WetEV
Posts: 3514
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 8:25 am
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2014
Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:38 pm

It is interesting that Ford has a price for the battery pack for the Focus BEV. Currently is:

$19,525.24

http://www.fordparts.com/Commerce/PartD ... odel=Focus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Plus installation, of course. This is rather more than news reports would suggest that Ford's cost is.

Leads me to wonder how much negotiation room that there might be. You can buy a car for that... And the car can be thousands off MSRP. Will a battery pack also have the some room for discounting?

When is Nissan going to have a price for a battery pack? Even a high price is better than no price at all...
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red
2019 eTron Blue

User avatar
mwalsh
Posts: 9699
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 05 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 0213
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:44 pm

WetEV wrote:It is interesting that Ford has a price for the battery pack for the Focus BEV. Currently is:

$19,525.24

http://www.fordparts.com/Commerce/PartD ... odel=Focus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Whoa! That's been repriced...A LOT HIGHER. As of last month the same part was listed at $10,508.38! :shock:
2011 Blue Ocean SL with 85,000 miles
2015 pack on 12/30/15
Tinted windows
Bosch AGM 12v
Ecopia 422+ tires
L1 EVSE upgrade
FIAMM horns
Superbright LED lighting
2013 sun visors
LED shifter
Heated seats
GT-R map lamp lenses
Altima illuminated door switches

WetEV
Posts: 3514
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 8:25 am
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2014
Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:59 pm

mwalsh wrote:Whoa! That's been repriced...A LOT HIGHER. As of last month the same part was listed at $10,508.38! :shock:
Yes. Interesting, isn't it? The 10k price was very very good. Maybe good enough to get some interest from the home conversion market.

There have only been one (or so) Leafs that have hit EOL or 70% loss. As the Focus BEV has active pack cooling, and as there are both fewer of them and they have been out for less time, I really doubt if anyone will actually order this part for a Focus BEV for a few years...

Note that there is no core charge listed.
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red
2019 eTron Blue

User avatar
TonyWilliams
Posts: 10091
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:48 am
Location: San Diego
Contact: Website

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:01 pm

WetEV wrote: Note that there is no core charge listed.
That, no doubt, is "list" price for a new product (without a core). The "jobber" or "net" price for a dealer will be substantially less.

Typically, the rebuilt/remanufactured part will have a core charge. Not a new part.

User avatar
RegGuheert
Posts: 6419
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:12 am
Delivery Date: 16 Mar 2012
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Northern VA

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:56 pm

TonyWilliams wrote:Typically, the rebuilt/remanufactured part will have a core charge. Not a new part.
Nah, there should be a core charge. These manufacturers should be showing some responsibility to ensure that spent EV batteries are recycled into new batteries as completely as possible.
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K mi. on 041413; 20K mi. (55.7Ah) on 080714; 30K mi. (52.0Ah) on 123015; 40K mi. (49.8Ah) on 020817; 50K mi. (47.2Ah) on 120717; 60K mi. (43.66Ah) on 091918.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14610
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:19 pm

there would be no core charge because that price would be determined by the exchanged unit. the battery could conceivably be destroyed rendering it nearly worthless verses one that has run the course in its automotive life with 70% of its capacity and still worth several thousand
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 4411.3 mi, 96.88% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Volusiano
Posts: 1461
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:41 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:21 pm

leafkabob wrote:
Volusiano wrote:^^^ I can already guess what Nissan is going to do in Dubai without anybody having to ask Nissan anything. Nissan is going to roll out the LEAF in Dubai for sure. But they're not going to have TMS or a different battery chemistry. And they're still going to say it will go 100 miles. And they're still not going to warn anybody about temperature effect or anything like that, just like they didn't do it for AZ folks a year ago. In short, they're going to sell LEAFs in Dubai just like they're still selling LEAFs currently in AZ, no difference.

What they may do differently based on what they learn from AZ is perhaps they're going to reprogram the Dubai's LEAF firmware so that the first capacity bar will not disappear until after 30% capacity loss or more. :lol:
I disagree that they will sell leafs in Dubai just as they are in Phoenix. Mark Perry implied that Dubai would need TMS because its weather was so extreme. It appears that at least as of 2010 Nissan expected to sell the leaf in Dubai. The fact that they have not yet done so tells me that they do not have a solution for the battery capacity loss we are seeing in Phoenix.

On the other hand, if they have plans to bring the car to Dubai within the next year or so, that tells me that they have a solution. If so, then perhaps they will sell that version of the Leaf in Phoenix, Texas, etc.

The bottom line is that I think it is a question worth asking Jeff Kuhlman.
Leafkabob, I'm just being sarcastic here, that's all. I guess you're taking what Mark Perry said about doing it differently in Dubai seriously, while I took it with a grain of salt.

As you can see, somebody showed a temperature chart, and Phoenix is just as hot as Dubai. As far as I'm concerned, Mark Perry was just bs'ing to prove a point that Phoenix temperature is OK for the LEAF in his opinion, and he used Dubai as a (bad) reference to compare against Phoenix.

But the way I read between the lines, I think Nissan has no intention do have a different design with TMS for the LEAF just so they can sell in Dubai. Why would they? If they already have such a design for Dubai, why wouldn't they have used that as their "saving grace" and introduce that version to Phoenix now, after all this fiasco?

I guess we can find out whether you're right (Nissan is serious) or I'm right (Mark Perry was just bs'ing) if Jeff Kuhlman decides to answer your question after all.

User avatar
RegGuheert
Posts: 6419
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:12 am
Delivery Date: 16 Mar 2012
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Northern VA

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:34 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:there would be no core charge because that price would be determined by the exchanged unit. the battery could conceivably be destroyed rendering it nearly worthless verses one that has run the course in its automotive life with 70% of its capacity and still worth several thousand
Yeah, perhaps Ford's new, higher price includes the core charge and the buy back is negotiated separately. When a single part costs as much as a new car, I guess things could be a little different.
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K mi. on 041413; 20K mi. (55.7Ah) on 080714; 30K mi. (52.0Ah) on 123015; 40K mi. (49.8Ah) on 020817; 50K mi. (47.2Ah) on 120717; 60K mi. (43.66Ah) on 091918.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14610
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:47 pm

RegGuheert wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:there would be no core charge because that price would be determined by the exchanged unit. the battery could conceivably be destroyed rendering it nearly worthless verses one that has run the course in its automotive life with 70% of its capacity and still worth several thousand
Yeah, perhaps Ford's new, higher price includes the core charge and the buy back is negotiated separately. When a single part costs as much as a new car, I guess things could be a little different.
ya core charge is really a misleading term. it should be "pro-rated" exchange like with batteries and tires.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 4411.3 mi, 96.88% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Stoaty
Posts: 4490
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:50 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 3871
Location: West Los Angeles

Re: Open Letter from Nissan, September 22, 2012

Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:09 pm

Volusiano wrote:As you can see, somebody showed a temperature chart, and Phoenix is just as hot as Dubai. As far as I'm concerned, Mark Perry was just bs'ing to prove a point that Phoenix temperature is OK for the LEAF in his opinion, and he used Dubai as a (bad) reference to compare against Phoenix.
While I agree with the general thrust of your statement, it isn't strictly true since new data shows that Dubai has a battery aging factor about 20% higher than Phoenix:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/index. ... acity_Loss" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(scroll down to new table of battery aging factors)
2011 Leaf with 62,000 miles given to Nephew
2013 Tesla Model S85 with 251 miles rated range at full charge
Leaf Spy Manual
Battery Aging Model Spreadsheet

Return to “General / Main Owners Forum”