User avatar
jlv
Moderator
Posts: 1438
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2014
Leaf Number: 424487
Location: Massachusetts

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:48 am

Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:16 am
2) WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today
What is the "huge security risk"?
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Tesla X 100D (12/18)
100K 100% BEV miles since '14
ICE free since '18

User avatar
Stanton
Forum Supporter
Posts: 2241
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:56 am
Delivery Date: 01 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7458
Location: Plano, TX
Contact: Website Twitter

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:01 pm

jlv wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:48 am
Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:16 am
2) WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today
What is the "huge security risk"?
Do you want someone hacking into your Leaf?
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
Lithium Pros 12v LiFePO4 battery w/Antigravity Battery Tracker
FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15482
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Thu Oct 15, 2020 4:33 pm

Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:01 pm
jlv wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:48 am
Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:16 am
2) WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today
What is the "huge security risk"?
Do you want someone hacking into your Leaf?
They can already remorely hack into the power steering, traction control, etc. If the car is communicating with an encrypted link at home, with the WiFi off at other times, there isn't a big risk.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

alozzy
Posts: 1601
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Thu Oct 15, 2020 5:39 pm

Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:16 am
alozzy wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:28 pm

Seems really unlikely that Nissan will make available an upgraded TCU on older model LEAFs, especially not an affordable one. Their TCU design is stupid anyways...

They should have used an off the shelf daughter card, like those found in cell phones, and provided a SIM card or the option to use your own SIM. Also, they could easily incorporate Wifi connectivity, so that you can choose to connect to your home Wifi or a cell phone hotspot as an alternative to a dedicated 3g or 4g data plan.
I'm going to stick to the facts, because I'm not sure you understand how the technology works (it's basically IoT/telematics):
1) Their TCU design was good for it's time...and I believe they will offer a 4G upgrade for the Gen 1 Leaf as it will share components/design elements with the Gen 2 Leaf (EVconnect is definitely not going away)
2) WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today
3) Even if the TCU/daughter card was easily accessible (and it's not), there would be no way for Nissan to control/enable service compatibility with a user-supplied SIM card; you can't even do that with a phone (without carrier intervention).
The TCU has always been a step behind with respect to the connectivity. 2G became prevalent in the mid 90s, 3g in 2001/2002, 4g in 2010 or thereabouts.

Why do you think 2g/3g are inherently more secure than Wifi? AES256 encrypted Wifi is pretty secure. They could also use mutual certificate authentication, for even better security

A modular wireless radio card could be easily located in a more accessible location. The current location of the TCU is irrelevant.

Please explain what you mean by this:

"there would be no way for Nissan to control/enable service compatibility with a user-supplied SIM card; you can't even do that with a phone"

The SIM is activated by the cell provider and, once activated, should just work. Why would Nissan need to be involved in that process? If they did OTA updates, then I could see your point - but they don't...
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

User avatar
jlv
Moderator
Posts: 1438
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2014
Leaf Number: 424487
Location: Massachusetts

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:08 am

Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:01 pm
jlv wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:48 am
Stanton wrote:
Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:16 am
2) WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today
What is the "huge security risk"?
Do you want someone hacking into your Leaf?
Again, what is the "huge security risk" of the car communicating over WiFi? Saying someone can "hack into the car" is not saying at all what the security risk is.

The telemetrics using WiFi to access the Internet instead of the 3G radio will not result in someone "hacking into your LEAF".
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Tesla X 100D (12/18)
100K 100% BEV miles since '14
ICE free since '18

User avatar
Stanton
Forum Supporter
Posts: 2241
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:56 am
Delivery Date: 01 Sep 2011
Leaf Number: 7458
Location: Plano, TX
Contact: Website Twitter

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:53 am

I'm not going to get into a debate over the technical aspects of telematics: the fact is, the Leaf will continue to operate over cellular (not WiFi)...which is a very good thing. The service provider SIM card is only half of the equation: if they don't want/have the device authorized to operate on their network...then it doesn't matter what the device manufacturer wants/thinks.
I will continue to monitor this thread for news of a "4G TCU upgrade" for the Leaf.
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
Lithium Pros 12v LiFePO4 battery w/Antigravity Battery Tracker
FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

alozzy
Posts: 1601
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:25 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Jan 2017
Location: Vancouver, BC
Contact: Website

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:29 pm

I'm not going to get into a debate over the technical aspects of telematics: the fact is, the Leaf will continue to operate over cellular (not WiFi)...which is a very good thing
Actually, it's a very annoying, proprietary thing that the whole industry does. As a consumer, I want the flexibility to use my own SIM or Wifi if I choose.

The way things are now (proprietary TCU and zero control over when the car can communicate out), it's just a matter of time before car manufacturers team up with advertisers to track your whereabouts, where you like to shop and eat, and then target you with ads on your car's console.

At least with my own SIM or Wifi, I could disconnect the car at my own discretion.
Vancouver, CA owner of a 2013 Ocean Blue SV + QC, purchased 01/2017 in WA
Zencar 12/20/24/30A L1/L2 portable EVSE
1-1/4" Curt #11396 hitch
After market, DIY LED DRLs
LeafSpy Pro + Konnwei KW902 ELM327 BT OBDII dongle
Loving my first BEV :D

User avatar
jlv
Moderator
Posts: 1438
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2014
Leaf Number: 424487
Location: Massachusetts

Re: When is Nissan Connect Carwings Going away, i.e., 3G

Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:39 pm

Stanton wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:53 am
I'm not going to get into a debate over the technical aspects of telematics
I'm not asking for a debate. You claimed two things ("WiFi connectivity is a huge security risk, which is why they still don't offer that option even today") and I asked you to back it up. And you can't.
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Tesla X 100D (12/18)
100K 100% BEV miles since '14
ICE free since '18

Return to “General / Main Owners Forum”