DougWantsALeaf
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:06 pm

As a silver lining for this group, guessing Leaf sales will then continue to at least 2023 then, hopefully longer.
2019 S Plus (93.86% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (93.35% SOH) Both Silver
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Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
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webeleafowners
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:51 am

DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:06 pm
As a silver lining for this group, guessing Leaf sales will then continue to at least 2023 then, hopefully longer.
They are still the go to here for a reasonable priced longer range commuter and occasional road trip. Batteries don’t get affected much by heat here. And Chademo is widely available and continues to be built out. Hope they continue to make improvements and keep the name plate around. We wouldn’t hesitate to buy another.
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danrjones
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Mon Jun 07, 2021 12:28 pm

OrientExpress wrote:
Sat Jun 05, 2021 9:45 am

A combination of the Covid and supplier shutdowns, along with a reevaluation of the Ariya's feature sets compared to the current competition and internal Nissan issues is the cause of this schedule.
Reevaluation? Does that mean Nissan saw Hyundai and Kia coming with superior tech and wanted to delay to bring theirs up to compete? If so, what changes are being made? I would think changing to 800v at this point in development would be... HARD.

I already put $100 down on the Ionic 5. I'm not certain it will be the one, because the price may end up being too high. The first edition of the corresponding Kia EV6 is MSRP 58k. That is WAY too high for me, if the Ionic 5 ends up being about the same, I'll have to pass. It may depend on what features are with what trim level.
Last edited by danrjones on Mon Jun 07, 2021 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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alozzy
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:16 pm

@danrjones This article's author seems to think the base price for the Ioniq 5 will be $40k USD:

https://topelectricsuv.com/news/hyundai ... re-orders/
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OrientExpress
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 7:56 am

danrjones wrote:
Mon Jun 07, 2021 12:28 pm
Reevaluation? Does that mean Nissan saw Hyundai and Kia coming with superior tech and wanted to delay to bring theirs up to compete? If so, what changes are being made? I would think changing to 800v at this point in development would be... HARD.
The BEV market competition has continued to evolve since the Ariya product specs were developed. This, along with the pandemic and supplier constraints gave Nissan the opportunity to make sure that they had a vehicle that was price/feature competitive. There are some edge-case capabilities, like the 800v charging systems that won't make it into the car, but other things might.

Then there is the refresh of the Generation 2 LEAF that is causing angst at Nissan as well.
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danrjones
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 8:05 am

alozzy wrote:
Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:16 pm
@danrjones This article's author seems to think the base price for the Ioniq 5 will be $40k USD:

https://topelectricsuv.com/news/hyundai ... re-orders/
One could hope. I really would like to keep it down around that number before credits. I'm guessing the dealers will not be open to any discounts off MSRP. Looking at their webpage and the trims, I could live with the bottom trim, except I want full LED headlights, as I have come to expect base model headlights to simply suck, and its a big safety issue to me. Those are currently in the middle trim. Worse, the top trim seems to have BSM. But they call it "Blind Spot View Monitor" which could mean basic BSM is in a lower trim, and only the camera version is in the top trim. I'm good with the standard BSM and without the camera.

I do want the RWD for the range, so that might help the cost.
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danrjones
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 8:07 am

OrientExpress wrote:
Tue Jun 08, 2021 7:56 am
danrjones wrote:
Mon Jun 07, 2021 12:28 pm
Reevaluation? Does that mean Nissan saw Hyundai and Kia coming with superior tech and wanted to delay to bring theirs up to compete? If so, what changes are being made? I would think changing to 800v at this point in development would be... HARD.
The BEV market competition has continued to evolve since the Ariya product specs were developed. This, along with the pandemic and supplier constraints gave Nissan the opportunity to make sure that they had a vehicle that was price/feature competitive. There are some edge-case capabilities, like the 800v charging systems that won't make it into the car, but other things might.

Then there is the refresh of the Generation 2 LEAF that is causing angst at Nissan as well.
I'd love to know what Nissan plans to do with the Leaf.

The Ariya still might have some advantages, it was suppose to have a bigger battery - 90 kWh?

Deciding between range and charging speed is an interesting conversation. At this moment I'd probably take range, if the range bump was significant, and the charging speed was still good.
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DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 2762
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 8:22 am

Where I struggle with the Ariya is that the base configuration has Leaf Range. AWD is nice, but by the time you add the larger battery, you will be in the mid 40s after federal rebate before tax. That's encroaching on MY and MachE territory. Cargo isnt better than the Leaf. It's going to be coming to market as Ionic, Lucid, and others have all moved on to 800 volt architecture. It's funny, but it's kind of like the Leaf Gen 2 all over again...barely catching up and nearly behind as they launch. I saw the Ionic has even copied the Ariya's moving center console.


For Ariya to be competitive, I think only launch the large battery, and make the AWD version 40K to start before other options. That puts you at potentially 30K +tax in some states for a near 300 mile EV, and would compare favorably to ID4 and MachE and even some MY audience. Good luck though..it will likely please priced closed to 50K with all the goodies.
2019 S Plus (93.86% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (93.35% SOH) Both Silver
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019 with 11 bars
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh

SageBrush
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 9:33 am

danrjones wrote:
Tue Jun 08, 2021 8:07 am
Deciding between range and charging speed is an interesting conversation.
When has that ever been a consumer choice ?
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SageBrush
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Re: Nissan Ariya to be announced for the JDM July 15, 2020

Tue Jun 08, 2021 9:43 am

OrientExpress wrote:
Tue Jun 08, 2021 7:56 am
This, along with the pandemic and supplier constraints gave Nissan the opportunity to make sure that they had a vehicle that was price/feature competitive.
Market-speak translated: Nissan realized the Ariya was gong to be a flop: Too little for too high a cost compared to its competitors. I imagine that is mostly ID.4, but perhaps Model Y as well.

The solution is probably to put the Aria in a different market segment. Higher or lower ? Higher and they are definitely butting heads with Tesla; lower and it is unclear if a market exists, not to mention competing with the LEAF.

The other issue Nissan has to face now is the spectre of losing the federal tax credit sooner than they planned due to the delays in the Ariya roll-out. That must have wrecked havoc in their R&D amortization tables, and I imagine is pushing them upscale.
Last edited by SageBrush on Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/18: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/18: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
09/20: 54.3 Ahr; 38k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

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