cwerdna
Posts: 10989
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledge

Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:37 am

I wish I could have a longer subject title. The title I wanted would be along the lines of "encounters w/other Leafers w/lack of knowledge about basics (e.g. GOM, Plugshare, capacity bars) and use on-board Carwings nav to find charging stations, etc."

I'll start. At http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 48#p349448" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, I posted about a Leafer who was missing capacity bars but didn't even know about them. He knew he'd lost range and but had no idea what those thin bars to the right meant, that he was missing 2 and what that meant.

Today, I had a very long conversation w/a older gentleman at the same location. We were both charging. My original intent was tell him about the free DC FC at nearby Premier Nissan that he could use (he had the CHAdeMO port) instead.

Anyhow, he was leasing an '11 SL before and now was leasing a '13 or '14 S. He knew he'd lost some range on his '11 but he also had no idea about the capacity bars. So, he didn't know how many he'd lost before trading in his '11.

He also didn't know about us calling the DTE the GOM aka guess-o-meter. He admitted he was technology challenged (just got a computer a year ago and isn't good w/it). He has no smartphone and apparently, when he had the '11 SL, he DID use Carwings on the car to find charging stations before. :o I told him about how crappy it was (out of date, no crowd sourced, don't know if station is usually down, etc.) and told him about Plugshare and how much better it was. He'd didn't know about mynissanleaf.com nor Plugshare. I did discuss the weaknesses of the GOM (how it can't predict the future) and gave him my copy of Tony's range chart (after explaining it to him). He was quite aware the GOM could be all over the place.

He said he used Carwings to find Nissan dealers to charge at, if he was out and about.

He also didn't know how to reset any of the indicators (miles/kWh, avg speed, count up timer and 3rd odo, etc.) of the b&w dash display. He knew how to cycle thru the displays but didn't know about pressing and holding the right button to reset. My main purpose was to discuss the miles/kwh gauge (he knew about that), the chart, and rule of thumb of having ~20 kWh usable of capacity on a new battery, to forget the GOM, etc.

Anyhow, post your street encounter Leafers who are surprisingly ignorant/unaware of "the basics".

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium (lease over)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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Wennfred
Posts: 383
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:47 am
Delivery Date: 24 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000660
Location: San Diego, CA (Imperial Beach)

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:04 am

There are those like us that like to know the in & outs of the Leaf, how she ticks etc... But then we have those that just want to drive it and have fun. I've parked next other leaf owners and told them about various APPs etc. Lots of Leaf owners don't know about forums like this one.


Fred
MFG: FEB 2011, Red Recd 08/10/13 @ 19600 Miles
"Eco Mode" only. 06/24/15 - 9 CB @ 43,000mi 100% charge: GIDS=199, S=95.37, C=46.76, H=50.51 Lost 1st CB at 26300, 2nd CB 34274 3rd CB 43000 miles

cwerdna
Posts: 10989
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:28 am

Here was another weird encounter (not mine) that I was fortunately able to find:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 04#p268304" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Back to my encounter earlier this evening, I did also tell him about a lot of other stuff that wasn't basic knowledge or that I wouldn't expect most folks to know about (e.g. gids, evseupgrade.com, etc.) I did mention to him that if you just try replacing the plug on the stock L1 EVSE and feeding into it 240 volts, you will blow it. He didn't know and was actually thinking of that and also added mention of his mentioned dryer outlet.

When at home, he currently charges at 120 volts.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium (lease over)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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DNAinaGoodWay
Posts: 2768
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am
Delivery Date: 03 Dec 2012
Leaf Number: 23156
Location: Central Massachusetts

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:41 am

I met a guy, while charging at a dealer, who had a '12 for a year and a 70 mile commute and was pissed off that he had to find a station in winter, but had never heard of Plugshare. Weird.

I can understand ICE drivers being clueless, but a BEV driver? But I think Nissan has designed the car to be usable by the average clueless driver, they just won't get the same level of usage out of it that a more informed driver will. At best. At worst, they'll create horror stories that will impune EVs.

The vast majority don't associate driving with thinking. They get in and go.
'12 SL last reading @ 2 yr, 22k, 260 GIDs, 62.35 Ahr

'15 SV w/QC, Mfd 5/14, Leased 8/14, 292 GIDs, 64.38 Ahr when new
@ 36 months, 34k, 270 GID, 57.49 Ahr

'17 Bolt LT



6.72 kW Array

cgaydos
Posts: 650
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:36 pm
Delivery Date: 21 Nov 2012
Leaf Number: 009493025635
Location: Monument, Colorado

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:04 am

I check the Nissan LEAF Facebook page from time to time and there are frequently posts from owners - sometimes multi-year owners - who know little about the car. I usually reply linking to this site.

What this suggests is that Nissan should find some way to let new LEAFers know there is a lot of info available if/when they need it. I totally understand not wanting to gum up a sale by introducing all kinds of info about warnings and best practices - and usually people don't want to get into that detail when they are just starting. But maybe just let them know that there are user's groups that are ready to help when needed ....
Red Leaf: 2012 SL, lease, acquired 21 November 2012
Blue Leaf: 2011 SL, purchase (new, was dealer demo), acquired 4 March 2013

pkulak
Posts: 758
Joined: Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:08 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Sep 2013
Location: Portland, OR

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:47 am

I met a lady at a charger last winter who was telling me how her battery capacity went way down in the winter. She was saying how she could charge to 100 in the summer, but only to 70 or 80 in the winter. I was super confused until I realized she thought the GOM was the battery charge.

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GIBBER
Posts: 136
Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 8:50 am
Delivery Date: 08 Sep 2013
Leaf Number: 409884
Location: Orange County, California

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:40 pm

The meetings mentioned here and those to follow are all perfect examples of poor dealership training, follow thru and follow up. When a person comes to the EV world for the very first time those three things are critical to ensure a positive ownership experience.
"You must unlearn what you have learned" -Yoda
200 Km Club

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TomT
Posts: 10650
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Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:19 pm

One I just ran across ran in the current issue of QST magazine, an Amateur Radio magazine published by the American Radio Relay League. In it, the author, who owns a Leaf,
talks about how a 100 watt HF radio will drain the Leaf quickly and you might wind up by the side of the road out of juice... You would think that someone knowledgeable of radio would know better... I wrote a letter to the editor and set them straight...
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Tesla Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
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Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:32 pm

Most people learn about their cars from the dealership. Enough said? I see little point in making fun of people who are trying to do good without becoming expert in the field first. I agree that the owner's manual should be read, but when said manual surpasses 400 pages I don't really blame them for not doing so. A "quick start guide" is in order.

We now return you to the crowing, bashing, and acronym-dropping. ;-(
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Seeley
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2014 7:40 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Mar 2014
Location: marietta, georgia

Re: encounters w/other Leafers w/surprising lack of knowledg

Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:59 pm

I disagree, somewhat....
It's up to the person who buys or leases the car to find this forum, plugshare, and to learn about the fairly useless things that people like to talk about (gids, gom, etc).

No, "gids" aren't useless, but to the person who is going to be the 'next generation' of EV users, they aren't important. I'm speaking of the 99+% of the people who aren't driving EV yet. They don't care about how a car works, just that it will get them to work every day. Right now, they don't care what kind of oil is in their car, how to change the brake pads, and other stuff that 'car guys' think is obvious. Color of the car, and how to open the hatch to the plug receptacle is all the most people will care about when the EV car becomes a normal mode of transport. Kinda like it is for regular cars right now.....oops, ICE cars for those in the know... :D

I'd be a good example of what future owners will be like, I think...

My neighbor leased one about six months ago. I saw it in her driveway a few times. One night my wife mentioned she was contacted by a dealership through her work with VPP (whatever that is) leasing rates. We figured out that with the Georgia rebate, we'd be out only about $1500 over the two years, money easily made up with my current $100+ a week diesel commute. We decided to look at one the next day.

We went to the dealership the next afternoon. We met the Leaf salesman, first question I had was what I thought would be a deal breaker. Can I put my mountain bike in it? That answer was 'yes', wasn't easy, but it was possible. His first question was "what color would you like?". "Blue, is there a more blue color than that on (Ocean Blue)?" "No". "Okay, let's do some paperwork".

That was it... I didn't know about this forum, plugshare, gids, gom, or the differences between the chargers other than it came with a 110v charger and I could use the quickcharger at the dealership for free when the gate was open.

Some days I use the car for a 16 mile round trip commute. The other days it's a 38 mile commute when I include a stop at the mtb trails on the way home.

I charge off a 110V outlet at work, don't care if it takes all day, or if it sits at 100% on the charger for four hours. To make getting the bike inside the car easier, I removed the rear seat backs and cushion.

While I love the car, it's just an appliance to get me to work and the trails. Even if I charged at home, I wouldn't spend money on a commercial charger or an upgraded ESVE, it's a two year lease.

Other than not bothering to install a 220V charger at home, this is the kind of customer Nissan and every other major vehicle manufacturer wants. When the EV car becomes common, these are the kind of people you'll be dealing with daily.

All that said, you guys are doing a great job of helping out the new owners... just be patient, and prepare to be more patient...

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