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Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 6:21 pm
by EVDRIVER
AndyH wrote:
muus wrote:Please Nissan if you are reading this, move the charger to the front (where it should have been in the first place) and get rid of the charger hump! It's a Win-Win-Win situation. (save $$$ - simpler install - more trunk space)
The charger is only 1/2 of the hump - the brake controller and it's back-up battery is on the other 1/2.

Those brake back up units can be made vey small. See the one on the Prius.

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:14 pm
by TomT
Sure, unless they planned well ahead for this, it may need the wiring to the charger and battery upgraded to handle the doubled amperage, as well as a number of other supporting components replaced with uprated ones. It may not be as simple as just dropping in a new charger itself and updating the firmware. If such is the case, it may not be financially feasible to make the swap.


Smidge204 wrote:
mogur wrote:However, I'm still not convinced that this is even technically possible, regardless.
Would you like to expand on that point? The battery itself is more than capable of handling that charge rate, as are most of the system in the vehicle. The on-board charger is a standalone unit, so I see no reason why it could not be replaced?
=Smidge=

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:26 am
by Herm
You guys need to sweeten the pot.. How much would pay extra for the 6.6kw charger option?.. note that the competition may be vaporware for probably a year or two so no need to make it free. Nissan probably has a stock of 3.3kw units that they need to get rid off.

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:10 am
by Smidge204
mogur wrote:Sure, unless they planned well ahead for this, it may need the wiring to the charger and battery upgraded to handle the doubled amperage, as well as a number of other supporting components replaced with uprated ones. It may not be as simple as just dropping in a new charger itself and updating the firmware. If such is the case, it may not be financially feasible to make the swap.
The battery would not need to be altered in any way, since it is already capable of charge and discharge rates well above 6.6kW (80kW max discharge, at least 30kW charge via quick-charge/regen)

If the cables leading from the charge port to the charger aren't up to snuff, it should be a relatively simple matter to swap them out. I don't think this is likely since the J1772 connector is rated 80 Amps, so the wiring should be at least that. It's possible it isn't of course - but it should be a quick fix since it's a single run from port to charger.

The upgrade can almost certainly be done in under an hour if the cable needs to be swapped, half an hour if it's just the charger. Well within "while you wait" duration IMHO.
=Smidge=

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:20 am
by LEAFer
Smidge204 wrote:If the cables leading from the charge port to the charger aren't up to snuff, it should be a relatively simple matter to swap them out. I don't think this is likely since the J1772 connector is rated 80 Amps, ...
Where does it say that ?

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:34 am
by Smidge204
LEAFer wrote:
Smidge204 wrote:If the cables leading from the charge port to the charger aren't up to snuff, it should be a relatively simple matter to swap them out. I don't think this is likely since the J1772 connector is rated 80 Amps, ...
Where does it say that ?
I'm not an SAE member so forgive me for not citing the J1772 standard directly. It is an inference I made based on past research.

In short, the J1772 connector is the Yazaki design which is good up to 80A at 240V AC. Current individual connectors are UL listed at 30A but the connector design is for 80A and supposedly the J1772 standard itself allows for that much.

But even at 30A/240V you're good for 6.6kW.
=Smidge=

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:47 am
by TimeHorse
Smidge204 wrote:Current individual connectors are UL listed at 30A but the connector design is for 80A and supposedly the J1772 standard itself allows for that much.
My J1772 is capable of 80A; it's a ClipperCreek CS-100, using the same hardware that charges the Tesla Roadster. Not that I'd be able to test it, but it's at least capable of such if an appropriate charger is installed.

Under the TOU rates proposed by Dominion Virginia Power, I estimate a mere $50 per year in savings with the 6.7kW charger on the LEAF. I certainly wouldn't argue it on the basis of ideal charging conditions since I told Nissan I'd pay up to $1000 for it (more, actually).

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:36 pm
by LEAFer
Smidge204 wrote:
LEAFer wrote:
Smidge204 wrote:If the cables leading from the charge port to the charger aren't up to snuff, it should be a relatively simple matter to swap them out. I don't think this is likely since the J1772 connector is rated 80 Amps, ...
Where does it say that ?
I'm not an SAE member so forgive me for not citing the J1772 standard directly. It is an inference I made based on past research.

In short, the J1772 connector is the Yazaki design which is good up to 80A at 240V AC. Current individual connectors are UL listed at 30A but the connector design is for 80A and supposedly the J1772 standard itself allows for that much.

But even at 30A/240V you're good for 6.6kW.
=Smidge=
Ok ... that may be true of the SAE standard for the plug. But I highly doubt the receptacle on the LEAF is rated to 80A. The UL listing (and by implication its rating) applies to the plug. I don't know what applies to the receptacle in the LEAF. I can only imagine that Nissan has had it properly tested, but who knows. Car's not here right now, so I can't check. I don't know if Nissan even installed a UL-certified receptacle or if it's so marked.

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:48 pm
by mwalsh
LEAFer wrote:I don't know if Nissan even installed a UL-certified receptacle or if it's so marked.

If it is, the markings aren't on the parts that are visible as installed. Maybe the back-side, but I'm not pulling mine out to check. ;)

Re: The Competition: 6.6kW Charging

Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:26 pm
by Smidge204
LEAFer wrote:Ok ... that may be true of the SAE standard for the plug. But I highly doubt the receptacle on the LEAF is rated to 80A.
I'm operating under the assumption that the plug and receptacle are both defined as part of the standard, and therefore would match in terms of requirements. It would make no sense at all to design a standard which allows a 80A plug and charging system to be plugged into a receptacle that can only handle 30A before melting. :|
=Smidge=