radiotron
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:15 pm
Delivery Date: 31 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 319240

2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:28 pm

I have a Question
I have a Leaf S Plus With the radiant heater and winter package heated seats and steering wheel
Why does the mileage Drop from 225 Charged To 190 Miles Thats 35 miles When The Heater is Turned On?
I Had A 2015 Leaf S and the Mileage Same Heater Radiant on that and Dropped 15 Miles when Turned On
I figured they would have done something about that on the plus models
we are having cold weather in the Northeast 25 Degrees during the day 5 degrees at night
Is my question Reasonable i lived with the 2015 for 4 years with Heated seats on and Heated wheel on
What would i expect with a hybrid heater in an SV plus?

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:07 pm

The resistance heaters (aka "PTC" heater) in EVs do draw huge amounts of power, I'm afraid. The range hit is larger in the ePlus S because the overall range is larger, I guess...
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
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PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

GerryAZ
Gold Member
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Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:15 pm

Yes, since the range is much higher with the 62 kWh battery, the estimated range change when climate control is turned on or off is much higher than with the 24 kWh battery in the 2015. I had to get used to seeing changes of 20 miles or more in estimated range even with the heat pump system (either cooling or heating) when traction battery is fully charged. Since the battery capacity is about 2.5 times that of the 2015, the range reduction at full charge when climate control is activated should be about 2.5 times what you saw on the 2015. I rarely saw more than 7 or 8 miles reduction for 2015 and see 20 miles or more under similar conditions for 2019.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL Plus purchased 8/10/2019

radiotron
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:15 pm
Delivery Date: 31 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 319240

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:21 am

What would expect the Hybrid Heater in an SV Plus with winter package when turned on do the the mileage?

danrjones
Posts: 810
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:18 am

radiotron wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:21 am
What would expect the Hybrid Heater in an SV Plus with winter package when turned on do the the mileage?
Assuming the 2019 is the same as the 2018, I have a 2018 SV with weather package. Running the heater dips my range and lowers my efficiency a bit but not nearly as much as running the front defroster. But it also depends on the temperature. What I have noted is that is starts probably with the PTC heater for a minute to get heat into the cabin but then must switch to the heat pump. I have watched the climate control energy draw and it starts fairly high but then quickly bumps down to about the same as the A/C. But on colder mornings, below freezing, that bump down is not as much. So on a cold morning running the heater I might get 3.3 miles per kWh. This morning was not as cold so I got 4 miles per kWh. But if I use the defroster that power draw seems to stay much higher and its not rare to get around 2.5 or so miles per kWh until I turn the defroster off. That same drive without AC or Heat averages around 4.5 miles per kWh.

NOTE that my driving in the morning is very short, so naturally these numbers would bump up on a longer drive once your car was warmed and defrosted. I do not pre-heat either. No need on my short drives.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

LeftieBiker
Moderator
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
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Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:37 pm

radiotron wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:21 am
What would expect the Hybrid Heater in an SV Plus with winter package when turned on do the the mileage?
When temps are in the forties or higher, the energy used for heat will only be about what A/C "costs" in the Summer - a couple of miles of range lost. When temps drop below freezing, the energy used increases noticeably, but is still much less than what resistance-only heat uses. The energy required increases down to about 14F, at which point the heat pump, while still running down to about 7F, isn't helping enough to notice a difference in range.

One important note: when you use front Defrost, both the heat pump and the resistance heater are running at once, the heat pump for A/C and the resistance heater for heat. This negates any advantage from the heat pump.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

radiotron
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:15 pm
Delivery Date: 31 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 319240

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:12 pm

Today
I left the House with 227 miles this morning
i drove 70 miles with heat on and defrost it was about 10 degrees
and used them sparingly on the trip
I drove a total of 70 miles round trip
when i came home i was down to 103 miles 60 percent charge left
Does that make sense? It seems like a lot of power used?

Dickrett
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:46 am
Delivery Date: 22 Jan 2020

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Wed Jan 22, 2020 7:06 am

I have a new Leaf s with the temperatures ranging from 5 to 15 , I drove with a full charge 60 miles and had about 20 remaining that's 2 miles per kilowatt-hour that seems like an awfully large reduction using the heater is this normal?

arnis
Posts: 1027
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:21 pm
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Leaf Number: 015896
Location: Estonia, Europe

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:44 am

One can see heater draw on the screen.
Please observe. If it shows 2kW then using the car for 1 hour equals 2kWh of battery capacity lost.
2 hours equals 4kWh of capacity lost.
Without heat pump sub-freezing temperatures usually require 2-3kW for optimal cabin temperature.
Keep the fan speed below 50% to optimize climate consumption.

Other losses in winter are mostly related to cold battery with strong accelerations.
Keep you accelerations below 40kW.
Short range EVs <30kWh -- Medium range: 30-60kWh -- Long range: >60kWh
Charging: Trickle <3kW -- Normal 3-22kW -- Fast 50-100kW -- Supercharging >100kW

danrjones
Posts: 810
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf S Plus Heater

Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:09 am

radiotron wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:12 pm
Today
I left the House with 227 miles this morning
i drove 70 miles with heat on and defrost it was about 10 degrees
and used them sparingly on the trip
I drove a total of 70 miles round trip
when i came home i was down to 103 miles 60 percent charge left
Does that make sense? It seems like a lot of power used?
You did not say what kind of driving you were doing - freeway speeds? Terrain?

I would say that sounds about right. As LeftieBiker said, and I've noted myself, having the defroster on uses a lot more power.
And at freeway speeds I really doubt you would get 227 miles anyway....
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

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