SageBrush
Posts: 4745
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Thu May 23, 2019 6:12 pm

Oilpan4 wrote:Have these guys actually built anything yet?

Cause late 2019 isn't enough time to build such a battery. Unless say you're tesla
Your description barely scratches the surface of the difficulties involved.

There is a start-up in the NL getting ready to offer battery **additions** without a TMS.
That is a much more reasonable approach because it circumvents the entire BMS/TMS/VCM/etc problem.
And by the way: his upgrade is only offered for installation at his shop. Obviously

Compared to Fenix, Nissan also has unlimited funds and engineering talent yet they cannot figure out how to add a TMS at a price consumers will buy despite having everything at their fingertips. But Fenix has ? And they are going to reverse-engineer the entire LEAF software matrix along the way ?

Uh-huh
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 765
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 9:22 am

We know nissan can do it they just chose not to.
Locking down the battery was more important to them than making it long term user friendly.

Our friends in NL are so close to to launching their big products.

If I'm going to go through the trouble of dropping the battery it's getting an improved tms. Considering that some some stick on battery warmers that are manually plugged into 120v, some 2 inch water tight conduit for ducting with a fan to open loop circulate some air through the batt and a coating of a+b foam as a vast improvement over effectively nothing.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14106
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 9:26 am

SageBrush wrote:
Oilpan4 wrote:Have these guys actually built anything yet?

Cause late 2019 isn't enough time to build such a battery. Unless say you're tesla
Your description barely scratches the surface of the difficulties involved.

There is a start-up in the NL getting ready to offer battery **additions** without a TMS.
That is a much more reasonable approach because it circumvents the entire BMS/TMS/VCM/etc problem.
And by the way: his upgrade is only offered for installation at his shop. Obviously

Compared to Fenix, Nissan also has unlimited funds and engineering talent yet they cannot figure out how to add a TMS at a price consumers will buy despite having everything at their fingertips. But Fenix has ? And they are going to reverse-engineer the entire LEAF software matrix along the way ?

Uh-huh
You seriously think Engineers make the decisions?

OMG!! :lol:
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 15,000 miles, 478 GIDs, 37.0 kwh 109.81 Ahr , SOH 94.61, Hx 120.15
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 765
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 9:35 am

I know engineers they like to over build everything if it was up to them and don't watch the bottom line like it's coming out of their personal checking account.
The problem is a lot of the guys at the top started off as bean counters and that's all they know.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

goldbrick
Posts: 572
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 10:39 am

Oilpan4 wrote:We know nissan can do it they just chose not to.
Oilpan4 wrote:I know engineers they like to over build everything if it was up to them.
Nissan's strategy seems to be analogous to the Porsche designed air-cooled ICE engines. KISS. Even if it doesn't work everywhere it is simple, cheap and in the right application (ie climate) it is great solution. Personally, I hope they figure out how to make their batteries last 'long enough' without a TMS. I'd rather have a simpler car even if it it can't charge at 100kW.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14106
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2018
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 11:37 am

Oilpan4 wrote:I know engineers they like to over build everything if it was up to them and don't watch the bottom line like it's coming out of their personal checking account.
The problem is a lot of the guys at the top started off as bean counters and that's all they know.
You nailed it.

What is THE biggest reason Tesla has done as well as it has?

Its CEO was an engineer.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 15,000 miles, 478 GIDs, 37.0 kwh 109.81 Ahr , SOH 94.61, Hx 120.15
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 765
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 12:04 pm

goldbrick wrote:
Oilpan4 wrote:We know nissan can do it they just chose not to.
Oilpan4 wrote:I know engineers they like to over build everything if it was up to them.
Nissan's strategy seems to be analogous to the Porsche designed air-cooled ICE engines. KISS. Even if it doesn't work everywhere it is simple, cheap and in the right application (ie climate) it is great solution. Personally, I hope they figure out how to make their batteries last 'long enough' without a TMS. I'd rather have a simpler car even if it it can't charge at 100kW.
I think 50kw charging is plenty unless the vehicle is being used for road trips.
For cooling a fan and some ducting that circulates some outside air through the battery would be a huge improvement.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 911
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 12:40 pm

I can’t see spending 5k+ unless my replacement battery moves me up from the original 24 to at least 30 if not more total capacity. To restore the 20 miles of lost range in my 2013 isn’t worth more the 2k from a convenience of more range perspective.
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

SageBrush
Posts: 4745
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 2:58 pm

DougWantsALeaf wrote:I can’t see spending 5k+ unless my replacement battery moves me up from the original 24 to at least 30 if not more total capacity. To restore the 20 miles of lost range in my 2013 isn’t worth more the 2k from a convenience of more range perspective.
Wait a couple of years, when you are down 20 more miles.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

WetEV
Posts: 3041
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 8:25 am
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2014
Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: Fenix Power: A new third party battery replacement?

Fri May 24, 2019 3:00 pm

SageBrush wrote:
DougWantsALeaf wrote:I can’t see spending 5k+ unless my replacement battery moves me up from the original 24 to at least 30 if not more total capacity. To restore the 20 miles of lost range in my 2013 isn’t worth more the 2k from a convenience of more range perspective.
Wait a couple of years, when you are down 20 more miles.
Sage's Tesla stock is down. Feel sorry for Sage. All together now... Ahhh ... :lol:
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red
2019 eTron Blue

Return to “General / Main Owners Forum”