Posts: 6388
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:43 pm
Location: San Antonio

Re: Electrical charging - measured results, 120v vs. 240v

Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:23 am

garygid wrote:In spite of AndyH's best design, and confidence in Nissan, we do not yet KNOW what they ACTUALLY implemented, or why Nissan has made seemingly contradictory statements about how to use THEIR battery.
To which 'contradictory' statements to you refer?
garygid wrote:Comparisons to other similar battery chemistries or conjecture as to what Nissan MIGHT or SHOULD have done get us closer to understanding, and are a GREAT education for what is possible, but does not tell us WHEN or HOW Nissan attempts to "protect" and "equalize" their cells.
As a retired military analyst and lithium importer/vendor, I strongly disagree with both parts of this statement. There is enough information available from various manufacturers with which we can bound performance to a fairly high confidence level. And the same for management systems, methods, and practices. There are only so many ways to manage a multi-cell pack and only a limited number of companies transferring those strategies to silicon.
garygid wrote:Further, we do not know how the cells WILL AGE, and Nissan does not yet display enough information to help us extend the useful life.
While I agree that we don't know exactly to three decimal places how these particular cells will age, it is clear that Nissan's systems give us more than enough information to track pack and cell health and thus learn how to minimize the inevitable decay. And you can certainly bet that Nissan knows to a high confidence level how the pack will perform - they've been at this for ~17 years, afterall - and THEY are the ones putting big money and reputation on the line to bring us the Leaf!

Nothing is obvious to the uninformed - and being informed is possible but voluntary.
garygid wrote:It appears that the estimated capacity has to drop 17% (to 83%) BEFORE there is any displayed indication (one bar capacity loss). By then, it might be too late to change usage patterns to "preserve" the battery better.
There are mandatory pack health and wellness visits with a dealership, and there is ample information available from the car's diagnostics systems - with better precision than the capacity display.

I know you're not really trying to suggest that the battery is bad because you don't like the bar graph?!
garygid wrote:Basically, we have a LOT of guesses, and LITTLE really helpful information, for example: frequent QC should be avoided, but it is OK to do QC occasionally, even 3 or 4 times a day.
Yes? And this is a problem why?
garygid wrote:But, this is probably the way it will be for early adopters. We will learn a lot more as we use, observe, and measure. The reports of experiences and observations will help guide the rest of us. Keep up the good work.
Whew! With THIS I can agree!
"The stupid become extinct."-Bill Mollison
2018 Outlander PHEV
2015 smart Electric Drive (lease ended Feb, 2018)

Posts: 6388
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:43 pm
Location: San Antonio

Re: Electrical charging - measured results, 120v vs. 240v

Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:57 pm

Smidge204 wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:this requires creating analogies they are familiar in an attempt to give them some understanding. not always an easy job
Someone need an analogy? :lol:

"It's like a guardrail at the Grand Canyon, right? You got that cliff there, and nobody wants anyone to fall off the cliff. So they put a guardrail up. Now they know the very edge ain't the best place for that guardrail, so they set it back a little bit for extra safety. When you charge your EV to 80%, you're basically staying even further back from that guardrail - because there is already a safety margin beyond the guardrail you can't get to anyway. That's fine, because it's just safety on top of safety, but it's okay to go right up to the guardrail if you want to."

Congratulaitons Smidge - I dub thee the official MyNissanLeaf Analogy Czar! Nice Job!

User avatar
Gold Member
Posts: 12465
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 29 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000855
Location: Laguna Hills, Orange Co, CA

Re: Electrical charging - measured results, 120v vs. 240v

Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:06 am

If that was the correct analogy, it would be nice (a LOT mor useful) to be able to go 90% up to the guard rail, or even 95%, because from 80% back we cannot see very much!
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius, now for sale
2011 LEAF, sold in 2015
2018 Tesla Model 3
2014 Tesla S, Model 3 in 2019
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
To Sell: X-treme 5000Li EV motorcycle

Posts: 14389
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Electrical charging - measured results, 120v vs. 240v

Thu Jan 20, 2011 6:42 am

not a good analogy. went to grand canyon and they have glass platform that extends about 100 feet PAST the edge. there is a guard rail on it but there is very little room on the outside of it.

to be honest with ya, i dont remember, but trust me; if you were there you would not be looking at the railing either
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 2640.9 mi, 99.37% SOH
My Blog;" onclick=";return false;

Return to “EVSE / Charging Equipment and Networks”