powersurge
Posts: 1576
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:24 am
Delivery Date: 06 Dec 2014
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:31 pm

I don't see why people are investing so much time, $$$, and possible damage to an expensive car just to play with powering some home appliances.

You want to power your house, do it right. Want to power some lights, get an $89 Harbor Freight generator. Want to power the house, get a 7000 to 10,000 watt gas generator and install a power switch into your house... Quick, easy, safe, and ready to use at a moment's notice when you need it.

All that junk that you may get for the Leaf is a waste of money if you never use it, and a serious investment because it has only one use. You can keep, move or sell a regular powerful gas generator in a day if you ever sell the car.

cwerdna
Posts: 9988
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:04 pm

powersurge wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:31 pm
I don't see why people are investing so much time, $$$, and possible damage to an expensive car just to play with powering some home appliances.

You want to power your house, do it right. Want to power some lights, get an $89 Harbor Freight generator. Want to power the house, get a 7000 to 10,000 watt gas generator and install a power switch into your house... Quick, easy, safe, and ready to use at a moment's notice when you need it.

All that junk that you may get for the Leaf is a waste of money if you never use it, and a serious investment because it has only one use. You can keep, move or sell a regular powerful gas generator in a day if you ever sell the car.
What $89 generator are you talking about? The cheapest one I see is $125 at https://www.harborfreight.com/engines-g ... =price-low and it'd be a horrific polluter being a 2 cycle engine.

Long ago before I got an inverter to use with my Bolt, I looked into stuff like a $500 https://www.harborfreight.com/engines-g ... 62523.html. But then I looked into the manual for the prep if you don't use for 20+ days on page 17 of https://manuals.harborfreight.com/manua ... /62523.pdf and stuff like "NOTiCE: During extended storage periods the Engine must be started every 3months and allowed to run for 15 – 20minutes or the Warranty is VOID." And, it only has a 90 day warranty. :roll: Do I really want to spend $500 on something w/that short a warranty from a company that sells somewhat sketchy products as it is?

It's also over 50 lbs, so I'd likely need help in getting it home and back out of my car.

I have to worry about gasoline going bad and safely transporting and storing enough of it for a multi-day outage. The manual alludes to 12 hours of runtime (1 gallon of gasoline) at 25% load. I don't even have any gasoline powered cars at home. And, fuel consumption is kinda high. I'd need to worry about maintenance on page 13. I have to run it outside. I intend to (and did run) my NVR security camera system the whole time when I'm at home, including while sleeping. I also intended to run my fridge and I did so) This was all using my Bolt w/a Samlex pure sine wave inverter w/the car parked in my garage.

A generator MUST be outside unless I want to be poisoned by CO. But, since it's outside and is noisy, it might be stolen in the event of https://www.pge.com/psps/. Both times I lost power (which could be days long outages), my ENTIRE neighborhood was out. In the 2nd PSPS that happened at end of last month, my power went out on a Saturday night and didn't return until Monday 7 pm (https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=571661#p571661). We've been told to prepare for multi-day outages as the high fire risk event must pass, the lines must be inspected and any damage repaired before they're re-energized.

People on Priuschat have used inverters with their Prius for ages and the fuel consumption isn't bad but the car must be outside due to CO emissions.

I don't own the house I live in and it's likely I'll need to move within a year or two. I anticipated needing to move a few years ago into an apartment but that hasn't happened (long story).

There are probably more reasons for my case but I won't be able to elaborate on them until later tonight.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:15 pm

I've gone the gen route, and even with a 7kw NG generator and a generator port on the house it's a huge PITA. I recently installed a quasi-UPS circuit in my house, using 2 100AH batteries and an inverter, just to be able to run the fridge, freezer and some lights for a few hours in a short term outage before having to get the gen out. I have come to the position, though, that if you want to use your EV for home backup power, you should get a 100-200AH buffer battery, connect the inverter to that, and just use the EV to keep the buffer charged. That offers more protection for the EV, with virtually no hardware installed on the car. All you need to connect is a set of super heavy duty jumper cables.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

cwerdna
Posts: 9988
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Mon Nov 18, 2019 4:08 pm

For PG&E PSPS, we may not get that much notice and it's been a moving target as to when the power goes out and we don't have a good ETA as to when the power will come back. For the 1st one I was hit by, I knew maybe a week ahead of time that I might be affected (but that wasn't certain) but the outage time kept changing.

The notices have generic stuff like
In most cases, we would expect to be able to restore power within 24 to 48 hours after weather has passed
Depending on weather conditions or if any repairs are needed, outages (weather event plus restoration time) could last longer than 48 hours
For planning purposes, we suggest preparing for multiple-day outages
And, usually that means be prepared for 3 to 5 day outages.

During the 2nd one (went out for my Saturday night), there was news buzzing that there might be a 2nd PSPS and thus power might not even be restored before a 2nd outage on Tuesday (for some unknown regions). Or, that you might have power for a few hours and then no power on Tuesday. Luckily, I wasn't hit again and I was in Japan by then.

Just over this past weekend, PG&E tweeted and the news reported there might be another outage but only affecting the the North Bay this time (won't affect me). https://twitter.com/PGE4Me/status/1196522440475762694 and https://www.pgecurrents.com/2019/11/18/ ... ay-nov-20/ indicate I'm not in an affected county yet https://www.pge.com/en_US/safety/emerge ... r-map.page shows PSPS watch for zones 2 thru 5. I'm in zone 3 yet PG&E's tool currently shows my address won't be affected.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

alozzy
Posts: 1422
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:35 pm

evtifosi wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:36 pm
I completed this project on Saturday - just in time for a possible PSPS by PG&E Wednesday... :shock:

The only thing I did differently than the original post I found (the one I posted the the link to earlier), is that I used a Red connector since I was able to get that one quickly, versus using a Yellow (12V) connector...

Since I will be the only one using this I don't see much of an issue, and I will remove it from the car when it is sold.

Here is a quick photo showing the wiring to the battery.


Image
I hooked it up to a power strip that has a treadmill, a wine cooler, mini under-counter fridge, and some various battery chargers attached to it as a test - everything powered without issues...
This looks like a perfect setup, can you share your sources for the shopping list?
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

evtifosi
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2015 8:15 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Sep 2015
Location: Monterey Bay/Central Coast, CA

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:44 am

alozzy wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:35 pm
This looks like a perfect setup, can you share your sources for the shopping list?
Here is what I purchased for this Mod for my 2015 LEAF.

1. a Xantrex pure sine wave 1000w (2000w surge) inverter - $265
amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002I ... UTF8&psc=1
2. some #2 AWG flexible red & black copper wire - $29
amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B017G ... UTF8&psc=1
3. some #2 AWG 3/8" copper battery eyelets with heat shrink - $13
amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SF ... UTF8&psc=1
3. a RED connector with "2-4" AWG pins - $17
amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0129 ... UTF8&psc=1
4. a inline 150 amp fuse - $13
amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N9 ... UTF8&psc=1
5. a 6" long 2" x 1/4" piece of aluminum bar stock I had on hand
6. Some misc screws
7. the only additional tool I needed to order was a hydraulic crimper (I found a cheap one on eBay for $30).
Last edited by evtifosi on Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2015 SV Leaf - 1 bar lost as of 1/2019

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:56 pm

That's supposed to be "2000 watt surge" I assume?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

alozzy
Posts: 1422
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: Using Leaf as emergency power backup - electrical question

Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:09 pm

@evtifosi Thanks, much appreciated!
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

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