read?

scottf200 said:
evnow said:
Here are some interesting comments about MNL by gm-volt members (and personally about me, as well). LOL.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?9892-Cool-*ev-comparison-table-by-EVNow-on-MNL-MyNissanLeaf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Interesting that you created this MNL thread. Goal?
 
Oh its not that bad, I think everyone would like to be an "EV purist", but current battery technology doesn't allow that for everyones driving needs/conditions, and some feel they want/need the ability to go further than the pure EV range, its like a security blanket for some. It's really the best way to ween the public off pure gasoline, if they drive on all electric most of the time, they will soon realize they don't need their "security blanket" any longer, and their next car will likely be a pure EV :)

Evnow was not bashed too much, I think its all good :)
 
mitch672 said:
Oh its not that bad, I think everyone would like to be an "EV purist", but current battery technology doesn't allow that for everyones driving needs/conditions, and some feel they want/need the ability to go further than the pure EV range, its like a security blanket for some.
Mitch, I see from your sig that you are still driving that gas guzzling Prius :eek: "ordered 2012 Red SL Leaf 9/29/2011 "January 2012 delivery"
Hopefully you join us EV purist (~40 mile Volt BEV and ~70 mile LEAF BEV). :cool:
 
scottf200 said:
Mitch, I see from your sig that you are still driving that gas guzzling Prius :eek: "ordered 2012 Red SL Leaf 9/29/2011 "January 2012 delivery"
Hopefully you join us EV purist (~40 mile Volt BEV and ~70 mile LEAF BEV). :cool:

That's the plan, unless I decide to go with that cute little Mitsubishi I I keep seeing adds for on TV (not likely). I'd really like to get the Model S, I just might not have enough time left on the planet to wait for that. The Schnieder EVSE has been installed for over a month now... There's always the Plug in Prius, but that's not enough of an improvement over what I have already, and 10 years and 3 generations of Priu are enough for me, been driving Priu since 2001

And that "gas guzzler" gets nearly 50MPG, I use less than $25/week on fuel currently.
 
evnow said:
Here are some interesting comments about MNL by gm-volt members (and personally about me, as well). LOL.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?9892-Cool-*ev-comparison-table-by-EVNow-on-MNL-MyNissanLeaf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks for the post EVNow! It's good to see that our friends on the Volt forum have nice things to say about MNL. It's also good to see long time members of MNL like Hodad66 on that forum.
The comments about you are not inconsistent with reality ;-)

scottf200 said:
Hopefully you join us EV purist (~40 mile Volt BEV and ~70 mile LEAF BEV). :cool:
On a related note, Scottf200, I would take a cue from Rusty and decrease your proselytizing about the Volt. It's a great car but honestly, your efforts to make the Volt a BEV really do more harm than good (though the information content of many of your posts, without your attempts to befuddle, has been quite good).
 
scottf200 said:
Hopefully you join us EV purist (~40 mile Volt BEV and ~70 mile LEAF BEV). :cool:

Sorry Scott, but your Volt is not a BEV. The Volt is a hybrid. If it were a BEV, it would be eligible for an HOV plate here. It makes no difference how many miles you can squeeze out of the battery pak, it still has an ICE in it that uses Premium gasoline. And I routinely get 100 miles from an 80% charge with my LEAF, not even close to 70. That's for highway speeds around 70mph! I never even went that fast when I had my Honda GX. At 60mph on the freeway, I could easily go over 80 miles in my LEAF!
 
evnow said:
Here are some interesting comments about MNL by gm-volt members (and personally about me, as well). LOL.

Given your thread title here, I'm curious what you pulled from the referenced thread as to what gm-volt guys think. Since you've brought it up here on MNL what's partially turned into a decorum discussion there, do you have issue or comment on what's been said there? Being relatively new to both forums, I'm particularly curious what the LOL is in context to (and if you'd prefer to respond with a PM versus here (or not respond at all, after all you don't have to) that would be fine). Perhaps I'm dense, but I just don't understand the meaning and context of the quoted comment as relates to the thread title here.
 
EVNOW is an interesting fella. Long before I cared one way or another about the VOLT
I noticed how he rode everyone to post in specific threads. Finally a number of members
reminded him that forum posting is supposed to be fun... ;-) He backed off.

He has? Seems to me he is still constantly tilting at the windmill of orderly posting on the forum - bless his heart!
 
ASIDE:
eHelmholtz said:
On a related note, Scottf200, I would take a cue from Rusty and decrease your proselytizing about the Volt. It's a great car but honestly, your efforts to make the Volt a BEV really do more harm than good (though the information content of many of your posts, without your attempts to befuddle, has been quite good).
Many consider it/use_it_as a 40 mile BEV because it works different than any other plug in with a ICE/GG (PIP, C-Max energi, etc which turn the ICE on underload or at < highway speeds). That is in the Volt you can go 100 MPH with your foot on the floor while you still have battery and the ICE/GG never turns on (ie. not because of load and not because of a "MPH") . In fact you can drain the gas tank and drive everyday. I often have weeks where I've only used electrons driving from anywhere from local roads at 25-45 and highways from 55-75 MPH. Funny thing is many people don't realize this unique characteristic of the Volt. HTH.

P.S. If I befuddle, it is not intentional. I just am not that smooth with words ... plus have have several other hobbies that I devote time to so I write off the top of my head since I have limited time.

P.S.S. EVNow is welcome, AFAIK, to come over and post on GM-Volt.
 
scottf200 said:
P.S.S. EVNow is welcome, AFAIK, to come over and post on GM-Volt.
I have been "banned" for a long time in gm-volt.com. No explanations - just banned. I particularly don't like that kind of censorship.

We don't ban anyone here - unless they are spamming. You can write all you want about Volt - you may be challenged - but won't be banned.
 
Rusty said:
Being relatively new to both forums, I'm particularly curious what the LOL is in context to (and if you'd prefer to respond with a PM versus here (or not respond at all, after all you don't have to) that would be fine).
LOL is in reference to some comments (about me in particular & MNL in general). All good - even if inaccurate at times.

Ofcourse, I've been reading gm-volt from almost the time Lyle started the blog. I know very well the general feeling of gm-volt people about Leaf etc. Ofcourse, then there is the high profile FUD GM tried to create w.r.t. BEV - that is what really soured a lot of us. Essentially it was like GM being traitors to the plug-in cause. If you see my older comments about some of Lyle's posts - you will see the same concerns.

Anyway, I like your initial comment about how people should behave on both forums - and agree with it.

Perhaps I'm dense, but I just don't understand the meaning and context of the quoted comment as relates to the thread title here.
I didn't quote anything - so if you are looking at a particular quote - you'd have to ask the person who quoted it.
 
scottf200 said:
Many consider it/use_it_as a 40 mile BEV because it works different than any other plug in with a ICE/GG (PIP, C-Max energi, etc which turn the ICE on underload or at < highway speeds).
We all get that - the important point Volters miss is that 60% of Americans already have multiple cars in the house. Ideally we replace all but one with BEVs - and that last one with a PHEV. That reduces gas usage to the max - without really compromising lifestyle. So, BEV & PHEV should complement each other. Ofcourse the first car to replace an ICE would be BEV - since we already have other ICE at home for long distance travel.

Repeated comments about people getting stuck on the road as we run out of energy are, to put it mildley, retarded. They don't help the plug-in cause at all. I'm afraid a lot of Volt people are really GM fans rather than wedded to the plug-in cause (that is why they are ok with Volt being a Halo vehicle that sells a lot of Cruzes). People here like BEV - and like Nissan's commitment to BEV.
 
evnow said:
scottf200 said:
P.S.S. EVNow is welcome, AFAIK, to come over and post on GM-Volt.
I have been "banned" for a long time in gm-volt.com. No explanations - just banned. I particularly don't like that kind of censorship.
AFAIK you are not banned. I actually have not been at GM-Volt that long ... you certainly have been at this *EV thing much longer than I so pardon my sometimes hyper-fascination and questions.

evnow said:
scottf200 said:
Many consider it/use_it_as a 40 mile BEV because it works different than any other plug in with a ICE/GG (PIP, C-Max energi, etc which turn the ICE on underload or at < highway speeds).
We all get that - the important point Volters miss is that 60% of Americans already have multiple cars in the house. Ideally we replace all but one with BEVs
I think it is enormously presumptive to see "we all" get that". My post are not to some of the very in-tune veterans like yourself. I am 100% sure that many (new comers and some veterans and lurkers from other car forums) do not understand the unique characteristic of the Volt that the the ICE does not come on under load and does not come on at a particular MPH (ie. ~62 in the new Plug-In-Prius/PIP, ~?? CMax-Energi). Peace out.
 
LEAFfan said:
And I routinely get 100 miles from an 80% charge with my LEAF, not even close to 70. That's for highway speeds around 70mph! I never even went that fast when I had my Honda GX. At 60mph on the freeway, I could easily go over 80 miles in my LEAF!

Just trying to clarify your assertion:

You can drive 100 miles, from an 80% charge, at 70mph ?

And 80 miles, from 80% charge, at 60mph ?
 
evnow said:
I have been "banned" for a long time in gm-volt.com. No explanations - just banned. I particularly don't like that kind of censorship.

I did check your status last night (one of the advantages of being a Stuper Moderator :- ), and if you had been in the past you are currently not. If that particular forum's software keeps track of account history I don't know where it does. So I don't know if and when your account statuses may have changed in the past. I did a quick read through of your previous postings on that forum, and certainly see no reason for it from them there.

IIRC there was some concern about Volt FUD being apparently posted elsewhere. Personally I don't agree with that form of proactive punitive banishment.

evnow in a another response said:
I know very well the general feeling of gm-volt people about Leaf etc. Ofcourse, then there is the high profile FUD GM tried to create w.r.t. BEV - that is what really soured a lot of us.

I won't argue that point, if it is to say that generally the Leaf is respected on that forum (with some exceptions). The point I'd like to make is that the two respective forums at this point have nothing to do with Nissan or GM per se (granting that there are sub-forums for those sorts of discussions). The forums are now mostly populated and "owned" by drivers and fans of the respective cars.

There is certainly a lot of hatred for GM out there, for a variety of reasons. But at this point I believe the respective forums are now more about the cars and their owners, not the companies that created them (GM has its own forum for that, for which I have no purpose - does Nissan have the same?). I believe it's counter-productive to the EV revolution/evolution for us to snipe at each other's cars just because of how we feel about each other's car's manufacturers.
 
I will say that I was one of the <100% that did NOT know you could drive a Volt without using gas.
That is, use the whole performance envelope without starting the engine.

To this day, most people that I discuss the two cars with don't realize this either.
It's a weird gap in GM's marketing, probably because of how they emphasize their gas engine.


I've also met quite a few BEV enthusiasts that would buy a Volt, if it was anyone but GM making it. You can blame it on a certain movie, or the long memory of EV geeks.
 
I think the point is that yes, the Volt and Leaf are different. So why are some like Scotty calling them both BEV's (just like GM wants to)?

It's not hard to see why GM would like people to "believe" the Volt is an Electric car that goes hundreds of miles on a charge. That would be amazing... if it were true. But this deliberate and repeated mis-informing of the public is very dangerous to the development of real BEV's that really do go hundreds of miles on electric power. I think no one has a problem with the Volt as long as the public knows they are getting a Plug-In Hybrid instead of a BEV. These are VERY different technologies and lead in VERY different directions. When you vote with your wallet to buy and support a manufacturer you are also supporting the direction they have chosen. There is nothing wrong with this but delaying the burning of a gallon of gas each day does not make a car a BEV. Calling it the same technology is irresponsible, dishonest and devisive.
 
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