Fenix Power - Took money and but never delivered

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Who knows? At least as of yesterday, I still saw no evidence of refunds nor a single install happening.

It would suck to be someone w/a very degraded Leaf who has paid their over $2K and has been wondering for months what's going on w/neither an install nor a refund. There's at least one person in that boat on that FB group.
 
There's still nothing going on w/them and just more chatter amongst disgruntled people waiting for their refunds or batteries. One guy gave up and got a replacement car.

I never poked around much on their site by noticed a claim at https://fenix.systems/invest:
Fenix Power is looking to have conversations with accredited investors about how they can be a part of this revolution, beginning with the LEAF, and fixed storage markets, and expanding into any market where the costly battery and battery replacement is an obstacle. We have a newly revised business model with an interim battery solution that gets us to revenue within weeks of a capital injection rather than after years of R&D.
Hmm...
https://fenix.systems/local-installation says:
We have more than 60 prospective installation partners we’re evaluating and will be announcing official installation partners throughout 2020 as we expand to markets across North America.
https://fenix.systems/charging-3 says
Starting Early 2021, Fenix Power will unveil its next-generation electric vehicle charging stations and built-in charging solutions as a service. This network will comprise of fast charging stations, vast amenities, and next-level convenience features.

Our futuristic but familiar charging stations will debut in Late 2019 as final specifications are decided and finalized for the public. Our network starting in 2021 is shown below, numbers convey the amount in the area and not the specific location as these will vary. Please check back in late 2020 when we unveil our new charging solutions.
Hmmm...
 
So... they have abandoned developing their own battery, in favor of Jetsons-style futuristic fast-charging stations - with VAST amenities - to charge their refurbished (or probably just used) 24kwh Leaf batteries.
 
I don't know how long their plans about charging stations or whatever have been up. https://web.archive.org/web/20200512034106/https://fenix.systems/charging-3 is the oldest snapshot archive.org has. It's from May 2020.

I found this stuff from 2019:
https://www.torquenews.com/5477/fenix-power-and-chargeshare-make-game-changing-alliance-bev-batteries-and-public-charging-options
https://cleantechnica.com/2019/07/22/with-a-merger-fenix-power-now-plans-to-make-your-old-leaf-more-like-a-tesla/

https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=26597&p=552177&hilit=chargeshare#p552177 was post with that keyword from 2019.

Another stillborn project?

edit: I was looking around for stuff about ChargeShare and found this tweet: https://twitter.com/charge_share/status/1091035125708664834?s=20.
In part it says:
Jan 31, 2019
We are excited to introduce Grant Posell, ChargeShare’s COO & Co-Founder.
Aha.
cwerdna said:
At https://www.facebook.com/groups/FenixPowerCoForum/permalink/695432934438813/?comment_id=709653773016729, he claims the ex-employees embezzled nearly $30K and pins the blame on their ex-COO Grant Posell for stealing $.
Hmmm...
 
The people on the FB group believing what they've been told is very sad.
The last I’d heard in early January was that Big Battery had sold the batteries Fenix had purchased to other people/companies and only had worse batteries available instead. Fenix was getting a refund from BB, and planning to purchase salvaged batteries and refurb them. That’s when they stopped communicating with me, and I gave up.
I doubt very much that "Fenix had purchased" any batteries, or else they'd have been shipped.
 
jlv said:
The people on the FB group believing what they've been told is very sad.
Do they have a better alternative ?
It's not as if they are are getting their money back, regardless.
 
Signs are looking even worse now. A guy at https://www.facebook.com/groups/FenixPowerCoForum/permalink/762354161080023/ alleges:
Ok here is a new one from this Liar and thief and his company. After getting a zero response from Fenix Power / Fenix Power since the beginning (YEP tried every form of communication and nothing) of the whole debacle on the CPO battery I filed a dispute with my CC company. Fenix Power / Fenix Power
had the brass ones to tell my CC company they delivered the product and did the service (install). And of course, showed nothing to back up this BS... Which of course they didn't deliver a product (CPO Battery) or did an install of the invisible battery.
There is a special place in Hell for People like this.
The ball is still in action I will keep you informed
(I had to alter the e's after some of the Fenix occurrences to remove the accent so that MNL software wouldn't barf.)

Someone else at https://www.facebook.com/groups/FenixPowerCoForum/permalink/762531591062280/?comment_id=762560434392729&reply_comment_id=762800127702093 at first succeeded w/a chargeback but then it got reversed after about 3 weeks with "Reason was it was too long, though on the phone they stated they could go back as far as 7 years."

Them carrying on w/their web site, no signs of installs, not refunding people and radio silence is becoming increasingly disturbing.
 
Back in the beginning of this thread I asked "What and where is the THING you are trying to sell me?". Apparently there never was one.
 
This is exactly why I was extremely hesitant to ever mention or point people to Fenix. I don't think I did and hope I didn't.
 
https://fenix.systems/ now leads to a 404 error page. It begins with:
404
The site you were looking for couldn't be found.

This domain is successfully pointed at WP Engine, but is not configured for an account on our platform.

If you just signed up, we're still likely creating your account.
Did you add this domain to your install?
Did you point DNS to the correct IP address or CNAME?

If you've completed the steps above, or need more help, please contact us and we can help get your site up and running in no time.
https://web.archive.org/web/20210120222338/https://fenix.systems/ was the latest snapshot.

Snapshot of now dead site at https://archive.is/wAtH5. https://archive.is/fenix.systems may help a bit although it's likely more old pages are stored at https://archive.org/web/.
 
cwerdna said:
https://fenix.systems/ now leads to a 404 error page. It begins with:
404
The site you were looking for couldn't be found.

This domain is successfully pointed at WP Engine, but is not configured for an account on our platform.

If you just signed up, we're still likely creating your account.
Did you add this domain to your install?
Did you point DNS to the correct IP address or CNAME?

If you've completed the steps above, or need more help, please contact us and we can help get your site up and running in no time.
https://web.archive.org/web/20210120222338/https://fenix.systems/ was the latest snapshot.

Snapshot of now dead site at https://archive.is/wAtH5. https://archive.is/fenix.systems may help a bit although it's likely more old pages are stored at https://archive.org/web/.

I'm going to keep my eyes open for any new company they create and run their scam again. Knowing these guys, my bet is they are working on creating

https://phoenix.systems
 
While digging around, I found this recent reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/leaf/comments/mr4rs4/fenix_power_are_the_done/. Guy claimed to have supplied his '11 Leaf as a test mule and claims to have recently gotten it back. He's dreaming if he thinks he can sell his 5 bar loser '11 for $5500. Maybe he can to a sucker...
 
cwerdna said:
While digging around, I found this recent reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/leaf/comments/mr4rs4/fenix_power_are_the_done/. Guy claimed to have supplied his '11 Leaf as a test mule and claims to have recently gotten it back. He's dreaming if he thinks he can sell his 5 bar loser '11 for $5500. Maybe he can to a sucker...
The Fenix angle here is that they actually returned the LEAF to its owner. The story makes me think that John B. is not an outright scammer, just a *****really**** lousy business person with an inflated, unrealistic self-image and with questionable ethics.

And unfortunately, this sad story followed the same lines as other sad stories: the most vulnerable (read: poor) are the most susceptible to being duped and losing money. They ignore the danger signs and jump on what they hope is a deal (too good to be true.)
 
I'm still rooting for them, but they have appraently thrown in the towel. I still think many of the people who shouted fraud are annoying whiners (along with all those people who are pissed because the Leaf ain't a Tesla!). It's just another manifestation of the "grievance culture" in America we have seen so much of lately.

I don't think the Fenix guys are frauds or criminals or con artists -- I do think they failed to launch their venture at this time for many reasons, both self-inflicted errors and circumstances beyond their control, which all of us are well-aware of so no need to go through it again. The American entrepreneurial landscape is littered with guys who failed, and that's OK. I think the various posts that impugned their integrity and vision were unfair and mean-spirited and yet another example of our grievance-laden social mindset, for which FB is a fertile, and fetid, breeding ground.

That said, I'm also a realist and see the end now. I am also a retiree, with a long career in business, PR and politics so have seen more than my share of con artists as well as annoying whiners, so money is an issue. I filed a charge-back, and will put the money into buying a remanufactured battery locally here in So CA. And I will just shut up and go about doing it without fanfare. I understand it could take months to actually get the money back, but I'm in no hurry (and not concerned because the credit card company protects the cardholder, fronts the refund and ultimately the vendor is on the hook).

I always believed you could get a bear with honey, so have always been respectful and given them the benefit of the doubt. I did have a text exchange with John Bysinger right after filing for my refund and it was very cordial -- apparently, their new capital got gobbled up paying for all the chargebacks (he said it is in the tens of thousands).

I think that between all the refunds (they probably should never have taken pre-payments) and the inability to source their interim pre-owned battery installations after BigBattery dumped them pretty much killed them off for now.

In retrospect, as an outsider, I think they should have just focused on quietly developing their battery service program, forgotten about pre-owned batteries as an interim step, and gotten that perfected and ready before doing any kind of public launch. A big part of their problem was all the bad vibes from making promises they couldn't keep, although hidden from all of us are the technical challenges of developing and implementing the system they originally came up with.

As for the Leaf battery aftermarket, I predict that there will never be another national supplier, nor will Nissan do much more than sell their new inventory at top dollar. It will be left to the purview of local independent shops around the globe, and if you are lucky enough to live near one, great -- otherwise you are screwed. I also see this as a shrinking market that was never very large to begin with (there may be 250K pre-2017 Leafs in the world, and fewer owners willing to put any money into 8 -- 10 year old cars).

Again, I don't think they are crooks, just failed entrepreneurs with an idea that didn't make it due to their own mistakes and the nutty economic climate of 2020. I find all the conspiracy mongers out there to be petty and completely lacking in any understanding of how things sometimes work -- as they say "be kind because for most people life is a difficult challenge."
 
" their new capital got gobbled up paying for all the chargebacks (he said it is in the tens of thousands)."

well that is interesting....interesting that not one single person has chimed in getting theirs yet?
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
" their new capital got gobbled up paying for all the chargebacks (he said it is in the tens of thousands)."
well that is interesting....interesting that not one single person has chimed in getting theirs yet?

Yeah ... I don't buy that John B. line either. The hyperbole has always been strong with that guy; where it strays into outright lies is something of a grey zone.
Fenix did not return deposits directly, and they strung (stringed?) customers along long enough to be outside the chargeback window. That is what I was mostly referring to when I said that the Fenix principals have questionable ethics.
 
I think LarryKaplan had a well-thought-out post and good points but what gets me mad about this whole thing is the way they LIED about where in the process they were, stating things that were later proven outright untrue, lots of examples in this many page thread.
 
LarryKaplan said:
I filed a charge-back, and will put the money into buying a remanufactured battery locally here in So CA. And I will just shut up and go about doing it without fanfare. I understand it could take months to actually get the money back, but I'm in no hurry (and not concerned because the credit card company protects the cardholder, fronts the refund and ultimately the vendor is on the hook).
You posted a year ago that you placed a deposit. If that is true, then you don't have a clue how charge-backs work.

I have no idea what you are babbling about when you accuse Fenix depositors of engaging in 'grievance culture.' That sounds like a trumpism. We do know that deposits were placed, a long series of promises were made by Fenix, and Fenix failed to keep its promises. Stick to the facts, and stuff the label.

I was around when John B. first came to this forum with his pitch. I commented on the hyperbole, the unrealistic pie in the sky plans, and the tendency to bullshit. I said at the time that Fenix should offer escrowed deposits and buyers should only consider that arrangement. I'd say I was proven right. If you want to label me a Tesla troll go right ahead but I think it says a lot more about you than me.
 
SageBrush said:
...I was around when John B. first came to this forum with his pitch. I commented on the hyperbole, the unrealistic pie in the sky plans, and the tendency to bullshit. I said at the time that Fenix should offer escrowed deposits and buyers should only consider that arrangement. I'd say I was proven right. ...

I looked at that and you're right. You suggested holding deposits in escrow and he waxed rhapsodic about Blockchain as if that were somehow relevant. If I'm being charitable I'll say that he was in love with technology and the tech-startup business model, but hardware and managing human concerns and expectations got scant consideration. Another red flag in retrospect was his claim to have already personally funded "their operation" for 4 years before appearing on the forum. So that's like 6 years of "Where's the beef"?
 
Nubo said:
Another red flag in retrospect was his claim to have already personally funded "their operation" for 4 years before appearing on the forum. So that's like 6 years of "Where's the beef"?
That is an excellent example of his M.O.
I presume he meant that he paid or financed his college. He then warped that into something that could be misconstrued as meaning 4 years of LEAF R&D. So much of what he said was 99% BS and 1% a grain of truth.

I still cannot decide if it was premeditated manipulation or he is our version of Walter Mitty. Either way, he is FOS.

------
Oddly enough, I came across another version of much the same generic pitch as Fenix today.
I will not mention the company name to not give it publicity, but it is a start-up in the sustainable prefab housing segment. This idea holds great promise, and a lot of personal allure for me. Well, until I watched their webinar. Then I encountered techno-BS, unrealistic expectations, name dropping (ironically, mostly Tesla), and an investment bait that promised 15x returns in 5 years. No tech expertise or depth, just a group of salespeople. Sound familiar ?

It is a measure of just how much I wanted them to be real that I watched almost the entire webinar before muttering 'SCAM' under my breath and turned the show off. I roped my wife into watching it with me, but she started complaining about the pitch after 5 minutes so I went off to watch alone in peace. Now I have to admit that she caught on way before I did.
 
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