SageBrush
Posts: 4717
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 12:27 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:but worst case seems to be a 'super 24kwh' pack with reserve capacity that gets used as it degrades.
That is a guess on your part. If true then the range will be that of a 30 kWh battery even if the range meter only accounts for the first 24 kWh.

Seems easy enough to check. It would also be easy to use since the actual range would be ~ 1.25x of displayed.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12959
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 6:21 pm

SageBrush wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:but worst case seems to be a 'super 24kwh' pack with reserve capacity that gets used as it degrades.
That is a guess on your part. If true then the range will be that of a 30 kWh battery even if the range meter only accounts for the first 24 kWh.

Seems easy enough to check. It would also be easy to use since the actual range would be ~ 1.25x of displayed.
No, the issue is that the 24kwh BMS won't let the 30kwh pack charge to full voltage. Thus the 'hidden reserve' but no extra range. I'll get a link later.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

SageBrush
Posts: 4717
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 6:46 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
SageBrush wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:but worst case seems to be a 'super 24kwh' pack with reserve capacity that gets used as it degrades.
That is a guess on your part. If true then the range will be that of a 30 kWh battery even if the range meter only accounts for the first 24 kWh.

Seems easy enough to check. It would also be easy to use since the actual range would be ~ 1.25x of displayed.
No, the issue is that the 24kwh BMS won't let the 30kwh pack charge to full voltage. Thus the 'hidden reserve' but no extra range. I'll get a link later.
That is interesting; it sounds to me like an Ahr restriction.

So then it could be viewed as a battery reserve. That is very nice, and quite useful to someone like me who is happy with a 24 kWh range that lasts more years. I would love to be able to change my view of my LEAF as a disposable car. Of course getting a replacement battery to NM and installed is a money and logistics question but that is my problem and not LEAF specific.

:: fingers crossed ::
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Lothsahn
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 6:50 pm

Leftie,

I think you may be right. bkvszomorito says he swapped a 30kwh pack into a 24kwh car by replacing the battery and VCM. This may need Nissan to reprogram the intelligent key.

bkvszomorito mentioned it required a car built 3/2013 or later. He didn't say anything about a reserve or only getting 24kWh capacity, however.

He did have such a reserve issue when putting 40kWh cells with a 30 kWh BMS. That only happened once and he's still testing. On charging, it only put 30kWh in and stopped.

SageBrush
Posts: 4717
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 7:31 pm

Lothsahn wrote:Leftie,

I think you may be right. bkvszomorito says he swapped a 30kwh pack into a 24kwh car by replacing the battery and VCM. This may need Nissan to reprogram the intelligent key.
What is the VCM ? Did he have to open the packs and swap this component ?
Regarding programming, do you mean as an alternative to swapping ?
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12959
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Wed May 01, 2019 8:58 pm

SageBrush wrote:
Lothsahn wrote:Leftie,

I think you may be right. bkvszomorito says he swapped a 30kwh pack into a 24kwh car by replacing the battery and VCM. This may need Nissan to reprogram the intelligent key.
What is the VCM ? Did he have to open the packs and swap this component ?
Regarding programming, do you mean as an alternative to swapping ?
The VCM is the onboard charging control module. It also controls other drivetrain components. This is the topic (Thanks for the name of the guy, Lothsahn!) in question. It starts off as speculation, but eventually gets real:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=27600
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

SageBrush
Posts: 4717
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Thu May 02, 2019 1:45 am

^^ I am not clear what he did or how he did it.
It sounds like his car is a 30 kWh model that now has cell modules from a 40 kWh model but past that I am confused.

There is mention in the thread of using modules from a 30 kWh pack in a 24 kWh model but I cannot find details of how this was done.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Thu May 02, 2019 2:08 am

Both the 30kwh and 40kwh packs use modules that are physically different from any of the 24kwh packs, so once you figure out how to install the modules and connect them to a CANBUS adapter and the car's high voltage cables, they don't differ that much from each other. The only setup so far that provides 40kwh of usable capacity to a formerly 24kwh Leaf is one that uses ALL of the battery-related electronics from the 40kwh car. That's my understanding, anyway. People have been using 30kwh modules in Vectrix VX-1 motorcycle/scooter conversions for a couple of years now, but that's much easier because they use fewer modules to produce the 146 or so volts a VX-1 needs, and they often use no BMS at all, except the one in the bike's charger.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

cwerdna
Posts: 9655
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Thu May 02, 2019 2:45 am

LeftieBiker wrote: The VCM is the onboard charging control module. It also controls other drivetrain components. This is the topic (Thanks for the name of the guy, Lothsahn!) in question. It starts off as speculation, but eventually gets real:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=27600
FWIW, the OP of that thread didn't refer to the VCM, used the wrong units and hasn't been back since Jan 20, 2019.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

LeftieBiker
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

Thu May 02, 2019 3:03 am

cwerdna wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote: The VCM is the onboard charging control module. It also controls other drivetrain components. This is the topic (Thanks for the name of the guy, Lothsahn!) in question. It starts off as speculation, but eventually gets real:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=27600
FWIW, the OP of that thread didn't refer to the VCM, used the wrong units and hasn't been back since Jan 20, 2019.
http://www.google.com/search?client=fir ... n+leaf+VCM
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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