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DaveEV
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:27 pm

TomT wrote:Alas, when I went to the Michelins, there was no real improvement in steering feel. Turn in, handling, ride and braking yes, but the on-center and steering feel was just as numb and uncommunicative as with the OEM Crap-o-matics.
Yeah, but that's probably because the MXV4s are crap tires, IMO. ;)

Had some on my last car (Subaru WRX) and they sucked - same size as the LEAF. Way too much tread-depth, but that's how they get a 620 something treadwear rating. Had stock Bridgestock RE92s before that which were better, but not by much.

Best tires I had on the Subaru were RE070s. Way too noisy, harsh ride and reduced fuel economy, though.

Any summer tire should be a good improvement over all-seasons if you're looking for improved steering feel and never drive in the snow.

The Pirelli Cinturato P7 that TRONZ mentioned look like a good choice, the GoodYear EfficientGrip and Michelin Primacy HP also look interesting in LRR tires. Lots of non-LRR summer tires available in stock size to try, too.

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TomT
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:58 pm

Nope, it is 90 percent because the Leaf has crappy steering... All of the non-steering-related inputs were decidedly better with the Michelins than with the Ecopias... However, the best tires on the planet are not going to improve the Leaf's steering deficiencies, unfortunately... The Leaf steering reminds me of the Detroit luxo-barges of the 60s and 70s; way over-boosted and devoid of anything even approaching road feedback...

I honestly don't know why that had to make it so bad since something as simple as a tweak to the boost algorithm would produce a significant improvement. I've driven other inexpensive cars with EPS that had very nice feel in comparison...
drees wrote:
TomT wrote:Alas, when I went to the Michelins, there was no real improvement in steering feel. Turn in, handling, ride and braking yes, but the on-center and steering feel was just as numb and uncommunicative as with the OEM Crap-o-matics.
Yeah, but that's probably because the MXV4s are crap tires, IMO. ;)
Last edited by TomT on Tue May 01, 2012 4:28 am, edited 2 times in total.
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
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CWO4Mann
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Mon Apr 30, 2012 7:49 pm

smkettner wrote:To me it is just a point A to point B car not a sports car.
I like it as is. Well unless possibly significantly more range could be obtained by reducing the assist.

I totally agree. If you want steering feedback to the nth degree, buy a Porsche (no, I won't sell you mine). Electric steering does have the capability of feedback but that comes with a high price. It's very similar to "fly by wire" in an aircraft, where we don't have stainless steel stranded wire cable with turnbuckles looping over pulley and anti-jack points to the control surfaces.

My experiences with my Leaf are OK, I have a feel for the steering and can't complain about it, but then again, I am not driving it in performance runs up and down the San Diego Freeway avoiding gang-bangers, snipers and washing machines tossed over the bridges. Up and down Franklin Pike and maybe a sharp left at the Donut Den in Green Hills as an after-thought at 0700 hours to pick up a few glazed, is about a tough as it gets for me.

Just sayin'

Dave, who has actually dodged a clothes dryer one time on the Anacostia Freeway in the District of Columbia, them young 'uns were just having some fun, that's all ...
Ira est potens et pertinax.
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jkirkebo
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Tue May 01, 2012 1:44 am

ebill3 wrote:
mkjayakumar wrote:I actually like the way the steering feels both at low and high speeds.. !
Man, when I now drive my wife's SUV, it reminds me of steering an Army 6X6 back in the early 50's.

I like the LEAF's light steering.
Mee too. And my wife positively loves the Leaf steering. I will never be able to get her to go back to a car with heavy steering again. So here's hoping for light steering in the Model S ;)

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aqn
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Tue May 01, 2012 10:26 am

smkettner wrote:To me it is just a point A to point B car not a sports car.
This is why we need a "Motorsports" forum and not just a "Mods" forum: there are those who like the LEAF the way it is. They don't need to hear about tires' performance, steering performance, suspension mods etc. Conversely, I'd rather not see "the LEAf is not a sports car" remarks every time those topics come up.
CWO4Mann wrote:I totally agree. If you want steering feedback to the nth degree, buy a Porsche (no, I won't sell you mine). Electric steering does have the capability of feedback but that comes with a high price. It's very similar to "fly by wire" in an aircraft, where we don't have stainless steel stranded wire cable with turnbuckles looping over pulley and anti-jack points to the control surfaces.
Just to be clear, in case anybody got the wrong impression: the LEAF does not have steer-by-wire. There is a direct connection between the LEAF's steering wheel and the front wheels. Said steering is assisted by a electric motor via a reduction gear on the steering column, hence "electrically assisted".
Anna Nguyen

CWO4Mann
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Tue May 01, 2012 11:21 am

aqn wrote:
smkettner wrote:To me it is just a point A to point B car not a sports car.
This is why we need a "Motorsports" forum and not just a "Mods" forum: there are those who like the LEAF the way it is. They don't need to hear about tires' performance, steering performance, suspension mods etc. Conversely, I'd rather not see "the LEAf is not a sports car" remarks every time those topics come up.
CWO4Mann wrote:I totally agree. If you want steering feedback to the nth degree, buy a Porsche (no, I won't sell you mine). Electric steering does have the capability of feedback but that comes with a high price. It's very similar to "fly by wire" in an aircraft, where we don't have stainless steel stranded wire cable with turnbuckles looping over pulley and anti-jack points to the control surfaces.
Just to be clear, in case anybody got the wrong impression: the LEAF does not have steer-by-wire. There is a direct connection between the LEAF's steering wheel and the front wheels. Said steering is assisted by a electric motor via a reduction gear on the steering column, hence "electrically assisted".

Glad you clarified that Andy. Thanks!

Dave
Ira est potens et pertinax.
Study History - Know the Future
CWO4 US Army (Ret.)
N4CVX; ex-VP2EHF; ex-DA1BB; ex-KR6DEM
2012 SL Glacier Pearl VIN: 1567 Delivered 12-11-2011
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RedLeader
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Wed May 02, 2012 2:50 pm

aqn wrote:... This is why we need a "Motorsports" forum and not just a "Mods" forum: there are those who like the LEAF the way it is. They don't need to hear about tires' performance, steering performance, suspension mods etc. Conversely, I'd rather not see "the LEAf is not a sports car" remarks every time those topics come up....
A very strong +1 from me.

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TomT
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Wed May 02, 2012 3:10 pm

I'm not aware of any regular production street car that has pure steer by wire. I suspect that the product liability lawyers would never allow it.
aqn wrote:Just to be clear, in case anybody got the wrong impression: the LEAF does not have steer-by-wire. There is a direct connection between the LEAF's steering wheel and the front wheels[/url]. Said steering is assisted by a electric motor via a reduction gear on the steering column, hence "electrically assisted".
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
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GRA
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Wed May 02, 2012 3:22 pm

TomT wrote:I'm not aware of any regular production street car that has pure steer by wire. I suspect that the product liability lawyers would never allow it.
aqn wrote:Just to be clear, in case anybody got the wrong impression: the LEAF does not have steer-by-wire. There is a direct connection between the LEAF's steering wheel and the front wheels[/url]. Said steering is assisted by a electric motor via a reduction gear on the steering column, hence "electrically assisted".
I'm not sure that is any better from a liability perspective. There was an article in a recent Aviation Week (aka "AvLeak") concerning the ability to insert malware through the electronic sensors of various U.S. combat and combat support a/c. As an unclassified demonstration of this, a group of researchers managed to remotely insert a virus into a car with many electronic controls, enabling them to lock the doors, disable the windows and control the steering, brakes and accelerator. Shades of Stuxnet!
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

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Herm
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Re: Improve the steering feel

Wed May 02, 2012 3:37 pm

What happens if you pull the fuse on the electric steering assist?

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