mitrals
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:03 am
Delivery Date: 15 Jun 2019
Location: Chicago IL

Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 8:53 am

I have 2 220 volt outlets in my garage and have 2 EVs (2018 Clarity Plug in and 2012 Leaf). When I got my garage wired I asked the electrician to run 2 separate 50 amp lines to future proof for 2 EVs. I currently use a GE wattstation for the Honda and charge the leaf on the 120 Volt. I just got a really good deal on a Chargepoint home hard wire which I bought.

I have 2 options, 1 is to hardwire the evse. For that I will have to unplug the receptacle and connect some kind of a whip conduit to the evse: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Southwire-3 ... 373118-_-N

Second option is to get a 50 amp plug with 6 or 8 gauge cable and connect it to the chargepoint: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Eaton-50-Am ... /206405351

Issue with option 2 is it covers the only 110 volt outlet in the garage due to the cable. Picture here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/toKbwdaR6JMXeKxr8

How hard will it be for me to open the box, cut the cables and then connect the whip conduit to the evse. That seems to be the best option. Electricians want $200 t move the receptacle 2 feet!
2012 Leaf SL. 9 Bars 50K miles - 06/15/2019 - Daily driver
2018 Honda Clarity Plug in Touring- Bought 04/26/19 - Daily driver

Previous electric cars:
2013 Leaf SV. Bought with 11 bars and 4K miles.
2013 Cmax Energi.
2013 Fusion Energi Titanium.

goldbrick
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 11:08 am

I would hard-wire the EVSE. It shouldn't be hard. If you don't feel comfortable doing this yourself you can have an electrician do it. I imagine it would still be $100 or so as that is probably the minimum amount they will charge for anything unless they are already there for another reason.

I would strongly recommend to get a permit and have the work inspected if you do it yourself. I assume you live in an area where a homeowner can do their own electrical work without being licensed but check first as this is not the case everywhere.

I think the first step would be to just remove the cover on the box at the floor to inspect the wiring. If there are 3 wires there (probably black/red/green) then it would be simple matter to cut the wires there, splice all three wires to the whip and connect the whip to the box. If there are 4 wires or 2 wires then that changes things. Since you mentioned a 3 prong plug I doubt there will be 4 wires in the conduit/box. There could be only 2 wires if the electrician used the metal conduit as the equipment ground conductor. At least I think there could be only 2 wires....codes vary by location and I'm not a licensed electrician. That's why you should pull a permit before doing the work.

It's also possible there is a 'pig-tail' wire inside the box to bond the green ground wire to the metal box/conduit. This would be required if the metal conduit doesn't connect directly to the another grounded conductor (usually the breaker box). And so on....

TL;DR the metal box/conduit has to be grounded. The wire splice has to be accessible inside the junction box. If you satisfy those 2 conditions and use appropriate wire (the 8AWG THHN/THWN wire in the whip you linked to should be OK) then hard-wiring should be fine. Be sure to secure the whip and not just leave it hanging loose. I don't know the exact requirements but if it is secured within 12" of each box and has no unsecured run longer than 4' you should be fine. Once again, I'd ask the inspector when you apply for the permit.

goldbrick
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 11:12 am

I just reread your post and now I wonder if you are planning to remove the cord from the EVSE itself? I would be more concerned about that end of the job than swapping the wiring from a receptacle to being hard-wired. Unless the EVSE was designed to have an option to be hard-wired I would leave it alone. The EVSE obviously needs to be grounded as well and unless there is hard-wire option built into it that could be problematic or impossible to correct.

Never mind....I re-read your post again and I see that it is a hard-wired unit. By all means I would hard-wire the EVSE then. Just be sure that the junction box is grounded and the whip is well secured. Everything else should be very straight forward.

mitrals
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:03 am
Delivery Date: 15 Jun 2019
Location: Chicago IL

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:28 pm

I apologize for the scattered brain post :).

1. The box at the bottom has 5 wires, 2 hots go to the first receptacle, and 2 to the other one. The fifth wire is a neutral that is split between the 2 receptacles and it is grounded to the box as well. This was done by the electrician. I can probably chop off the 2 wires that go to the receptacle at the box, buy a whip conduit and connect it to the evse and plug it to the wires in the box.
2. I already have the evse connected to a 6-50 nema plug that works ok but blocks my only 110 outlet.
2012 Leaf SL. 9 Bars 50K miles - 06/15/2019 - Daily driver
2018 Honda Clarity Plug in Touring- Bought 04/26/19 - Daily driver

Previous electric cars:
2013 Leaf SV. Bought with 11 bars and 4K miles.
2013 Cmax Energi.
2013 Fusion Energi Titanium.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 13471
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:39 pm

That fifth wire should be a bare ground wire, not a Neutral. They both go to the same "place" in the breaker panel but the Neutral isn't, AFAIK, supposed to be used as a ground in an EVSE installation. I'm also concerned about them splitting the ground. If both EVSEs are used at once, that means the ground for each becomes undersized.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

goldbrick
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:54 pm

I agree with Lefty. The 5th wire is a ground not a neutral. Neutral should be white or gray and ground should be green ( or possibly bare, but that is unusual in conduit).

With this wiring both receptacles should be 3-prong (2 hots and a ground). If either of them has 4 prongs you have a problem.

You should be able to splice the 2 hots and ground going to the new EVSE in the box and hard-wire them with the whip. You can leave the existing ground wire to the other receptacle alone and then connect all the grounds together and to the box inside the box.

I think. As I said, I'd check with your local inspector but I think that should be good.

goldbrick
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 2:43 pm

And just curious....are the 4 hot wires = 8 AWG using 50A breakers? With 4 conductors in the conduit I would think they should be de-rated so they should either have 40A breakers or be 6 AWG.

smkettner
Posts: 7380
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:13 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2014
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Hardwire or Plug in EVSE

Fri Aug 23, 2019 3:54 pm

So you had a electrician "future proof" you with 2x 50 amp and just a single 120v outlet????
No one saw the 50 amp in use would block the 120v?????

OK so redo the work or hard wire it already.
1 bar lost at 21,451 miles, 16 months.
2 bar lost at 35,339 miles, 25 months.
LEAF traded at 45,400 miles for a RAV4-EV
RAV4 traded in for I-Pace Dec 2018

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