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JeremyW
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:11 pm

OrientExpress wrote:No one would sell you a brand new pack for all the tea in China
Ok. I'd like to purchase 48 new modules, please. :roll:
Former 2012 SL leasee 6/23/12 - 9/23/15
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Now driving Spark EV and Model 3.

JRP3
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:56 pm

Ingineer wrote:
gaswalla wrote:Not sure where that rumor of a $5k battery came from, but it certainly is not true.
It's not a rumor, I have direct knowledge it's accurate. The price for a complete pack (dealer's MSRP) is currently around $5000. I expect it to cost less when they are rolling out of Smyrna.

-Phil
That is unheard of pack level pricing, heck it's unheard of cell level pricing for EV modules. Why am I buying cells from China if I can get a complete pack from Nissan for half the price?

jspearman
Posts: 244
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Delivery Date: 20 Aug 2011
Leaf Number: 5954
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:50 pm

JRP3 wrote:
Ingineer wrote:
gaswalla wrote:Not sure where that rumor of a $5k battery came from, but it certainly is not true.
It's not a rumor, I have direct knowledge it's accurate. The price for a complete pack (dealer's MSRP) is currently around $5000. I expect it to cost less when they are rolling out of Smyrna.

-Phil
That is unheard of pack level pricing, heck it's unheard of cell level pricing for EV modules. Why am I buying cells from China if I can get a complete pack from Nissan for half the price?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that comes out to around $200 per kW as a retail price? I remember this article that said we might be in that range by 2016, so perhaps Nissan has beat the rest of the EV world to a magic cost. Maybe with a core exchange it gets us to $200 per kW.

The big question, though, is if Nissan has scored such a solid win with battery cost, why not add a TMS and be done with this rapid degradation issue? If battery costs truly hit this number, then I'm taking my solar system off the grid.

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TonyWilliams
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:59 pm

jspearman wrote:...that comes out to around $200 per kW as a retail price? I remember this article that said we might be in that range by 2016, so perhaps Nissan has beat the rest of the EV world to a magic cost. Maybe with a core exchange it gets us to $200 per kW.
This just seems too much like the pixie dust we all believed with 100 mile range and 24 kWh usable battery capacity.

Herm
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:48 am

I am sure Nissan is selling below cost at $5k, the publicity would be intolerable otherwise with the recent AZ heat issues.. perhaps not too far below cost if they can get some reuse out of the spent cells.

EdmondLeaf
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 3:16 am

http://www.willisautocampus.com/exotic- ... 6a5bcc.htm
2121 NW 100th Street Des Moines, IA 50325
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Internet Price $20,907
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TickTock
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:22 am

Herm wrote:I am sure Nissan is selling below cost at $5k, the publicity would be intolerable otherwise with the recent AZ heat issues.. perhaps not too far below cost if they can get some reuse out of the spent cells.
I know I would like to keep my core. With two of those - even degraded - I could go off-grid. The series voltage is already almost perfectly matched to my solar DC voltage.

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 8:39 am

the $5,000 cost is exchange price. iow, take out degraded pack, replace with new pack.

so how about $300 plus for new pack? after all a degraded LEAF pack at 70% still has more power than a brand new Volt pack. so what is the Volt pack worth?

now, some have stated (i think...i kinda lost track) that the $5,000 price is non exchange price. that would be nice but i dont think we are quite there yet.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 412 mi, 99.72% SOH
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OrientExpress
Posts: 1503
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Delivery Date: 10 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2331
Location: San Jose, Ca

Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:57 am

JRP3 wrote:That is unheard of pack level pricing, heck it's unheard of cell level pricing for EV modules. Why am I buying cells from China if I can get a complete pack from Nissan for half the price?
The primary reason remanufactured assemblies are cheaper than new ones is that the majority of its piece parts are ones that are recycled and refurbished. It is very easy to see how a new assembly that might have a retail price of $15K (which translates into COGS of about $10K) would have a remanufactured retail price of $5K. That would put the actual labor and replaced parts COGS in that assembly to be about $2.5K. The rest of the piece has already been made and amortized from its original use. Lastly all refurbished parts always require a core exchange. Without the core, the part would be significantly more expensive.

Initially I think that pack replacements will only be available through Nissan, but as more and more cars are on the road, that means more and more will be in wrecks where they will be deemed "totaled", so that 3rd party re-manufacturers will have access to cores that can be upgraded and sold on the open market. That is how the "hot rod" packs will start to appear.

One last note, when I refer to COGS, that is Cost Of Goods Sold, which is what a manufacturer establishes as the cost of a component or final assembly. COGS is lower that wholesale, and may actually be lower than the material costs for that item because of the internal accounting methods that the manufacturer and/or its supplier uses to derive the COGS.
Last edited by OrientExpress on Sat Sep 29, 2012 10:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
2018 LEAF SL
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2014 LEAF SV
Ocean Blue
Delivery May 23 2014
50,000+ miles - all 12 bars - Same range as new - No warranty issues ever!

thankyouOB
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Re: Wholesale value of the 2011 Leaf @Auction

Sat Sep 29, 2012 10:06 am

i am not a fan of non-branded battery replacements. i did that once for one of my apple laptops. it was 40% cheaper and lasted about a year before it started to warp.

never had that with the Apple products.
i would assume branded car batteries would be an even more critical part to get OEM.
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