danrjones
Posts: 385
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:11 pm

Because it is now on Kia's website and you can build and price it. The top trim with the one package came out at MSRP 45k last night for me. Or close to that.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

danrjones
Posts: 385
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kw Leaf!

Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:19 pm

cwerdna wrote:
danrjones wrote:I'm honestly not a big GM fan.
I am not either. 3/3 of previous GM vehicles in our family (it wasn't my $ nor my decision to buy them back then) weren't so good in terms of reliability.

I'm just hoping that the money saved w/a Bolt when I got it ends up being worth it vs. a pricier Leaf Plus (wan't shipping at the time I bought my Bolt) w/no battery thermal management, no % SoC limiter, and AESC's checkered history when it comes to degradation vs. LG Chem's good rep (unfortunately, we don't know on the variant used in the Bolt). At least Bolt has a decent reliability rating in Consumer Reports, so far.

But, apply all your applicable incentives (and only $3750 Federal tax credit) to the Bolt prices I pointed and look at the EPA range ratings: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do ... 6&id=41277. Yes, Bolt's interior quality is lousy and the front seats aren't particularly comfortable. And, there's no equivalent of ProPilot Assist or adaptive cruise control.

I'm waiting for my air district rebate in the mail. Have to have it upfront. Once I get that I'm going to see what kind of deals I can get on a 2019 or 2018 leaf sv. If I can get a great deal I might buy it and then trade it in next year, and do it all over again. I know the resale is lousy but with 14k or more rebates and tax breaks it could work. If i can't get the price I would want then I'll get a 2015 from carmax for a few years. I like the idea if the niro ev but it looks like limited availability this year. That also means dealers may gouge consumers. 45k is crazy. You can get a model 3 plus for that. Although I like the SUV/ hatchback designs better. Model y is around the corner...
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

GRA
Posts: 11174
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:51 pm

danrjones wrote:Because it is now on Kia's website and you can build and price it. The top trim with the one package came out at MSRP 45k last night for me. Or close to that.
Thanks, I see it. Amazingly, none of the usual EV sites (GCC, IEVS, GCR, ABG) I monitor seem to have noticed it yet. I'd be interested in the EX (base $38.5k MSRP + $995 dest. = $39,495), not the Premium ($44k + $995 dest.). Compare that to the smaller Kona, starting at $36,450 + $1,045 dest. = $37,495. Both are a lot less expensive than the Model 3 SR+, when you include the fed. tax credit. the one thing that bugs me about the Niro is the lack of bright colors offered - three of the four cars I've owned have been silver metallic, and while it's a very long-lasting color that reflects heat well, I'd been hoping for a change to something less low-key. But the lack of AWD is the main reason I'd decide against it. The Soul should be available in brighter colors.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

danrjones
Posts: 385
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:26 pm

GRA wrote:
danrjones wrote:Because it is now on Kia's website and you can build and price it. The top trim with the one package came out at MSRP 45k last night for me. Or close to that.
Thanks, I see it. Amazingly, none of the usual EV sites (GCC, IEVS, GCR, ABG) I monitor seem to have noticed it yet. I'd be interested in the EX (base $38.5k MSRP + $995 dest. = $39,495), not the Premium ($44k + $995 dest.). Compare that to the smaller Kona, starting at $36,450 + $1,045 dest. = $37,495. Both are a lot less expensive than the Model 3 SR+, when you include the fed. tax credit. the one thing that bugs me about the Niro is the lack of bright colors offered - three of the four cars I've owned have been silver metallic, and while it's a very long-lasting color that reflects heat well, I'd been hoping for a change to something less low-key. But the lack of AWD is the main reason I'd decide against it. The Soul should be available in brighter colors.
I didn't really have time to compare the two trims much but I did notice that you had to add a package to the top trim just to get led lights.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

cwerdna
Posts: 9801
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kw Leaf!

Sun Apr 28, 2019 8:28 pm

danrjones wrote: Model y is around the corner...
Knowing Tesla's track record, I wouldn't expect them to be on time, at least w/lower equipment levels.

Remember the below about the Model 3 from https://web.archive.org/web/20170731003 ... ations-faq:
Which future options will be made available to order, and when?
We are planning to introduce the following options in the coming months:

Fall 2017: White interior option, standard configuration (non-Premium Upgrades)
November 2017: Standard Battery, $35,000 car
Spring 2018: Dual Motor All-Wheel Drive

Additional options will become available over time.

Will there still be a $35,000 Model 3 option?
Yes. Our first production Model 3 vehicles are preconfigured to ensure a smooth production ramp so that we can deliver more cars to more customers at a faster pace. The beginning configuration is a Long Range Battery with rear-wheel drive and premium upgrades, starting at $49,000. These vehicles come with three options for customization: wheel size, exterior color and Autopilot features.

Additional configurations, including the Model 3 with standard equipment for $35,000, will become available as production ramps, which we expect to be in November 2017.

We are shipping our first cars to employees now and expect to begin shipping the Long Range Battery configuration to customers in late October. The Standard Battery configuration will be available very soon thereafter.
Tesla quietly removed most references to the SR (https://www.sfgate.com/technology/busin ... 627667.php) Then, suddenly, people were finally able to "order" SR (opened late Feb 2019: https://cleantechnica.com/2019/02/28/te ... e-model-3/) and nobody received their car. Then suddenly we got https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-vehicle-lineup, announced April 11, 2019. The coming weekend, folks who wanted an SR got one (software limited SR+). SR is off menu right now. I suspect it'll go away as a choice.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

danrjones
Posts: 385
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Mon Apr 29, 2019 8:27 am

Oh I'm not buying a TESLA, not right now anyway, for various reasons -> but more competition is a good thing.

If you removed the fact that the niro ev is an ev, and someone told you you could buy a compact crossover kia for 45k, you'd think they were insane. Same with the Leaf plus for that matter. I'm not sure if its true cost because that's how expensive the batteries really are, or gouging is going on, but that's too much for me even with tax credits. A 45k kia would be 45k plus 10% for taxes and dmv, then minus 14k in rebates, and I'm still way over 30k.

But with a bigger and bigger section coming, prices should come down. So I guess I'm still on my plan to see if I can negotiate a good deal on a standard SV, and if not, carmax a used one.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

GRA
Posts: 11174
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:58 pm

danrjones wrote:I didn't really have time to compare the two trims much but I did notice that you had to add a package to the top trim just to get led lights.
LED lights are way down my list of priorities. Getting cloth seats rather than leather ranks much higher. Most of the options that come with the top trim are things I'd rather not have or can easily do without to save $5,500, e.g. the premium sound system has zero value to me now that I'm so deaf that even with my hearing aids, the Beatles sound like Alvin and the Chipmunks! LED lights are a pretty minor energy savings compared to the heat pump, and may or may not provide better lighting - in any case, the aftermarket awaits to solve that issue, probably less expensively. Don't need or want power seats either, etc.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

danrjones
Posts: 385
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:13 pm

I've noticed that most of the factory LED headlights ARE superior compared to their downgraded halogens. My Subaru outback has superb led headlights. For me its not the "cool" factor rather I actually like to see! When we first got our outback with LED headlights I realized just how piss poor the headlights on most cars actually are. I then changed my truck to HID, so I am familiar with after market and upgrading. If I get a 2015 SV I'll have to do that as well. But it just seems like a modern car for over 30k (or 44k!!) should have GOOD headlights.

If you want to see just how poor headlights are, IIHS rates them on a lot of new cars, starting a year or two ago. For whatever reason they never did the LEAF. They have rated the niro and niro plugin for kia, and sure enough the HIDs on the Niro got a good rating while the halogen got a poor rating. The LEDs on the niro plugin also got a poor rating, but that's due to glare. Which might simply mean the headlights are factory adjusted too high. But the point is, headlights are a big safety issue that I now take very seriously. YMMV


https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

GRA
Posts: 11174
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: California SCE customers can get $14,500 incentives total on any new 40 kwh Leaf!

Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:31 pm

danrjones wrote:I've noticed that most of the factory LED headlights ARE superior compared to their downgraded halogens. My Subaru outback has superb led headlights. For me its not the "cool" factor rather I actually like to see! When we first got our outback with LED headlights I realized just how piss poor the headlights on most cars actually are. I then changed my truck to HID, so I am familiar with after market and upgrading. If I get a 2015 SV I'll have to do that as well. But it just seems like a modern car for over 30k (or 44k!!) should have GOOD headlights.

If you want to see just how poor headlights are, IIHS rates them on a lot of new cars, starting a year or two ago. For whatever reason they never did the LEAF. They have rated the niro and niro plugin for kia, and sure enough the HIDs on the Niro got a good rating while the halogen got a poor rating. The LEDs on the niro plugin also got a poor rating, but that's due to glare. Which might simply mean the headlights are factory adjusted too high. But the point is, headlights are a big safety issue that I now take very seriously. YMMV


https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings
I take it seriously too and look at IIHS ratings, but as you've just noted, simply trusting that LED will be better ain't necessarily so. With the change to lots of low drag, stylish, headlights, average light effectiveness seems to have become almost an afterthought, including from many companies that usually emphasize safety features (as reflected in their high crash test results). Course, I can still remember the age of OEM sealed beams and the switch to halogens.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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