ahoti
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:57 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Oct 2019

Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:14 pm

Hi, would it be possible to replace my 2012 worn out battery cells with ones from say a 2015-2017 model? I'm talking about opening the battery and replacing the cells only, since I understand replacing the entire battery wouldn't readily be possible.

Thank you!

ahoti
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:57 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Oct 2019

Re: Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:16 pm

Since nobody bothered to reply... I'll reply myself. I don't know much, but here's my experience.

My leaf is a 2012, has about 73k mi and battery was at 58% per LeafSpy or 7 bars. Last winter I'd get around 30mi with heat on and 40mi without. It just wasn't enough. I initially wanted to purchase a battery from a wrecked Leaf, something newer and hopefully in a better state. I looked around, but was kind of apprehensive to go Copart-ing and in the end bought a battery which happened to be from a similar 2012 Leaf (which was wrecked and being parted out), but with 11 bars and 35k mi. Ya, some risk there too and the price ($2450 with shipping) wasn't a steal for sure, but hey...

I jacked up my car and pulled the battery out. I read somewhere that the VCM and BMS will not like each other since they don't know each other very well, so I opened up both batteries and swapped the BMSes. So then I had the same car obviously, with the "newer" battery but the original BMS.

I wasn't sure what to expect, but the car worked perfectly. It displayed the old stats which I kind of expected, hey how would it know better, but thought a charge or two should learn it. Unfortunately it required much more time and patience. Now after around 1000mi LeafSpy reports about 75%. The funny thing is the range didn't go up immediately but slowly as well. It was a very painful patience as each charge would bring sometimes just .15% more...

Well, now I can go about 70mi and I'm still hoping the battery to reach around 80% or slightly more (for 11 bars). I was hoping to see the bars go up too, but so far they're comfortable at 7. I think they'll find the nudge to move up sometime in the far future, but at least for now I can drive a little farther.

There you go. Find yourself a used better battery and it's a simple couple hour job to swap them and you'll enjoy a few more miles range ;)

powersurge
Posts: 1743
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:24 am
Delivery Date: 06 Dec 2014
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:21 am

wow.... Thank you for telling us this..

I have always thought that a person who is slow and neat can carefully swap parts and make modifications that will work...

I have always had people laugh that it could not be done, and I slowly planned and came up with different ways of doing it. And it worked...

The issue is to be able to have your original car in parts and off the road for a few weeks while you experiment with the fix... I would not have that time. I need the car running most of the time.

growsontrees
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun May 31, 2020 3:36 am
Delivery Date: 31 Jul 2018
Leaf Number: 000931

Re: Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Sun May 31, 2020 3:59 am

I, too, have recently joined the ranks of swappleshooters. Here's what I did. I had an original 2011 battery with 58% SoH. It was painful to see that 8th bar disappear. I found BatteryHookup online that was selling removed LEAF batteries with 60-70% SoH packs. They sent me two packs by mistake, so it only cost me $2k for two. I proceeded to swap each pack into my car and drive them (even in angry turtle mode) and use LEAFSpy to gauge the relative health of each cell as they discharged. There is a trick in "angry turtle mode" (P3102 error due to unpaired pack) where you can get the car to go fast and use up to 40kW. Mashing the throttle and holding it in one position will temporarily allow you to drive well above 28mph, but only for one minute at a time. Then you have to return to a stop, mash again and go. It works pretty good in city traffic with lots of stoplights. Once I had rated all the cells in all three packs, *orig, swap1 and swap2, I proceeded to figure out what cells would go into my "Franken-battery".
After two iterations, yes, two complete tear-downs and rebuilds with cells swapped around to produce the highest amp-hour rating, I got the Franken-pack working with the original LBC.
Here's the rub. I am also waiting patiently for the increase in range and maybe get a bar or two back. I'm glad to hear the LBC will slowly learn range. I guess getting bars back is not so important as range increase. My SoH has increased over the past five charge cycles from 53.8% to 54.10%. It's slow, but knowing someone else is able to see the LBC learning curve gives me hope.
I think I read somewhere else here that a historical reset to 12 bars is the fastest way to reteach your LBC. But that will cost $ unless you have Consult III+ and "the card".

coleafrado

Re: Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Mon Jun 01, 2020 2:51 pm

growsontrees wrote:
Sun May 31, 2020 3:59 am
I, too, have recently joined the ranks of swappleshooters. Here's what I did. I had an original 2011 battery with 58% SoH. It was painful to see that 8th bar disappear. I found BatteryHookup online that was selling removed LEAF batteries with 60-70% SoH packs. They sent me two packs by mistake, so it only cost me $2k for two. I proceeded to swap each pack into my car and drive them (even in angry turtle mode) and use LEAFSpy to gauge the relative health of each cell as they discharged. There is a trick in "angry turtle mode" (P3102 error due to unpaired pack) where you can get the car to go fast and use up to 40kW. Mashing the throttle and holding it in one position will temporarily allow you to drive well above 28mph, but only for one minute at a time. Then you have to return to a stop, mash again and go. It works pretty good in city traffic with lots of stoplights. Once I had rated all the cells in all three packs, *orig, swap1 and swap2, I proceeded to figure out what cells would go into my "Franken-battery".
After two iterations, yes, two complete tear-downs and rebuilds with cells swapped around to produce the highest amp-hour rating, I got the Franken-pack working with the original LBC.
Here's the rub. I am also waiting patiently for the increase in range and maybe get a bar or two back. I'm glad to hear the LBC will slowly learn range. I guess getting bars back is not so important as range increase. My SoH has increased over the past five charge cycles from 53.8% to 54.10%. It's slow, but knowing someone else is able to see the LBC learning curve gives me hope.
I think I read somewhere else here that a historical reset to 12 bars is the fastest way to reteach your LBC. But that will cost $ unless you have Consult III+ and "the card".
You can also use a CAN bridge to modify the capacity bars arbitrarily (and also fix the pairing bug). But you're not likely to get above 10 bars "equivalent" capacity with your frankenbattery.

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Dala
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Re: Are the Leaf newer cells compatible with older ones?

Tue Jun 02, 2020 4:33 am



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