jspearman
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:53 pm

I'm guessing that Nissan means they will physically stand beside the Leaf and their owners. Each complaint will result in a technician being sent to the person's house, a photo taken with them, the technician, and the car. Then it's posted to Facebook for proof that they are truly standing beside their owners. Maybe Azdre will get a photo of their car at Casa Grande, with several Japanese engineers giving them the thumbs up. Escalated complaints will get a Mark Perry life-sized cutout they can place next to their cars, along with a battery-powered fan to cool themselves as they drive through Arizona heat with no air-conditioning in order to make it to work and back on one charge.

Thanks for standing by me, Nissan! I feel so much better now.

cwerdna
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response on Nissan's FB page (not Nissan Leaf's FB page)

Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:53 am

For those of you who don't follow the Nissan FB page, they posted at https://www.facebook.com/Nissan/posts/443432732375883" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We at Nissan are committed to our customers and our products. After concerns arose about battery capacity loss in Phoenix-area LEAFs, Nissan tested the vehicles and has concluded that loss is consistent with usage. Learn more about the tests and results - http://bit.ly/SjIULF" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Thanks to all of our LEAF Owners who have shared their feedback with us – your input has been invaluable.
The bit.ly link simply leads to http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 82#p229382" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (1st post of this theads).

The "loss is consistent with usage" wording is basically similar wording to what was in the latest open letter.

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Volusiano
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:44 am

mwalsh wrote:This was just received from Nissan. I will post a .pdf copy of the file I received once I can get it converted.

OPEN LETTER TO THE LEAF COMMUNITY
From Carla Bailo


Image

....We look forward to continuing our dialogue here in the MyNissanLEAF forum and within the Nissan LEAF community.

Best Regards,
Carla Bailo
Senior Vice President, Research & Development – Nissan Americas
What Nissan dialogue in the MyNissanLEAF forum is Carla talking about???

Has there been any Nissan LEAF representation on this MyNissanLEAF forum that I'm not aware of??? So far I thought it's been mostly the LEAF owners talking amongst themselves on this forum.

Ms Carla Bailo, if you really mean what you said above, please participate on the MyNissanLEAF forum yourself and help answer our questions. There are NUMEROUS legitimate questions that we'd like to ask you. I promise that the questions will be professional, courteous and civil. If any of them are not, you can refuse to answer them and everybody would respect that. We can ask the forum to set up a special Nissan Rep section for the Q&A, and have moderators monitor this special section to keep the dialogue on the up and up, professional and courteous.

If you don't really mean what you said above, then I wonder if you really mean any other things you said in the letter, like "We at Nissan stand by our product, and we also stand by our customers."

If you really stand by your customers, why don't you come to this forum, stand by us, and participate with us to "continue your dialogue here in the MyNissanLEAF forum" like you claim you already have been doing?

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mwalsh
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:32 am

Volusiano wrote:
What Nissan dialogue in the MyNissanLEAF forum is Carla talking about???

Has there been any Nissan LEAF representation on this MyNissanLEAF forum that I'm not aware of??? So far I thought it's been mostly the LEAF owners talking amongst themselves on this forum.

Ms Carla Bailo, if you really mean what you said above, please participate on the MyNissanLEAF forum yourself and help answer our questions. There are NUMEROUS legitimate questions that we'd like to ask you. I promise that the questions will be professional, courteous and civil. If any of them are not, you can refuse to answer them and everybody would respect that. We can ask the forum to set up a special Nissan Rep section for the Q&A, and have moderators monitor this special section to keep the dialogue on the up and up, professional and courteous.

If you don't really mean what you said above, then I wonder if you really mean any other things you said in the letter, like "We at Nissan stand by our product, and we also stand by our customers."

If you really stand by your customers, why don't you come to this forum, stand by us, and participate with us to "continue your dialogue here in the MyNissanLEAF forum" like you claim you already have been doing?

They really haven't, at least not since the very early days. And even then it was only someone from their outside PR firm. I've been asking in the very highest circles for someone to be a direct conduit between this forum and Nissan. Either someone from Nissan being active here, or someone from here being able to take concerns directly to Nissan.

Hopefully, though not exactly what I've been seeking, Chelsea's panel will be a step in that general direction.
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Herm
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Re: response on Nissan's FB page (not Nissan Leaf's FB page)

Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:38 am

cwerdna wrote:For those of you who don't follow the Nissan FB page, they posted at https://www.facebook.com/Nissan/posts/443432732375883" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We at Nissan are committed to our customers and our products. After concerns arose about battery capacity loss in Phoenix-area LEAFs, Nissan tested the vehicles and has concluded that loss is consistent with usage.
Thanks for that heads up.. I just posted a snarky comment.

downeykp
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:11 am

So I guess at this point, who is satisfied with Nissan's response? Additionally, is there anyone out there who would recommend a Leaf or any Nissan product to anyone? This is not standing by a customer!!
We went out on a limb and trusted Nissan and believed all of their BS. We paid a lot of money to try and help foster the real ev movement and this is the thanks we get. This really pis*es me off because I actually purchased this piece of Sh*t.
I have no choice. Something better from Nissan had better be coming.
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JPWhite
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:33 am

drees wrote:
gsleaf wrote:Ouch, I was hoping for a better response.
+1. It's just more of the same CYA gobblygook.
gsleaf wrote:
mwalsh wrote:We at Nissan stand by our product, and we also stand by our customers.
If they truly believe this they would have a better battery warranty. I LOVE my Leaf, but I can't recommend them anymore because of this issue.
I've thought this for a while now - but really Nissan's biggest failure here (if this is truly normal) is the complete lack of transparency in terms of what to expect in terms of actual range and long-term capacity loss.

All you need to do are these 3 things:

1. Produce an "ideal" speed/range chart that lets you know how fast/far you can travel on a single charge in a new car. All new cars should be able to match these numbers at a minimum. The data in NTB11-076a is not good enough, but it's a good start.
2. Provide guidelines on how capacity will be reduced over the warranty period based on where you live assuming typical usage (used as daily commuter, parked in sunny parking log, parked in garage, etc).
3. Provide guidelines on how tweaking usage habits may improve or reduce capacity loss over time. How does calendar life change when using 80% vs 100% charging? How does calendar life change when averaging 3.5 mi/kWh vs 4.5 mi/kWh?
These 3 'guidelines' you suggest should be part of the documentation with all new vehicle sales of the LEAF. The open letter specifies 76% for Phoenix based on actual vehicle data, so they should have vehicle data for all regions now, especially the launch states. I for one am very keen to know if Nashville is above or below global estimates and what to expect. This will help me decide on purchase or lease of the 2013 LEAF. I'll continue to take the govt incentives to pay for my first year depreciation and upgrade until the credits expire.
--
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http://jpwhitenissanleaf.com
2011 Blue SL-e, 132,400 Miles.
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Stoaty
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:15 am

I have updated the Wiki with the information from Nissan:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/index. ... nd_Actions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Feel free to offer suggestions, comments, additions, etc. or to edit the Wiki yourself.
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azdre
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:18 am

If Nissan were paying attention to my concerns, they would have known that range loss is it. As you've heard from me here, it doesn't matter how many kWhs you can shove in the battery, it's about how far you can drive the car. My range loss does not track with capacity loss. Maybe in July I had only lost 15% capacity, but the range my car could travel had dropped about 25%. This is an important question. With a 70-80% degradation, what is the expected impact on the EPA range?

I think the EPA should be involved in the discussion to think about modifying their test procedures to publish vehicle range on degraded packs. Also, they should include in their testing how far you can go before the instruments tell you to find a charge. The 73 mile estimate is to turtle, so about 10 of those miles are listed on the dash as '---'. Then, if 100% is really frowned upon, take another 20% off and you've got a car with a 49 mile range when new.

As of a week ago I could go to the Nissan page and indicate a 60 mile daily commute and it would tell me the LEAF is perfect for me. There are still stories being posted about salesmen in hot climates telling a buyer in Austin, not to worry, if the pack degrades, we just swap out a problem module and it's all better. Nissan continues to market to sell cars regardless of whether the car is right for the buyer.

How cool would it have been if Nissan could have reinvented the distribution channel? Build out one really cool dealer in the middle of the city, where you can see the car inside and out, where the salesman doesn't work on commission, where there are just a few enthusiastic, well-paid, well-informed people who can and will tell the full truth about the car.

derkraut
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:28 am

downeykp wrote:So I guess at this point, who is satisfied with Nissan's response? Additionally, is there anyone out there who would recommend a Leaf or any Nissan product to anyone? This is not standing by a customer!!
We went out on a limb and trusted Nissan and believed all of their BS. We paid a lot of money to try and help foster the real ev movement and this is the thanks we get. This really pis*es me off because I actually purchased this piece of Sh*t.
I have no choice. Something better from Nissan had better be coming.
Sorry, downeykp, but I disagree with your comment that the Leaf is a "piece of Sh*t :(
Derkraut
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