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Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:54 pm
by IssacZachary
LeftieBiker wrote: You are mistaken. The PIP uses a lithium pack: that is a major reason why it gets great MPG when not charged, despite the extra weight. The pack accepts regen charge faster than the NiMH packs. It's in the documentation. The Prius Eco also uses a (small) lithium pack.
That's good to know! I will check into if getting a used PIP would be possible for me.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:09 am
by LeftieBiker
Just remember: no heated steering wheel, and NO ELECTRIC HEAT AT ALL. I don't drive ours in Winter. The A/C is electric in all of them, so you do have that in the (short ~10 mile range) EV mode, and can start it from the key fob. The PIP is best at getting amazing MPG in Hybrid mode, and it's also good for hauling things, with no liftover barrier in the rear.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:28 am
by IssacZachary
LeftieBiker wrote:Just remember: no heated steering wheel, and NO ELECTRIC HEAT AT ALL. I don't drive ours in Winter. The A/C is electric in all of them, so you do have that in the (short ~10 mile range) EV mode, and can start it from the key fob. The PIP is best at getting amazing MPG in Hybrid mode, and it's also good for hauling things, with no liftover barrier in the rear.
My theory is that a PIP or Prime would work better for us for our mountains. There are decents with as much as a 2,000 or perhaps 3,000ft change. So if I had a way to assorb some of that energy and use it to go up the next hill, that should really help with fuel mileage.

I noticed that the Leaf was good at that. Every mountain we went down the SOC would go up. On the highway, I view the non-plug-in Prii like regular ICE vehicles. The hybrid system won't really be of much use. And I drive mostly on the highway, about 125 miles highway and 10 to 25 miles city. For that reason I have thought about getting just a regular non-hybrid. But oddly the Prii seem to get better fuel mileage even on the highway than anything else, except maybe a diesel Cruze. But the Cruze isn't nearly as reliable as a Prius, according to Consumer Reports. Then there's the Mitsubishi Mirage, Honda Fit, Toyota Yaris, etc., which still don't get as good of fuel mileage on the highway as a Prius. But we've decided we want a family sized car like our Leaf. So we have decided to stop looking at Prius C's and stick with the normal sized Prius lineup.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:13 pm
by LeftieBiker
Then a PIP might work. Even if you fully charged it, using Eco mode would drain the charge pretty quickly, leave room in the pack for that regen energy. I assume that you understand that regen is only about ~35% efficient, and are talking about improving over the "total loss" scenario with most cars.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 2:29 pm
by IssacZachary
LeftieBiker wrote:Then a PIP might work. Even if you fully charged it, using Eco mode would drain the charge pretty quickly, leave room in the pack for that regen energy. I assume that you understand that regen is only about ~35% efficient, and are talking about improving over the "total loss" scenario with most cars.
Yes, I know regen isn't at all efficient. It is better than nothing though. And the hybrid systems seem to lend themselves to allowing for a more efficient engine than in a tradicional ICE car. Too bad the Volt doesn't have a very efficient ICE. The BMW i3REX seems like a great concept, but companies like Toyota don't believe in that concept yet.

I've often pondered trading the hybrid batteries for super capacitors in a Prius, or developing a small +70% efficient hydraulic hybrid system for a car. However, that all would be way too expensive to do. But I can dream, can't I?

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:59 pm
by jjeff
IssacZachary wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:Just remember: no heated steering wheel, and NO ELECTRIC HEAT AT ALL. I don't drive ours in Winter. The A/C is electric in all of them, so you do have that in the (short ~10 mile range) EV mode, and can start it from the key fob. The PIP is best at getting amazing MPG in Hybrid mode, and it's also good for hauling things, with no liftover barrier in the rear.
My theory is that a PIP or Prime would work better for us for our mountains. There are decents with as much as a 2,000 or perhaps 3,000ft change. So if I had a way to assorb some of that energy and use it to go up the next hill, that should really help with fuel mileage.

I noticed that the Leaf was good at that. Every mountain we went down the SOC would go up. On the highway, I view the non-plug-in Prii like regular ICE vehicles. The hybrid system won't really be of much use. And I drive mostly on the highway, about 125 miles highway and 10 to 25 miles city. For that reason I have thought about getting just a regular non-hybrid. But oddly the Prii seem to get better fuel mileage even on the highway than anything else, except maybe a diesel Cruze. But the Cruze isn't nearly as reliable as a Prius, according to Consumer Reports. Then there's the Mitsubishi Mirage, Honda Fit, Toyota Yaris, etc., which still don't get as good of fuel mileage on the highway as a Prius. But we've decided we want a family sized car like our Leaf. So we have decided to stop looking at Prius C's and stick with the normal sized Prius lineup.
The regular Prius would be almost worthless in mountains, even around here with large hills the battery is basically depleted before the top of the hill(running the ICE the whole time) and charges fully before the bottom of the hill, resulting in an annoying revving of the engine to help slow the car down. Still the Prius is a great road vehicle, we got 50MPH on our last trip to FL and that was with many times doing 70mph up to 80 when we had to.
Personally I wouldn't trust the Cruze diesel, the Mitsui Mirage is really a tin can(I seriously looked at one, it made my Geo Metro look like a Buick!) and the Prius C is just too small with a negligible increase in fuel economy. I agree about the Volt which again I seriously looked at, too poor hwy MPG and WAY!! to cramped. The newer Volts were a bit better on both accounts but still nothing like our Prius.
No in our situation if I only wanted one car it would be the Prime, great ICE MPG and decent electric range for short trips. I also like the idea of the heat pump heater in the Prime, very unique for a PHEV. If I were much smaller and didn't care about getting 50mpg on the highway the newer Volt might be worth thinking about but I'm pretty sure no heat pump although I believe it does have an electric heater, although I'm not sure about the newer ones but the older ones you had to trick the ICE to not start when the temps get cold.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:22 pm
by SageBrush
jjeff wrote: The regular Prius would be almost worthless in mountains
They worked just fine for me for the ~ 15 years I owned them, but it does help to know how to operate them for best performance.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:21 pm
by IssacZachary
I know this may sound schizophrenic, but now I'm looking at used Toyota Avalon Hybrids.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:22 am
by LeftieBiker
IssacZachary wrote:I know this may sound schizophrenic, but now I'm looking at used Toyota Avalon Hybrids.
Probably more power (?), worse fuel economy.

Re: I have a Leaf, so now what?

Posted: Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:59 am
by 2k1Toaster
Also doesn't the Avalon have that stupid pass through to the trunk that's good for a pair of skis and nothing else? Rear seats don't even make an effort to fold down. That would be a deal breaker for me. Completely unusable.