SageBrush
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 10:28 am

smkettner wrote:
SageBrush wrote:
smkettner wrote:Affordable? So what has been the rate increase so far? 20% 50%?
.
Ignore oil-y's nonsense. PNM makes it very clear on its bill that the sourced clean energy is 20% cheaper than the mix of fossils. And that is true even before we account for the benefits of reduced pollution.
Yes. As they say the proof is in the pudding.
Until there is a rate increase proposed there is really nothing to talk about.
In fact, the PNM IRP (which is remarkably similar to the NM legislation) outlines SAVINGS from the transition to clean energy.
As if avoiding the worst of AGW is not reason enough.
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:00 pm

Most of what is being written is quite polite enough. A few posts, though, are unnecessarily snarky. A good argument, with good supporting data, doesn't need that. In fact, a bad attitude can undermine a great argument...
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SageBrush
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:11 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:Most of what is being written is quite polite enough. A few posts, though, are unnecessarily snarky. A good argument, with good supporting data, doesn't need that. In fact, a bad attitude can undermine a great argument...
How about politely written BS ?

Pick your poison.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:17 pm

SageBrush wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:Most of what is being written is quite polite enough. A few posts, though, are unnecessarily snarky. A good argument, with good supporting data, doesn't need that. In fact, a bad attitude can undermine a great argument...
How about politely written BS ?

Pick your poison.
Politely written BS is allowed, mainly because it isn't always intentional. I suggest the user filter for that. Click on the user's name, and then "add foe."
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:32 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
SageBrush wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:Most of what is being written is quite polite enough. A few posts, though, are unnecessarily snarky. A good argument, with good supporting data, doesn't need that. In fact, a bad attitude can undermine a great argument...
How about politely written BS ?

Pick your poison.
Politely written BS is allowed, mainly because it isn't always intentional. I suggest the user filter for that. Click on the user's name, and then "add foe."
I don't answer for the joy of responding to a BS'er, but so that others know, or at least might consider, that it is BS. I realize that a polite, referenced, fully explained rebuttal in 6th grade English is the best possible rejoinder but the internet is flooded with Trumpers and wack-a-mole is doomed to failure.

I think that WetEV probably has the best approach (that I intend to emulate): politely demand references to back up the opinions and statements or call them out as BS.
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:01 pm

I think that WetEV probably has the best approach (that I intend to emulate): politely demand references to back up the opinions and statements or call them out as BS.
That's fine, with emphasis on "politely." ;)
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WetEV
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:10 pm

WetEV wrote:
Oilpan4 wrote:
WetEV wrote:
Source.
Or just admit you were BS'ing.
My source is I can see the Roosevelt wind farm from my house. At least 3 our of 4 mornings at sun up most of to none the wind turbines are not turning at all.
How are they producing power at sun up when they aren't moving?
That graph doesn't count wind turbines that are in shutdown mode as "capacity".
Most of them go into shutdown mode at night.
I was looking at actual power generation.
Not bean counter capacity factor number fluffing.
Notice that your observation doesn't even support what you claimed above. Sunrise isn't the same thing as night.

3 days looking out the window once a day at one location in the USA isn't data. Three days of wind power generation from California:

04/14/2019 to 04/16/2019

http://www.caiso.com/TodaysOutlook/Pages/supply.aspx

Scroll down to the renewables graph. Select only wind. Change the date to the above three dates.

04/17/2019

Shows the wind falling off after sunrise, then a brief peak in evening, then quiet.

80% power is feasible, but probably will take until 2040 to get there with reasonable costs. 100% isn't feasible at a reasonable cost yet.
Going to back up your words, or eat them?
Last edited by WetEV on Fri Apr 19, 2019 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
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Oilpan4
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Fri Apr 19, 2019 8:54 am

I figured a lot of this renewable energy stuff would be paid for by the states 1.2 billion dollar surplus. Nope.

Trujillo, D-Santa Fe, said “We already spent the surplus,” to reporters on Thursday.

They probably could have nearly doubled the states wind capacity with that much money, if it can be done for closer to $1 per watt. Typically price being between $1 and $2 per watt.

http://nmpoliticalreport.com/2019/03/14 ... increases/

If any thing this demonstrates how infrequent wind power is. If it averages 50% utilization and clearly the wind does not blow late at night or early morning rather often then how is wind supposed to cover base load reliably?
This is one of the renewable traps, relying on averages and assuming that all will be well.

I will admit I don't blindly rely on green washed, 3rd or 4th hand information like everyone else.
"THE ABOVE POST CONTAINS MISLEADING AND INACCURATE INFORMATION. PLEASE CONSIDER IT OPINION, NOT FACT". -someone who I offended and is unable to produce the facts in question.

SageBrush
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Fri Apr 19, 2019 10:19 am

Oilpan4 wrote: If it averages 50% utilization and clearly the wind does not blow late at night or early morning
Would you like to support your statements with data ?
I will admit I don't blindly rely on green washed, 3rd or 4th hand information like everyone else.
No ... you think you are an expert based on a couple mornings of a few seconds observation of a few windmills near your home.

Look at the graph below. Once again, this is the *entire* ERCOT wind system.
If you think this data is green washed, or 3rd or 4rth hand information, try to prove it. The raw data file from ERCOT is linked above in this thread. Feel free to analyze it yourself, it only takes a minute.

When does the wind stop blowing ?
When is the nadir ?
Is there more wind at night or during the day ?

Image
Last edited by SageBrush on Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:52 am, edited 5 times in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/18: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/18: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
09/20: 54.3 Ahr; 38k miles
-----
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jlv
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Re: Well new mexico governor decided to make electricity unaffordable

Fri Apr 19, 2019 10:25 am

Oilpan4 wrote:http://nmpoliticalreport.com/2019/03/14 ... increases/

If any thing this demonstrates how infrequent wind power is.
Did you post the wrong link? That doesn't discuss wind power at all.
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