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Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:16 am
by pointlomadave
Our 2017 Leaf s purchased in March 2017 just hit 22k miles and still no bar loss. No Leaf Spy so can't give numbers. We're located in San Diego a couple blocks from the water so climates are reasonably moderate and car is generally driven with a few miles of the coast where things are cooler. Car is rarely charged to 100% unless we are going to be driving it immed. LOTS of QC. It is my opinion that charging to 100% is more likely the culprit and not QC.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:34 am
by Oils4AsphaultOnly
pointlomadave wrote:Our 2017 Leaf s purchased in March 2017 just hit 22k miles and still no bar loss. No Leaf Spy so can't give numbers. We're located in San Diego a couple blocks from the water so climates are reasonably moderate and car is generally driven with a few miles of the coast where things are cooler. Car is rarely charged to 100% unless we are going to be driving it immed. LOTS of QC. It is my opinion that charging to 100% is more likely the culprit and not QC.
You need to pull the leaf spy stats, because all other info is insufficient in detail to make any kind of conclusion.

I'm also SoCal, and my leaf spy stats are in my signature. I haven't lost any bars either, but the leaf spy stats tell a different story.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:03 am
by SageBrush
pointlomadave wrote: It is my opinion that charging to 100% is more likely the culprit and not QC.
Since your battery may be approaching 20% capacity loss without you knowing, I find your conclusions unfounded.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:33 am
by lorenfb
Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:
pointlomadave wrote:Our 2017 Leaf s purchased in March 2017 just hit 22k miles and still no bar loss. No Leaf Spy so can't give numbers. We're located in San Diego a couple blocks from the water so climates are reasonably moderate and car is generally driven with a few miles of the coast where things are cooler. Car is rarely charged to 100% unless we are going to be driving it immed. LOTS of QC. It is my opinion that charging to 100% is more likely the culprit and not QC.
You need to pull the leaf spy stats, because all other info is insufficient in detail to make any kind of conclusion.

I'm also SoCal, and my leaf spy stats are in my signature. I haven't lost any bars either, but the leaf spy stats tell a different story.
Since you have been helpful in providing the forum data about your 30kWh Leaf and since you indicated your frequent use of QCs,
it would be helpful to supplement the 40kWh data Dave provided on his 2018 Leaf:
If those with a 30kWh Leaf who QC could complement the helpful data provided here; viewtopic.php?f=27&t=25519&start=90#p523924
by Dave's data gathering on his 2018 40kWh Leaf, i.e. internal battery resistance data, by performing the same type of test (about 10-15
seconds at the start of a QC), that would result in having battery data on all the Leaf batteries, 24/30/40 kWhs. If that test results in the
battery resistance of the 30 kWh battery being about the same as both the 24 & 40 kWh batteries ( ~ 50 - 60 mohms), then it could be
implied that the additional prolonged 30 kWh battery heat over time (like the 40 kWh) results from a higher battery thermal resistance
(lower heat conductance) to ambient, e.g. resulting from a higher density battery volume. This would help explain the higher battery
degradation some 30kWh Leaf owners have experienced over the 24 kWh battery, and what some 40 kWh Leaf owners will probably
have to confront over time, which in hindsight necessitated TMS more so as the battery density increased over the 24 kWh battery.
http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f ... 90#p523924
Thanks for your help.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:35 am
by pointlomadave
^^^I understand. Point being I've yet to lose my first capacity bar at 22k miles while others are reporting 3 bar loss. I know the first bar represents 15.5% capacity loss so yeah, I could be close or I may not be. Point being, at least my car is not in the category of high wear rate for the battery.

THis is my 2nd Leaf. 1st one I drove 56k miles. 1 bar lost at 31,500 on that one which was a 2013 with a 4/13 build date.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:19 am
by SageBrush
pointlomadave wrote: I know the first bar represents 15.5% capacity loss .
The first bar has been inflated to ~ 20% in the 30 kWh LEAF

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:24 pm
by Oils4AsphaultOnly
lorenfb wrote:
Since you have been helpful in providing the forum data about your 30kWh Leaf and since you indicated your frequent use of QCs,
it would be helpful to supplement the 40kWh data Dave provided on his 2018 Leaf:
I actually don't QC regularly, but I'll see what I can do about doing one just to get those stats. Might take a few days though.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:00 pm
by lorenfb
Oils4AsphaultOnly wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Since you have been helpful in providing the forum data about your 30kWh Leaf and since you indicated your frequent use of QCs,
it would be helpful to supplement the 40kWh data Dave provided on his 2018 Leaf:
I actually don't QC regularly, but I'll see what I can do about doing one just to get those stats. Might take a few days though.
Thanks.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:35 am
by eatsleafsandshoots
Just got to 20k on my '17 S, no bar loss in the foothills of Denver, CO.

I can do LeafSpy one better - actually driving the car from full to VLBW. When I do that, I'm seeing 8-10% in capacity degradation (used to be able to easily hit the EPA listed mileage, now I'm down to 92-90% of that).

I've QC'd about 30-40 times and charge to 100% regularly.

Re: 2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 6:14 pm
by Phatcat73
Bummer.... down to 90% SOH. 14k. Chicago weather. Seems that even a few summer months are enough to significantly degrade the battery. Glad I leased.

On the bright side I did get my Model 3 invite today... 3-6 week delivery