evchels
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:30 am

azdre wrote:How cool would it have been if Nissan could have reinvented the distribution channel? Build out one really cool dealer in the middle of the city, where you can see the car inside and out, where the salesman doesn't work on commission, where there are just a few enthusiastic, well-paid, well-informed people who can and will tell the full truth about the car.
Yup. Even without new or specialized dealers, this is one of the biggest areas of potential improvement, for any automaker in the EV world. And it's one I've always been passionate about, having worked in a retailer myself and then training and working with dozens of them. It's not a perfect system, but the knees we skinned then can be helpful now.

In the meantime, if anyone knows how to clone guys like Brendan and Paul... :)

EdmondLeaf
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:47 am

azdre wrote:How cool would it have been if Nissan could have reinvented the distribution channel? Build out one really cool dealer in the middle of the city, where you can see the car inside and out, where the salesman doesn't work on commission, where there are just a few enthusiastic, well-paid, well-informed people who can and will tell the full truth about the car.
I thought I was the one to help Nissan to sell/market Leaf in my area and I was ready to do that for free. In fact I helped local dealer to sell first two Leafs in my area. My enthusiasm was a bit diminished when my request for promo material was ignored, and further diminished when I requested more info on temperature effect on batteries. I understand that I was one of many Leaf owners, but for a long time I was the only one in my area. I still think Leaf is very cool car, but it is a victim of lack of communication between Nissan and owners, as well as, indifference of dealers that in some cases may know less about the Leaf ,than people that want to buy it.

downeykp
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:48 am

derkraut wrote:
downeykp wrote:So I guess at this point, who is satisfied with Nissan's response? Additionally, is there anyone out there who would recommend a Leaf or any Nissan product to anyone? This is not standing by a customer!!
We went out on a limb and trusted Nissan and believed all of their BS. We paid a lot of money to try and help foster the real ev movement and this is the thanks we get. This really pis*es me off because I actually purchased this piece of Sh*t.
I have no choice. Something better from Nissan had better be coming.
Sorry, downeykp, but I disagree with your comment that the Leaf is a "piece of Sh*t :(
Maybe piece of sh*t was the wrong word. My decision making at the time was sh*t. I bought into the hoopla of Nissan and what the cars capabilities were. Buying at the time seemed like a good idea. I buy and then drive into the ground. Leasing has never been good business sense.

I would agree that the Leaf is a neat car. But I do not feel like Nissan cares (and I do not have any range loss). Like many, I am hoping that Nissan comes clean and makes all of this right, but they are in cya mode now.
2011 Black Leaf SL+QC Vin. 1931
Res. 6-14-10 Order 1-25-11
EVSE: Mod'd Ver. 2 Nissan L1
Delivered 5-31-11

8 years 33000mi. 7 bars

39 Suniva panels 10.3kw with Enphase micro inverters my electricity cost $26 a month.

EdmondLeaf
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:53 am

evchels wrote:In the meantime, if anyone knows how to clone guys like Brendan and Paul... :)
There are many of them, I really want to help market Leaf in my area, but I had strong feeling that Nissan really did not need/want my help - look my previous post.

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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:03 am

azdre wrote:... it's about how far you can drive the car.
:shock: Quote of the month !
And the problem with the hot-area cars is ... they are a LOT worse than the milder climate cars.


An idea that came to me in the shower ( just a short while ago ;-) ) ... which I immediately dismissed, but then reconsidered.

@Chels: Get yourself one of the degraded LEAFs. Buy it, take over the lease, whatever. It must be made clear that you are NOT in Nissan's pocket and that Nissan made no contribution to your ownership of a LEAF. Now you have a strong position on the advisory board !

How about jspearman's LEAF ?

HTH. :)

Off to NPID in Folsom ...
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

spooka
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Re: response on Nissan's FB page (not Nissan Leaf's FB page)

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:06 am

Herm wrote:
cwerdna wrote:For those of you who don't follow the Nissan FB page, they posted at https://www.facebook.com/Nissan/posts/443432732375883" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We at Nissan are committed to our customers and our products. After concerns arose about battery capacity loss in Phoenix-area LEAFs, Nissan tested the vehicles and has concluded that loss is consistent with usage.
Thanks for that heads up.. I just posted a snarky comment.
My FB response...

"Loss is consistent with usage." My LEAF "usage" in Phoenix for 13 months was 13,500miles, 10% highway driving/90% city, zero quick charges (to that point) AND I STILL EXPERIENCED A "LOSS" OF 2 CAPACITY BARS. My annual Nissan battery pack test from last week stated (with my LEAF at 14,500 miles) that my scores were "very high and good" for my battery in all categories tested. I spoke with the Nissan LEAF service specialist at the dealership and asked what the percentage loss of capacity 2 bars equated to as a numerical value. He referred me to Nissan's EV support team. When I called them and asked, I was told by the EV rep I would not be able to get that number. Where is the commitment if you are withholding basic battery info from owners? Don't we have a right on a $38,000 purchase to have basic battery info? If "loss is consistent with usage", why have I lost the same amount of capacity bars at 13,500 miles while others have lost their second bar at 26,000 miles? Please explain your statement further Nissan. It makes no sense to this owner.


Happy National Plug In Day everyone. I'd be there but I'm currently in the middle of an 18 hour L1 charge right now with the goal of diminishing my capacity loss further...
Last edited by spooka on Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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TonyWilliams
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:09 am

Holy crap, I am busting a gut here. I want the life size MP cutout for my living room!!!

jspearman wrote:I'm guessing that Nissan means they will physically stand beside the Leaf and their owners. Each complaint will result in a technician being sent to the person's house, a photo taken with them, the technician, and the car. Then it's posted to Facebook for proof that they are truly standing beside their owners. Maybe Azdre will get a photo of their car at Casa Grande, with several Japanese engineers giving them the thumbs up. Escalated complaints will get a Mark Perry life-sized cutout they can place next to their cars, along with a battery-powered fan to cool themselves as they drive through Arizona heat with no air-conditioning in order to make it to work and back on one charge.

Thanks for standing by me, Nissan! I feel so much better now.

evchels
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:12 am

EdmondLeaf wrote:
evchels wrote:In the meantime, if anyone knows how to clone guys like Brendan and Paul... :)
There are many of them, I really want to help market Leaf in my area, but I had strong feeling that Nissan really did not need/want my help - look my previous post.
You're right. While my comment was in jest, I didn't mean to overlook that.

I will ask about marketing materials. Every owner should have a stack of brochures in his/her car, and know how to easily to get more.

I'd actually also like to see periodic "new owner clinics" held at the dealers (yes, hails from my Saturn roots!), though facilitated by current owners. When someone buys a brand new car, the last thing they want to hear - or will retain - is conservative driving tips required to get the most range. I'd tell new buyers to go enjoy their LEAF for a few weeks, and to expect X range in that time for that region (say, 70ish here in SoCal). Then invite them back to learn from experienced drivers all the little nuggets you guys have discovered over time about how to make that experience even better and how to connect with forums like these and orgs like PIA if they haven't already.

Similarly, I'd like more utilities or cities to host workshops for those thinking of getting an EV. SMUD has done a good one- they get local owners and dealers to bring out the different examples of available plug-ins, and give presentations about EVs, infrastructure, rates, etc. It's agnostic as to type of vehicle or charger, and gives people a centralized place to just come learn, and to talk to actual drivers.

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TonyWilliams
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:21 am

evchels wrote: Similarly, I'd like more utilities or cities to host workshops for those thinking of getting an EV. SMUD has done a good one- they get local owners and dealers to bring out the different examples of available plug-ins, and give presentations about EVs, infrastructure, rates, etc. It's agnostic as to type of vehicle or charger, and gives people a centralized place to just come learn, and to talk to actual drivers.

SDG&E does a great job in this area, and recently opened their "Innovation Center" with a million dollar (of my rate payer money) solar tracking and DC Chademo charger (PUC won't allow utilities to offer charges for public consumption).

I really like drees' suggestions. What would a proposed Nissan range chart look like, that would be different from mine? Simplified?

I love the dealer workshops, provided they are trained uniformly. I would put the real range data on the car's window in the dealer's lot. I would send "the Commision" to every dealership for a hands on frank discussion about LEAF and the greater future EV transition. Plenty of sales people are full of it (they rightly want to make a sale, and sometimes will say anything to do that) so including the data on the car cuts out the surprise in the back office (like the 80% charging thing, I learned about in finance).

And don't do it once and think everything will be ok. It needs periodic hammering, until EV's are mainstream.

Let's not continue with the LEAF is sh*t comments, and continue to offer Chelsea ideas to use moving forward (unless you want to see EV's fail).

EdmondLeaf
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Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:30 am

evchels wrote: When someone buys a brand new car, the last thing they want to hear - or will retain - is conservative driving tips required to get the most range. I'd tell new buyers to go enjoy their LEAF for a few weeks, and to expect X range in that time for that region (say, 70ish here in SoCal). Then invite them back to learn from experienced drivers all the little nuggets you guys have discovered over time about how to make that experience even better and how to connect with forums like these and orgs like PIA if they haven't already.
In case of Leaf I think great idea is to give prospective owner demonstrator car for extended drive/daily routine drive so it will fill comfortable with it, or same what GM is doing - "you do not like it, bring it back within first month". I also feel it is very important to give prospective owner upfront, honest and accurate info about car performance, range, and battery care and degradation/performance.

this is from "GRA"
When nurturing a new technology, under-promise and over-deliver rather than the opposite.

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